Low Sulphur Diesel

[Stupidmia]

Please excuse my ignorance, but this is actually my first diesel car.

When I open my fuel flap, it says 'Low Sulphur Diesel only'. Are all diesels in the UK low sulphur?

Is there in any difference between the supermarket diesel and the likes of BP, Shell etc?

I've heard that some BP stations do 'Ultimate'....does this (like the premium unleadeds to for sporty cars) offer any improvement in performance etc?

Thanks

[Fujisan]

This Link should tell you all you need to know about low sulphur diesel.

Supermarket vs Branded, well some people have strong opinions on this. Certainly some supermarket fuel is ....well, poor....other supermarket fuel, I think you would be hard pressed to tell it from Branded. Try a few different garages / supermarkets and find the fuel you think your car works best with at a price you are willing to pay.

Ultra fuels, again try them and see if you are willing to pay the premium for any performance gain. Recently I filled up (twice) with 'Ultimate' diesel from the nearest garage (Aral Central) to our hotel in Bonn and the RAV certainly went well on the Autobahn's. :D ;)

But over there even the Ultimate was only the same price (roughly) has the ordinary diesel over here. :(

[local hero]

Please excuse my ignorance, but this is actually my first diesel car.

When I open my fuel flap, it says 'Low Sulphur Diesel only'. Are all diesels in the UK low sulphur?

Is there in any difference between the supermarket diesel and the likes of BP, Shell etc?

I've heard that some BP stations do 'Ultimate'....does this (like the premium unleadeds to for sporty cars) offer any improvement in performance etc?

Thanks

Hi Mate, all diesel fuel sold here is suitable, Anchorman our resident Guru refers to supermarket fuel as weasel pee, personally, because i dont use my car a lot i tend to treat it to Shell v power, bp ultimate etc.. but TBH i've never noticed any real difference, indeed i drive a black cab + use whatevers available + that has covered 180,000mls without any problems (touch wood) hope this helps Stew

[jedi134]

Just my 2ps worth, I know for a fact that Sainsburys is supplied by BP, now will this be the same quality as what is supplied to branded BP stations or is it an inferior grade that is supplied to supermarkets?

[anchorman]

All of the major retailers including the supermarkets are selling low sulphur or ultra low sulphur diesel (you will see LSD or ULSD on the pump somewhere) so don't worry about that.

What seems to happen is that most terminals supply many retailers and they just specify what additives they want to include. The supermarkets seem to be selling a budget version with less anti knock additives and yes, your car will sound better with non supermarket fuel and even better with the high grade fuels like BP Ultimate or Shell V-Power. I only ever put high grade diesel in mine and it is definitely quieter. I don't believe the extra mileage comes anywhere near justifying the cost but if it is being kept as clean inside as they claim (I will whip the EGR off one day and have a look!) and it is surpressing the knock, I am happy.

If you let yours run low and then try some in you will tell the difference in minutes as such a high proportion of fuel is fed back to the tank it will be at the injectors almost immediately.

[Cyker]

All Diesel in UK and Europe is ULSD now, and the US is changing over to ULSD.

Unlike petrol, diesel cars don't generally give a crap what you put in them so supermarket fuel is perfectly fine.

The main difference between diesel fuels, as far as I've experienced, seems to be cleaning agents. I tend to drive ultra conservatively, and do find that some fuels have a bigger build up of crap than others (And then you get a big cloud of soot out the back when you floor it )

The 'super' diesels (e.g. BP Ultimate Diesel and V-Power Diesel) don't seem to make a great deal to overall power and torque, but they do seem to shift the power band about (When I tried it in my 1.4 D4D Yaris, I found I lost some low-end torque but gained it back in the higher revs).

One very noticeable change is they make the engine run smoother; If you're using supermarket fuel, run it down to near empty, then stick on some V-Power, the difference is instantly noticeable! :)

I tend to chuck some super diesel in my tank now and then (on the advice of some of the DERV heads here ;)), in order to clean out the injectors. It's cheaper than buying the additives from Halfords ;)

Edit: Damnit, anchorman beat me to the post by less than a minute!

[kencat]

All Diesel in UK and Europe is ULSD now, and the US is changing over to ULSD.

Unlike petrol, diesel cars don't generally give a crap what you put in them so supermarket fuel is perfectly fine.

The main difference between diesel fuels, as far as I've experienced, seems to be cleaning agents. I tend to drive ultra conservatively, and do find that some fuels have a bigger build up of crap than others (And then you get a big cloud of soot out the back when you floor it )

The 'super' diesels (e.g. BP Ultimate Diesel and V-Power Diesel) don't seem to make a great deal to overall power and torque, but they do seem to shift the power band about (When I tried it in my 1.4 D4D Yaris, I found I lost some low-end torque but gained it back in the higher revs).

One very noticeable change is they make the engine run smoother; If you're using supermarket fuel, run it down to near empty, then stick on some V-Power, the difference is instantly noticeable! :)

I tend to chuck some super diesel in my tank now and then (on the advice of some of the DERV heads here ;)), in order to clean out the injectors. It's cheaper than buying the additives from Halfords ;)

Edit: Damnit, anchorman beat me to the post by less than a minute!

just a little 2 add 2 the subject ! iv work near the texco plant in cardiff docks and wot i can c off it is all the oil companys fill up there tankers there ! u name them thay fill up there!

[OldSkoO1]

Yes they all fill up at the same place but the tankers carry cards which determine what fuel additives are added as the fuel is dispensed on un-branded tankers.

Fuel in the UK is actually some of the best in the world for low sulphur; especially our V-Power stuff.

No one will ever disclose what is added to fuel for which brands / supermarkets. However it is very clear that supermarket fuel does not burn as cleanly because of the lack of additives, in turn producing more soot, crudding up the injectors, EGR and reducing efficiency; which could lead to some very expensive repairs on fuel pumps and injectors.

I use V-Power and even though it is slightly more expensive it is only 1.06p here in the midlands, a lot of the country is paying that for standard Shell diesel and it gives me 500 miles + out of my t180, more than Shell extra and actually cost per mile is actually slightly cheaper.

[jospom]

Yes they all fill up at the same place but the tankers carry cards which determine what fuel additives are added as the fuel is dispensed on un-branded tankers.

Fuel in the UK is actually some of the best in the world for low sulphur; especially our V-Power stuff.

No one will ever disclose what is added to fuel for which brands / supermarkets. However it is very clear that supermarket fuel does not burn as cleanly because of the lack of additives, in turn producing more soot, crudding up the injectors, EGR and reducing efficiency; which could lead to some very expensive repairs on fuel pumps and injectors.

I use V-Power and even though it is slightly more expensive it is only 1.06p here in the midlands, a lot of the country is paying that for standard shell diesel and it gives me 500 miles + out of my t180, more than shell extra and actually cost per mile is actually slightly cheaper.

I have always used AGIP BLUETEC, I do not know if any of voi.La difference exists, the engine sound is low and sweet, also contains additives to clean injectors, higher cetane number and lubrication of the pump of high pressure.

You can always use regular diesel and then add these products separately, as I usually do even if I use the Blutech

[anchorman]

Yes they all fill up at the same place but the tankers carry cards which determine what fuel additives are added as the fuel is dispensed on un-branded tankers.

Fuel in the UK is actually some of the best in the world for low sulphur; especially our V-Power stuff.

No one will ever disclose what is added to fuel for which brands / supermarkets. However it is very clear that supermarket fuel does not burn as cleanly because of the lack of additives, in turn producing more soot, crudding up the injectors, EGR and reducing efficiency; which could lead to some very expensive repairs on fuel pumps and injectors.

I use V-Power and even though it is slightly more expensive it is only 1.06p here in the midlands, a lot of the country is paying that for standard shell diesel and it gives me 500 miles + out of my t180, more than shell extra and actually cost per mile is actually slightly cheaper.

I have always used AGIP BLUETEC, I do not know if any of voi.La difference exists, the engine sound is low and sweet, also contains additives to clean injectors, higher cetane number and lubrication of the pump of high pressure.

You can always use regular diesel and then add these products separately, as I usually do even if I use the Blutech

So far Blutec doesn't seem to have made as much of an impact in the UK as it has in mainland Europe or certain states in the USA. As far as I am aware it should only be used when the car is equiped with a dpf (so that means T/SR 180s and the forthcoming SR 150). I don't know if it can be put in the tank as an additive or if it must also have the proper exhaust injection system.

[Offroadster]

All of the major retailers including the supermarkets are selling low sulphur or ultra low sulphur diesel (you will see LSD or ULSD on the pump somewhere) so don't worry about that.

What seems to happen is that most terminals supply many retailers and they just specify what additives they want to include. The supermarkets seem to be selling a budget version with less anti knock additives and yes, your car will sound better with non supermarket fuel and even better with the high grade fuels like BP Ultimate or Shell V-Power. I only ever put high grade diesel in mine and it is definitely quieter. I don't believe the extra mileage comes anywhere near justifying the cost but if it is being kept as clean inside as they claim (I will whip the EGR off one day and have a look!) and it is surpressing the knock, I am happy.

If you let yours run low and then try some in you will tell the difference in minutes as such a high proportion of fuel is fed back to the tank it will be at the injectors almost immediately.

All I ever put in my T180 is Ultimate and V Power, car is quieter and smoother running. 3 weeks ago returning from a week in the lake District walking and biking the only garage available was a Jet garage. Filled the Rav up, 300 miles later on the same tank of fuel , Engine light on, Check VSC etc then goes into limp mode. Eventually get home and off to dealers!! And no surprises, fault code 0400, EGR Valve!!! Valve being replaced under the extended warranty next week. Moral of the story , use Ultimate or V Power !!!!!!

[Fujisan]

All I ever put in my T180 is Ultimate and V Power, car is quieter and smoother running. 3 weeks ago returning from a week in the lake District walking and biking the only garage available was a Jet garage. Filled the Rav up, 300 miles later on the same tank of fuel , Engine light on, Check VSC etc then goes into limp mode. Eventually get home and off to dealers!! And no surprises, fault code 0400, EGR Valve!!! Valve being replaced under the extended warranty next week. Moral of the story , use Ultimate or V Power !!!!!!

Are you really saying that after just ONE tank and 300 miles of ordinary diesel, your EGR valve completely blocked up!

Are you really saying that your EGR valve was perfectly, absolutely, spotless clean before you used this one tank of ordinary diesel, because you had always used Ultimate or V-Power diesel! :o

Or is it more likely that your EGR valve was 99.9% blocked beforehand and was likely to go into fault mode at anytime soon and the fact that the last tank of diesel you put in just happened to be ordinary diesel is pure coincidence!

[Offroadster]

All I ever put in my T180 is Ultimate and V Power, car is quieter and smoother running. 3 weeks ago returning from a week in the lake District walking and biking the only garage available was a Jet garage. Filled the Rav up, 300 miles later on the same tank of fuel , Engine light on, Check VSC etc then goes into limp mode. Eventually get home and off to dealers!! And no surprises, fault code 0400, EGR Valve!!! Valve being replaced under the extended warranty next week. Moral of the story , use Ultimate or V Power !!!!!!

Are you really saying that after just ONE tank and 300 miles of ordinary diesel, your EGR valve completely blocked up!

Are you really saying that your EGR valve was perfectly, absolutely, spotless clean before you used this one tank of ordinary diesel, because you had always used Ultimate or V-Power diesel! :o

Or is it more likely that your EGR valve was 99.9% blocked beforehand and was likely to go into fault mode at anytime soon and the fact that the last tank of diesel you put in just happened to be ordinary diesel is pure coincidence!

Will never know. I wouldnt say it was 100% clean, they will soot no matter what fuel you use!!! But car showed no problems before, i.e no reduction in power, poor acceleration etc. Maybe a coincidence and the fuel from The Jet garage may have been enough for the egr to stick. if it was close to doing so! I will stick to Ultimate and V Power even though it costs a bit more

[anchorman]

I think it is a combination of several things;

How much oil the engine uses (post 2008 production have had mods to pistons and rings and are therefor using very little oil).

What kind of fuel you use - I'm confident that higher grade fuel will reduce the amount of carbon and gummy residue. What I am not at all confident about is what the ratio of oil consumption vs regular fuel contributes to this build up. I suspect the largest part is down to oil consumption. High grade fuel is supposed to have a cleaning affect but just how good it is at offsetting oil based carbon is another question. It sounds like Offroadsters experience suggests - not a lot.

How it is driven. I have questioned several people about what the circumstances were when the EGR stuck and they all seem to say they were winding it up at the time. The higher the revs are the more the EGR opens so I suspect you get to a part of the valve that is not often used and increases the risk.

We know there is a modded valve but we don't know how good that will be in the long run. I notice the new 150 engine has another design altogether - not remotely similar to the current or modded design, more like a gate valve so if we assume the new engine has all the proven oil saving measures and the new arrangement of EGR it should be a good setup.

[local hero]

If i can't get "ultimate" diesel i have been putting a measure of Millers power sport 4 in with my fuel, again not noticed any particular improvements but hopefully will keep my internal parts a bit cleaner,, see link below, Anyone else tried this good or bad ?

http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=188065

[Mereside]

Dear Stupidmia,

I have a sister in Wigton and an Uncle in Bromfield so pop up there on occasions to see them.

On the magnificent open roads you have up there put some V-power in like I do and enjoy the car.

If money is so tight then go for standard stuff and it will be fine.

I love my car and if the best stuff helps in any way I bung it in.

On another point I also bung a bit of diesel red-x in, Anchorman am I going over the top?

Regards

[Cyker]

Oooh yeah, if you know you're going to do lots of high RPM driving, V-Power is good stuff. The extra power it gives at the high end with the smoother burn makes it much nicer, esp. if you guys' RAV D4D's are anywhere near as scary as my Yaris ickle 1.4 D4D over 4000rpm!

For slow city driving tho', it's a complete waste of semi-synth diesel, and I found it actually give worse mileage than Sainsbury's diesel I normally use because it has noticeably less torque at low revs.

[jospom]

I'm sorry but I think I was always use diesel chiaro( I have not explained well).I not normal and sometimes I add addittives.o do both with the Grand Vitara rhz before now with the rav who owns the DPF, but the DPF does not affect the use of type fuel and type of additives such as TUNAP, dieselkleen, STP, etc. liquimoly

look at cleaning the egr in a ALFA ROMEO

http://forum.clubalfa.it/jtd-jtdm/17288-pu...-olio-jtdm.html

sorry, I have not explained well

I always use oil preminum and add products stp. TUNAP,..................

If I dpf or no importance in the use of regular diesel or premium

The additives are used as premium diesel fuel to prevent damage and keep clean the injection system

look at cleaning the egr in a ALFA ROMEO

http://forum.clubalfa.it/jtd-jtdm/17288-pu...-olio-jtdm.html

bye

[kencat]

I'm sorry but I think I was always use diesel chiaro.Io not normal and sometimes I add addittivi.Lo do both with the Grand Vitara rhz before now with the rav who owns the DPF, but the DPF does not affect the use of type fuel and type of additives such as TUNAP, dieselkleen, STP, etc. liquimoly

look at cleaning the egr in a ALFA ROMEO

http://forum.clubalfa.it/jtd-jtdm/17288-pu...-olio-jtdm.html

[anchorman]

If i can't get "ultimate" diesel i have been putting a measure of Millers

Anyone else tried this good or bad ?

Course its bad Stew, you shouldn't put beer in your fuel, you'll be putting spinach in next.

On another point I also bung a bit of diesel red-x in, Anchorman am I going over the top?

Normally I would not put anything in oil or fuel but you might be doing good with that. TBH though, I couldn't say unless I whipped your EGR of and compared it with mine. Under the circumstances you probably aren't doing any harm.