The Great T180 Scandal.

[Taylor6971]

Sorry for this being a long post but I decided to write to Bridgestone tonight. I will post their reply when or if I get it.

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Dear Sir

In 2007 I bought a RAV4 T180 which came fitted with Brigestone RFT as standard. At the time I was told that Toyota would be holding a wheel and tyre assembly at all their franchises so that we would never be left stranded. I have been aware for some months that this has been withdrawn and we now have to use somewhere with the equipment to change the tyre.

Two weeks ago on Friday evening my wife got a puncture. On phoning Toyota Norwich I discovered that they do not have the equipment and that Attleborough was the nearest place that Toyota held this. I contacted Stapleton's on Canary Way in Norwich who have the equipment but would have to order in the tyre and could not change it until Tuesday. Toyota Attleborough incidentally was closed until the Monday, so therefore my wife was stranded.

I spoke to my local tyre franchise, Wilco on Salhouse Road, who were prepared to remove the RF band from inside the tyres and put normal tyres on. They in turn contacted your company who informed them that this band was an integral part of the wheel structure, a fact I am inclined to disbelieve, so therefore said they couldn't help.

The end of this initial part of the story is that I had to call the RAC to collect the car and take it 22miles to Attleborough to have a tyre changed.

On the following link their is a long running debate going on to whether or not these bands can safely be removed to allow normal tyres to be fitted. My franchise at Wilco were told a definite No by your technical department, another poster was told yes but would have to sign a disclaimer, and a third poster has his Local Toyota dealership offering to remove them for him! http://toyotaownersclub.com/forums/index.p...mp;#entry939902

(if the link doesnt work it it toyota owers club, RAV4, "The great T180 Scandal")

For once and for all can your technical department give some straight answers. 1) Are these in any way an integral part of the wheel assembly. 2) Can they be safely removed 3) Are the wheels standard wheels that can take standard tyres?

If found that these can be safely removed then could some sort of statement be produced and distributed to garages that have this equipment. At the moment I personally feel that I am being held hostage over a system that has clearly died a death.

Your early reply would be appreciated before my wife or I end up stranded again.

Regards

[Davrav]

Hi again

Isn't it amazing the variety of stories that we have all been told about these run flats. I don't doubt for a minute what anyone has said on here, but I have Bridgestone telling my local tyre fitter one thing, another fitter something different and then a Toyota franchise actually removing them. So much for them being "an integral part of the wheel assembly".

I think I may contact trading standards over this and ask them to get involved. This is beginnining to feel like dealing with Arthur Daily rather than Bridgestone and Toyota.

Regardless of your feeling for the actual device, this lack of clear and honest guidance on these is shameful!

Get Anne Robinson and Watchdog on to it.

[anchorman]

A T180 owner has a contract with TGB. They should have made sure that this system was workable regardless of the tyre supplier and that means access to replacement tyres or exchange wheels 24/7. This whole idea didn't originate in Engineering, it came from marketing and somebody's head should roll while they address this problem. As it stands the situation just got worse as the confounded things have been dropped leaving all the remaining owners at the mercy of low volumes and the lack of interest in creating a workable infrastructure.

I am very fond of my RAV and derive a great deal of comfort in having a Toyota per se but this whole fiasco beggars belief. If you can raise this via a high profile medium like TV it might just provoke a positive move by TGB in getting them to resolve this one way or another. If it were me in this situation I would just convert to the current SR spec - standard tyres on the current 18" wheels and leave Toyota and Bridgestone to lick their wounds over the vast amount of money they paid for the equipment.

They made the rules - play dirty.

[Taylor6971]

I totally agree with everything Anchorman has said above, but my annoyance here is the fact that we are getting so many conflicting answers about what our options are. However to their credit Bridgestone have replied to me and their letter does in fact offer clarity.

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Dear Mr Taylor.

We are sorry to hear of your trouble with these tyres.

First of all, I feel I must clarify the type of tyres we are talking about here.

Technically they aren't runflat tyres. They are what we call BSR tyres (Bridgestone Support Ring) just to avoid any confusion.

To answer your questions:

) Are these in any way an integral part of the wheel assembly.

1. - Yes, the Support Ring is an integral part of the tyre, as it forms the load bearing capability of the system. It actually can only be fitted to a certain type of wheel. (which has a different type of bead seating to a standard tyre)

Can they be safely removed

2. -Yes, they can be safely removed, however they require modified machinery and specialist operational training (provided by BSUK). - A common misconception is that they can be removed with standard machines, thus leading to damaged tyres and support rings.

the wheels standard wheels that can take standard tyres

3. - Potentially, yes.

There are a few things to bear in mind though.....

First of all: The removal of any safety feature from a vehicle is not recommended by us. Thus you may have to inform your insurance company of said alteration.

Secondly: The BSR system alters the weight diffrerentiation of the vehicle's suspension settings and geometry, so these may have to be re-calibrated if a standard replacement is fitted.

Finally: The absence of a spare wheel will also have to be addressed.

But with this being said, I would be happy to look for an alternative 'standard' tyre for you, if you provide me with the relevent size and pattern.

Please feel free to give us a call on the contact details below.

Thanks and kind regards