Rav 4.3 Xenons

[Batsran]

Has anyone upgraded/converted their Rav to xenon bulbs ?

This is xenon proper - not the dodgey cheap bulbs dipped in blue paint and sold on fleabay or Daftfolds.

Since the Rav has projector style headlamps it looks promising, the only downside (other than legality) is that when the lights are off and you flash high beam the xenons would fire up which is less than ideal.

I upgraded my 'other' car by retro fitting OEM xenons and the difference is amazing. There appears to be several kits out there, but would love to hear if anyone has taken the plunge and tried one out.

Many thanks!

[HEMI]

I have HIDS on my car (not Toyota,thats the wifes)I have standard Hids as dip and converted my front fogs and main beam to HIDS,when the main beam is on it burns a hole in the sky,it really is like daylight,much better than xenon bulbs

[anchorman]

We discussed this quite recently. I looked into the feasability of fitting hid kits - the ones with the chokes etc after they started fitting them to our trains. We only use one headlamp on a train and when fitted with hid units this one light is better than 2 normal car halogen bulbs - they are astonishing.

However, on further inspection it seems that the fitting of hid bulbs is completely illegal as the DFT insist they may only be fitted with a purpose made headlight unit, headlight washers and self levelling devices. I guess that is why most manufacturers are charging about £1000 for this option;

http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roadsafety/drs/hidheadlamps

Obviously you see lots of cars that have clearly been modded = virtually every Subaru, Corsa or 206 boy racer special has them but the problem will come if your car ends up at the body shop and you don't have chance to change back to conventional lights before the insurance assessor gets ther because that is when you might find you are uninsured.

For that reason I personally will sit tight for now. I must admit that the legal xenon upgrades that local hero found for me have upped the performance of dipped beam to a very acceptable level and the mains were pretty good anyway.

[local hero]

Hi Batsran, a few on here have upgraded bulbs, the main beams are hb3s + dipped are H11s (NOT H1s) double check your handbook though, this company do both in xenon upgrades http://www.autobulbsdirect.co.uk/ and also Hid kits at reasonable prices + will advise on suitability,, However i have no knowledge of their hid kits so cannot reccomend them, but certainly worth a look.. Stew

[Batsran]

Thanks all.

It is interesting - my suspicion is that most if not all MOT test centers would not even bother to notice if HID was fitted since they do not test the function of self leveling or the washer function. HIDs (like runflats) are normally sold on the safety benefits - the illumination is brighter, and illuminates further and wider due to the type of light. They also are supposed to last the lifetime of the car (Merc owners would probably disagree since I know a lot of those eat through the lamps). The longevity means less likelihood of driving with a failed unit or changing a bulb in the dark. None of this of course escapes the letter of the law, but unless an accident was caused by someone being blinded by poorly fitted xenons I doubt it would become an issue.

The other benefit is increase in performance and fuel economy (the latter being a desperate need for any T180 owner!) due to the significant lower power requirements.

My main concern is whether xenon's generate any additional heat and if so, whether the headlamps can cope. I heard that some factory fitted Renaults had an issue with head distorted headlamps, where the bulbs could then not be removed - but not sure if this was HIDs or not!

[anchorman]

If you read the bumf they run cooler. Like I say, there are 1000,s of them running around and nobody seems to bother them. It's just if "something" happens you may have a problem.

[Manxrav]

Good reply Anchorman, fitting HID,s is not just as simple as one thinks. My opnion is to invest in either Phillips extreme (90%) or Osram nightbreakers (80%) and you will find that these two bulbs are well worth the outlay. On the Isle of Man we have no or very little street lighting and my Dad fitted the Phillips one,s to his car and he was well impressed. The X3 I have has Xenons and they are good but the Phillips bulbs in my Dad,s are a very good alternative and are legal!!!!

Regards Clare

[HEMI]

Hids are only 35watts,so no heat issues and they draw 3 amps,I had to fit a Hid Rectifier for my mains as the body ECU (no relay on my motor)thought my bulbs were on the way out due to not enough amps being drawn so it would flicker them then shut them down.Anchorman you are spot on about the law on Hids but my motor has the right lenses,washes and self levels so I'm ok(thats a first,lol)

[Batsran]

Thanks everyone. Guessing no one has taken the plunge on the Rav 4.3 then.

Did not consider if the rav detects bulb failure with the headlamps. I know my E46 bmw does and after fitting BMW xenons the light control unit had to be reprogrammed since it kept reporting failed bulbs.

I think for the time being I we will live with it and perhaps try upgrading the existing bulbs if need be (which in itself is probably classed as modifying the headlamps!!).

P

[anchorman]

Thanks everyone. Guessing no one has taken the plunge on the Rav 4.3 then.

Did not consider if the rav detects bulb failure with the headlamps. I know my E46 bmw does and after fitting BMW xenons the light control unit had to be reprogrammed since it kept reporting failed bulbs.

I think for the time being I we will live with it and perhaps try upgrading the existing bulbs if need be (which in itself is probably classed as modifying the headlamps!!).

P

There are legal bulb upgrades available so modify away!

The RAV doesn't have bulb failure sensing circuits. I had them on my old company E46 and they were quite good. They send a tiny residual voltage through each circuit to make sure there is continuity. A nifty feature was that if a front side light failed it would mark the corner with the indicator bulb and it would flash off and on rather than on and off when you used the indicator!

[Abs.]

I completely forgot I was a member of this forum, just came on to research a different problem on a yaris! lol

I have had HID's fitted to my Rav4 4.3 for about 1 year now. I didn't realise no one else had them fitted! They are brilliant. I haven't had a single problem with them and the light output is fantastic. I will try and post up a picture of them when it gets darker this evening.

I have fitted them on all my cars over the last 5 years, and due to the size of the engine bay of the Rav4, they were by far the quickest to install. Took around 45 mins to do the whole thing.

[three5]

We discussed this quite recently. I looked into the feasability of fitting hid kits - the ones with the chokes etc after they started fitting them to our trains. We only use one headlamp on a train and when fitted with hid units this one light is better than 2 normal car halogen bulbs - they are astonishing.

However, on further inspection it seems that the fitting of hid bulbs is completely illegal as the DFT insist they may only be fitted with a purpose made headlight unit, headlight washers and self levelling devices. I guess that is why most manufacturers are charging about £1000 for this option;

http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roadsafety/drs/hidheadlamps

Obviously you see lots of cars that have clearly been modded = virtually every Subaru, Corsa or 206 boy racer special has them but the problem will come if your car ends up at the body shop and you don't have chance to change back to conventional lights before the insurance assessor gets ther because that is when you might find you are uninsured.

For that reason I personally will sit tight for now. I must admit that the legal xenon upgrades that local hero found for me have upped the performance of dipped beam to a very acceptable level and the mains were pretty good anyway.

Just back from sunny ( HONEST! ) Shetland and found this topic. It was originally raised in http://toyotaownersclub.com/forums/index.p...c=92362&hl= . I fitted the HID replacement bulbs to the dipped headlamps on my XT5 though they are NOT legal. To be legal they not only have to have the levelling system and washers that HEMI describes but they have to be "E" marked. Try as I might, I couldn't find any, so used the HD4U kit. Longest bit of the job was taking the plastic cover off the top of the radiator. The flying leads on the choke units, which run at 85v, just plug into the existing bulb connectors and the bulbs ( H11 ). The temperature of the plastic lense is considerably LOWER than the standard bulbs.

[HEMI]

in all honesty,who is going to look for an "E" mark on a bulb,the police wont,they wouldnt know where to begin taking a bulb out on 99% of cars so they wont bother

[three5]

in all honesty,who is going to look for an "E" mark on a bulb,the police wont,they wouldnt know where to begin taking a bulb out on 99% of cars so they wont bother

I'm sure that you are right about the police not looking, but surely they would be aware that there are NO after market bulbs available with an E mark so any car not fitted with HID as original equipment must be "illegal".

Don't suppose that the "after market" market is big enough for bulb manufacturers to indulge in much R&D of their own to get a change in the law. Wonderful light from the bulbs though and a cut-off that looks as though it was painted on the road.

[Batsran]

in all honesty,who is going to look for an "E" mark on a bulb,the police wont,they wouldnt know where to begin taking a bulb out on 99% of cars so they wont bother

I'm sure that you are right about the police not looking, but surely they would be aware that there are NO after market bulbs available with an E mark so any car not fitted with HID as original equipment must be "illegal".

Don't suppose that the "after market" market is big enough for bulb manufacturers to indulge in much R&D of their own to get a change in the law. Wonderful light from the bulbs though and a cut-off that looks as though it was painted on the road.

Well TBH if the boys in blue got bored it isn't hard to tell. Anyone with HID headlamps should have self cleaning lamps and opening the hood would reveal the high voltage leads connected to the starter boxes that HID each require. If police have any interest they would no that no boy racer cars aswell as no Toyota RAVs have the option of xenons - BUT as mentioned earlier in the tread the risk is more with picky insurance inspectors or even MOT stations that could spoil the show. I would agree upgrading headlamps with normal reflectors is a bad idea since the beam isn't very precise and will at best annoy other cars and at worse in bad conditions cause accidents - however the rav 4.3's have nice projector units that seem to be ideal for change.

The temptation will only get worse when someone posts a link with a tried and tested kit! On my 'other' car, whose regular headlamps were the best I've seen, doing the OEM upgrade still made a huge improvement. It is more to do with how the quality of the illumination stays so high against normal bulbs where the brightness/colour starts to drop off after a few feet from the car - plus the wider kerb/pavement throw of the light. The DoT site clearly shows their distaste for HIDs, I guess at somepoint they will embrace the new technology, rather than suggesting the UK only has these on the roads through some euro loophole!

Perhaps after I've fitted the tow bar, managed to wire the 13pin toyota kit - upgraded the horn and bought a Caravan the xenons will be next on the list!

Thanks once again everyone for the interest and views on this topic.

[three5]

in all honesty,who is going to look for an "E" mark on a bulb,the police wont,they wouldnt know where to begin taking a bulb out on 99% of cars so they wont bother

I'm sure that you are right about the police not looking, but surely they would be aware that there are NO after market bulbs available with an E mark so any car not fitted with HID as original equipment must be "illegal".

Don't suppose that the "after market" market is big enough for bulb manufacturers to indulge in much R&D of their own to get a change in the law. Wonderful light from the bulbs though and a cut-off that looks as though it was painted on the road.

Well TBH if the boys in blue got bored it isn't hard to tell. Anyone with HID headlamps should have self cleaning lamps and opening the hood would reveal the high voltage leads connected to the starter boxes that HID each require. If police have any interest they would no that no boy racer cars aswell as no Toyota RAVs have the option of xenons - BUT as mentioned earlier in the tread the risk is more with picky insurance inspectors or even MOT stations that could spoil the show. I would agree upgrading headlamps with normal reflectors is a bad idea since the beam isn't very precise and will at best annoy other cars and at worse in bad conditions cause accidents - however the rav 4.3's have nice projector units that seem to be ideal for change.

The temptation will only get worse when someone posts a link with a tried and tested kit! On my 'other' car, whose regular headlamps were the best I've seen, doing the OEM upgrade still made a huge improvement. It is more to do with how the quality of the illumination stays so high against normal bulbs where the brightness/colour starts to drop off after a few feet from the car - plus the wider kerb/pavement throw of the light. The DoT site clearly shows their distaste for HIDs, I guess at somepoint they will embrace the new technology, rather than suggesting the UK only has these on the roads through some euro loophole!

Perhaps after I've fitted the tow bar, managed to wire the 13pin toyota kit - upgraded the horn and bought a Caravan the xenons will be next on the list!

Thanks once again everyone for the interest and views on this topic.

As previously stated, I've got a HID kit fitted and I'm working on the "Self Cleaning" bit - will post results when I have a solution!

[HEMI]

Batsran,you mentioned the MOT testers may spoil the show..how?,as a tester,there is nothing(yet) mentioned about HIDS in the test,as long as the pattern is correct and is not adversley affected by another item it is a pass,so it wont be a problem as far as the MOT test is concerned.My "other car" as mentioned has HID full beam and spots too(HID dip is factory fitment) and they're not mentioned in the test procedure too

[Batsran]

Batsran,you mentioned the MOT testers may spoil the show..how?,as a tester,there is nothing(yet) mentioned about HIDS in the test,as long as the pattern is correct and is not adversley affected by another item it is a pass,so it wont be a problem as far as the MOT test is concerned.My "other car" as mentioned has HID full beam and spots too(HID dip is factory fitment) and they're not mentioned in the test procedure too

Hi Hemi, this wasn't a jibe at MOT testers - I'm supprised that its not included, but would not be shocked if it became part of the test. Good to know.

This bit of news can only push further towards the reasons for doing the mod.

I am now starting to wonder whether there is a legal issue here after all. When all said and done we are only talking about modifying the bulbs. Now as major a manufacturer I can understand the strict requirements for leveling, cleaning and E marking *BUT* often smaller companies are excluded from lots of DoT restrictions. Airbags, ABS and even CO2 emmissions are not checked on some small producers of brand new cars, so in the same way I wonder if replacing the lamp for better technology (the kits are now offering E marked kits) where the harm is. If an insurance company and the DoT do not mind using differing bulbs from OEM that all promise brighter (and sometimes bluer?) beams then how come HID bulbs change the state of play?

Perhaps if it was possible to buy a complete HID lamp including projector/beam pattern and bulb then I could understand retro fitting those lamps as iffy - BUT swapping out the bulb in an already approved lamp assembly should not change anything. Lets be honest here, all we want is better safer illumination - and providing they are kept aligned and clean where is the harm.

I am wondering if there has been any instances in the UK of either DoT/police involvement or insurance company actually having a problem with these upgrades? You would have though the GTi boy racers with the headlamps pointed to the stars and normal reflectors who seem to think they are daytime running lights would have caught some attention by now. Off to google.... don't hold your breath.

[HEMI]

I wasnt suggesting it was a jibe at testers,I thought that you may have had a run in with a tester in which he would have been in the wrong.I totally agree with you about upgrading the bulbs,it certainly helps at night being safer(as long as they are set correctly)and they dont half make a difference