Rav4 Extended Warranty Not Worth The Paper Its Printed On?

[PeteDean]

Hello everybody,

Fairly new to this forum, and have been more of a reader than a poster to date, so a huge hello to everybody before I begin my tale of woe

The background to this post begins in June this year when I was offered an Extended Warranty from Toyota on my '06 plate XT5 2.2 D4D Rav4. I didn't really think twice about it at the time having had many Manufacturers warranties previously and found them all reasonably value over the years so the two year premium for £805 seemed a good deal to us.

I accepted the warranty over the phone on the Friday evening and took out a 20 month payment plan. Our Rav4 was due for its service at the local dealers on following Saturday morning, so we took it along and subsequently returned several hours later to collect it. We only ever have the car serviced at Toyota.

Apart from the routine items carried out the servicing technicians report came back with "new AC compressor needed - £972 and new steering column assembly needed - £350"

I was shocked. We had paid £27k for our Rav4 in Jun 06 and for a car just 3 years old having covered 50k miles these are not the sort of problems you expect to go wrong. After some research on the net and worryingly it transpires that we are not alone on the steering fault. Toyota issued a Service Bulletin in October 08 that acknowledges the steering fault as a design flaw applicable to Rav4 models on 06-08 plates. Admittedly from about 10 months ownership I had known about the slight knock on the steering as when applying a full lock on parking up there was always a slight knock or judder consistent with a worn u-joint or something but it was so small it was hardly noticeable.

I mentioned the Technical Service Bulletin to the dealer and pointed out that my Rav4 should have had this matter rectified during its 40k service carried out in Dec 08 as there was a Toyota SB published in October 2008.

"Did I bring it up at the time I was asked?"

"Should I have had to I replied? The matter was covered by a Service Bulletin published by Toyota and do you not look for these faults?"

No joy from the dealer on that one who pleaded ignorance.

So I presented my Extended Warranty details and we go this route. Two days later the dealer phones me to say that Toyota's Extended Warranty underwriters were sending out an Assessor due to the cost of the claim.

A further two days later the dealer phones to say that the Toyota Warranty Assessor had been out to inspect the vehicle and had concluded that both faults e.g. the steering column and AC compressor are valid faults and these are parts that are covered by the warranty.

Excellent I thought…

However, the dealership carried on.. "Toyota are only prepared to instruct the steering shaft repairs under the Extended Warranty and not the AC Compressor on the grounds that whilst the AC compressor is faulty in terms of making a loud rattling noise consistent with an impending failure, it has not technically failed and therefore is not eligible for repair under the warranty at the present time".

The dealer immediately suggested that he disagreed with Toyotas approach with regards to the replacement of the AC compressor under the extended warranty and has advised me to go back and have a go at them because he was also advised by the assessor that they don't particularly want to pay out on the AC Compressor fault because of the cost of the repair.

I must admit, whilst not a massive issue due to the fact the AC is still functioning I am not remotely satisfied by Toyotas attitude. This is a fault that was diagnosed by the Main Daler and we were asked to stump up almost £1,000 for the AC repair. By the same token, the steering column whilst faulty hasn't failed yet BUT they ARE prepared to rectify this at £350 but not apply the sample principle to the more expensive AC compressor. This strikes us as double standards and cherry picking.

The fact that I'm now driving around with a faulty AC Compressor makes it worse because I'm just waiting for its failure which knowing our luck will happen at the worst possible time in a few weeks time when we go to France towing the caravan with our 3 very young children aboard. Then no doubt we'll have to wait weeks before it gets fixed to mentioned nothing of the inconvenience during our holiday.

So in a nutshell, we're not happy at all about this and the attitude of Toyota towards it customers who take the plunge and commit to the considerable outlay on Extended Warranties only to be fobbed off by feeble excuses.

I would therefore urge anyone to think very seriously and hard about committing to a Toyota Extended Warranty. I now have an uphill struggle on my hands to make the Extended Warranty carry out the work which the dealership urges should be carried out immediately.

If we don't get satisfaction I think I might wind up taking this to BBC's Watchdog to bring this issue to the wider public audience. Also after several years owning a Toyota this will be the last time we grace the Toyota Brand.

Appreciate any thoughts or comments.

Best Regards

Pete

[Uncle Bob]

Hello Pete, Auto Express get involved with customers problems with dealers, worth a try .....

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/contactus.html

With your air/con unit, are they saying that if it does fail ,then they will fix it under warranty, because if it fails and seized up it may do damage to other parts and end up costing them more money.....i can't understand their logic :(

[anchorman]

Pete

Welcome to the club.

pm sent.

[PeteDean]

Hello Pete, Auto Express get involved with customers problems with dealers, worth a try .....

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/contactus.html

With your air/con unit, are they saying that if it does fail ,then they will fix it under warranty, because if it fails and seized up it may do damage to other parts and end up costing them more money.....i can't understand their logic :(

Hi Bob,

Yes Toyota are suggesting that because I've got two years to go on my warranty they're happy for me to run about with the fault and then replace it when it fails mechanically. I'd be grateful to learn what other consequential damage that siezure will do as I am going to get in to the ribs of this assessor on Monday morning and put some C4 explosives down his underpants (metaphorically speaking).

And thanks for the Auto Express link. A line to the editor with a brief precis of my problem may result in them running an article which will be timed perfectly to coincide with the launch of the new rav models.

Cheers

Pete

[PeteDean]

Pete

Welcome to the club.

pm sent.

Thanks Anchorman.

Will drop you a call tommorow as suggested.

Regards

Pete

[Plutus]

I've noticed before that problems like this tend to go into pm's.

I seem to remember someone from N Wales having a dealer problem and it went to pm's and we never heard any more about it.

As a Toyota owner and forum member I am interested in the outcome and ask that at least the final conclusion is posted here.

[anchorman]

I've noticed before that problems like this tend to go into pm's.

I seem to remember someone from N Wales having a dealer problem and it went to pm's and we never heard any more about it.

As a Toyota owner and forum member I am interested in the outcome and ask that at least the final conclusion is posted here.

I am always keen to learn about events and experiences of owners and it is not my intention to withdraw to pm's.

Very occasionally it is easier to discuss an issue to get all the facts and rest assured we will come back to this on the forum.

Cheers.

[Sandy - West Cornwall]

.......Yes Toyota are suggesting that because I've got two years to go on my warranty they're happy for me to run about with the fault and then replace it when it fails mechanically. Cheers Pete

Are Toyota just suggesting, or are they prepared to give you this advice in writing? and also meet the cost of any other damage that may arise from the demise of the AC unit.

Like industrial Tribunials, only written evidence is normally admissable in a claim.

Sandy

[local hero]

Somebody recently posted about the worth of aftermarket warranties + the general concensus was that most, other than Toyotas own were a waste of money citing such excuses as fair wear + tare & actual failure.. I thought Mr T were above all this sort of thing, these extended manufacturers warranties are not cheap but are designed to give you complete peace of mind, or so I thought, Does this mean if 4 of your wheel studs sheer off they will not pay out until your 5th one goes + you actually lose the wheel I really hope you resolve this problem as it will certainly put me off buying an extended warranty when the time comes.. Stew

[anchorman]

Good point Stew.

Pete.

It might be worth reminding them that there are a number of us watching this who's car is coming up to 3 years old and are sitting on their money until they see a successful resolution to this.

[PeteDean]

Good point Stew.

Pete.

It might be worth reminding them that there are a number of us watching this who's car is coming up to 3 years old and are sitting on their money until they see a successful resolution to this.

Thanks to everybody for your support.

We got in touch with the Extended Warranty Provider today TWG Services (yes that's Toyota's Extended Warranty provider by the way) and their opener went to script as follows:

"Its just a little noise from the AC Compressor that we should be prepared to put up with. If the AC compressor critically fails then we'll replace it no problem. The garage also agreed with us that its just a little noisey and it can wait for now".

Not satisfied, I commented:

"My wife frequently travels on the motorways at high speeds carrying our 3 infant children - 2 baby boys aged 23 months and our 3 year old daughter. In the event of such a critical failure at high speed e.g. 70 MPH, has TWG considered in it's decision to reject this aspect of the claim the potential risk for the AC compressor to explode with the bearings, valves, pulleys, casing etc blowing through the adjacent engine components and the possible implications that this could have upon my wife's ability to control the vehicle at high speed with the 3 infants onboard???"

"I better go and have a word with the Engineer who carried out the inspection" he added and said that he would phone us back in 5 minutes.

5 minutes later the phone rang and I was advised that the claim will be accepted in full and if the garage re-submits the claim for approval it will be approved immediately.

Well its nice to know that Toyota (TWG) takes a responsible and sensible view of safety and particularly matters where very young children are involved, and just maybe the Extended Warranty is worth the paper it's printed on after all :D

It should be plain sailing from here on in but if anything else develops, I'll keep the board posted.

Thanks again everyone!!

Pete

[reece]

Well its nice to know that Toyota (TWG) takes a responsible and sensible view of safety and particularly matters where very young children are involved, and just maybe the Extended Warranty is worth the paper it's printed on after all :D

They didn’t take a responsible and sensible view until you had to resort to the wife and 3 children’s safety to get a result.

Losing control of a vehicle due to a failure of a component has implications for whoever is driving and the unfortunate motorists in the immediate area.

At least you got a result but I still believe Toyota should have honoured this claim before the emotional blackmail.

[anchorman]

Common sense prevails. Well done Pete.

[Uncle Bob]

Well done Pete, it seems your well worded Email has done the trick

[PeteDean]

Well its nice to know that Toyota (TWG) takes a responsible and sensible view of safety and particularly matters where very young children are involved, and just maybe the Extended Warranty is worth the paper it's printed on after all :D

They didn’t take a responsible and sensible view until you had to resort to the wife and 3 children’s safety to get a result.

Losing control of a vehicle due to a failure of a component has implications for whoever is driving and the unfortunate motorists in the immediate area.

At least you got a result but I still believe Toyota should have honoured this claim before the emotional blackmail.

Reece,

A very valid point.

The policy documentation has now arrived and I have had time to study carefully the Warranty Terms and Conditions which clearly state under Summary of Warranty Terms, Cover, Page 1 of the Preamble, inter alia:

"We will repair/and or replace the vehicle parts and components listed in the Master Schedule (which we call the 'warranted parts', see section 3 of the full terms), if it is necessary to do so in the event of Mechanical or Electrical Failure".

Now under the terms and Conditions, definitions, the policy further defines Mechanical or Electrical failure to mean:

"The breakdown or electrical failure of any of the parts listed as warranted in the Master Schedule of warranted parts caused by the sudden mechanical or electrical faults. These faults must stop the parts from working so they need repairing or replacing. This specifically excludes wear and tear".

It is clear to me from the policy terms and conditions above that Toyota could easily have argued its case and prevailed.

However, I firmly agree with you and believe that those parts covered by the warranty which have a bearing on safety, not only the drivers but the general public at large, should be covered by a sub clause included within the terms of the warranty to provide the flexibility to repair or replace those components which are failing and may be considered to be dangerous to others in the event of a critical failure if left unattended.

Although we should not have to rely on discretion as the safety of everybody is of paramount concern.

Regards

Pete

[xenodrew]

Well done, and welcome. It's always a relief to hear that a manufacturer and their representatives have met their contractual obligations.

But whatever needs done in the future I would definetly avoid using the same dealer. Their haphazzard approach to your present problems does little to install any confidence in any future work they may carry out for you.

You'll always doubt their trustworthiness and feel obliged to check that any work has been carried out to a satisfactory level.

Onwards and upwards.

[Plutus]

Well done Pete and thanks for posting the result.

[local hero]

Great result Pete well done

[rambler]

hi pete

welcome to the club

had my extended warranty for about 2 years now (finishes in october),personaly i wouldnt be without it,i have a had few minor annoyances sorted out by my local dealership.

nothing major ,but all the costs would have added up,inc a lot of labour charges that can be very expensive indeed.

my extended warranty also provided me with full RAC membership.

so for the sake of £50 a month,the only parts that really arnt covered on my rav is bodywork & interior.

any mechanical fault as far as im concerned is covered

well done for getting a result.

rambler

[reece]

Would the few minor annoyances add up to £1,200?

[Davrav]

Would the few minor annoyances add up to £1,200?

£50 a month vs £80 an hour ..................soon adds up.

[PeteDean]

£805 for 2 years or £33.54 a month is a good deal to me, especially after these repairs have cost approx £1,350 and I still have 23 and a half months to run. Never had a problem previously with extended manufacturers warranties, this was the first time i've encountered a hitch. Nice to know any major issues will be covered until we probably get rid of the car.

Regards

Pete

[anchorman]

Did you have to pay in one lump or MDD?

[duncerduncs]

Did you have to pay in one lump or MDD?

You can do both :)

Here's the prices Toyota_Warranty.pdf

[anchorman]

£750 for me then. I might put that towards the cost of a new RAV in a few months time - can't decide??? It was always my intention to keep it for years but I might, just might have a dabble!

Anyone interested in a very clean 4.3 with 20k on it?