How Many Miles Do You Get?

[Devil-ish]

Its gradually creeping up....now fuelly says I am getting 47 mpg

[Lordjellybelly]

Hello, first post and surprise surprise on this topic. Although we`ve had the car [iQ 1.00 multidrive]for three months it`s done only about 500 miles and most of that in 4 or 5 mile trips around town. I`m getting no better than 7miles/litre. Seems pretty awful! I love the car even though this is a concern. Can somebody tell me what to do with the bag in the boot compartment.

[johnan]

Hello, first post and surprise surprise on this topic. Although we`ve had the car [iQ 1.00 multidrive]for three months it`s done only about 500 miles and most of that in 4 or 5 mile trips around town. I`m getting no better than 7miles/litre. Seems pretty awful! I love the car even though this is a concern. Can somebody tell me what to do with the bag in the boot compartment.

The bag I had in the back when I got the car contained the tonneau or luggage area cover (when the seats are down) which stretches across between the press stud fittings on the rear side panels.

If your bag did not contain the cover a visit to MrT is required.

What is 7 miles/litre in old money?!

[Lordjellybelly]

The tonneau was in place and the bag was in the "box" so thanks for that. It`s about 32mpg with air con.

[Zulley]

Oh.... my.... God....

Ive figured it out, was rather annoyed that a friend was getting 15mpg more then me and they put it down to my heavy right foot, but i said that couldnt be it.

Took the dog out last weekend and was driving steady, as everyone who has a dog knows they never sit down, just stand and wobble about. The mpg started at 42 and went all the way up to 57.

57 !Removed! mpg for just having the dog in the back.

Shes coming out with me this weekend as well.

[gizzard]

On our first fill up we are getting about 51 MPG. As said before if you keep an eye on the "live" MPG you can get a bit better at economic gear shifts and how hard to push the accelerator pedal. One thing I have noticed is the shift up light doesn't always agree with the live MPG. Letting the revs get a little higher as long as its steady and not hard accelerating can get as good MPG as sticking with the shift indicator but benefits from better progress speed wise IMO.

[SallyIQ]

I got 235 miles on my last fill up, and around 42mpg....although I was taking part in one of the Toyota Sprint Series Rounds so I have an excuse :P

[telecasterisation]

I bought my basic model iQ to replace my Aygo just to commute to work.

The Aygo was unquestionably far more economical, it averaged 58mpg, whilst the iQ currently gives me only @ 54 (only 1130 on the clock). The way it is driven has tremendous impact on the returned mpg, which is something everyone knows, but how many actually abide by the gentle acceleration/early braking, smooth gear changing doctrine? I have yet to witness an iQ being driven conservatively - it is all outside lane, foot to the floor stuff. I don't get why anyone invests in a small engined vehicle and then thrashes the nuts out of it trying to keep up with bigger more powerful cars?

I treat the continual up/down gear change arrow display in conjunction with the average mpg, as a computer game. Every journey, I aim to get the very best MPG possible and haven't even taken it over 50mph.

[jimbo747]

I have yet to witness an iQ being driven conservatively - it is all outside lane, foot to the floor stuff. I don't get why anyone invests in a small engined vehicle and then thrashes the nuts out of it trying to keep up with bigger more powerful cars?

I treat the continual up/down gear change arrow display in conjunction with the average mpg, as a computer game. Every journey, I aim to get the very best MPG possible and haven't even taken it over 50mph.

If you're doing 50, thats probably why I'm blasting past you in the outside lane. ;)

Besidees, it quite funny the look on BMW 5 series drivers faces when you swoop past. Esp in the rear view mirror it looks like a larger prius or something!

[curly kittten]

i now average 62 mpg going to and from work,i started at 56 mpg i,m trying to get up to the 65mpg combined

[telecasterisation]

We traded in our Voyager for a secondhand Citroen C1 1.4 diesel with just 9700 on the clock a week ago. Coming back on the motorway, we got 78mpg. Since then, with a lot less 'booting', I get @ 86mpg on a motorway run.

Considering what you'd expect from a three cyclinder, very small car with no spare tyre, the MPG returned by my iQ is quite horrific. It's well made, fun to drive, but it is certainly no great shakes as a 'green' commuter's set of wheels.

[MccLtd]

Ive managed to get 58mpg out of my 1.3 town driving. Just took it out for a few motorway trips and it dropped to 52. But I'm managing 55mpg easily now.

[amgio]

hi,

I was just wondering how people were getting their average mpg. I have been doing the calculations with my petrol receipts as I don't trust the iq's computer.

last fill up I calculated 50mpg.. its only just getting better. I have 2600miles on the clock of my iq2 and i have had it since july..yes i haven't driven it much.

i am disappointed with the mpg. but hopefully it will get better.

the 'live' mpg clock doesn't go any higher than 60 mpg. does that mean It's dodgy and does it need replacing? thanks

[bokkie]

...the 'live' mpg clock doesn't go any higher than 60 mpg. does that mean It's dodgy and does it need replacing? thanks

It's a known "problem". Do a search and you'll read more about it. From what I recall it requires something to be replaced within the dash and I believe a side effect is that it resets the mileage to zero. Others will advise you better.

[miq]

We traded in our Voyager for a secondhand Citroen C1 1.4 diesel with just 9700 on the clock a week ago. Coming back on the motorway, we got 78mpg. Since then, with a lot less 'booting', I get @ 86mpg on a motorway run.

Considering what you'd expect from a three cyclinder, very small car with no spare tyre, the MPG returned by my iQ is quite horrific. It's well made, fun to drive, but it is certainly no great shakes as a 'green' commuter's set of wheels.

You're absolutely right if you compare it to a diesel car (Although I wouldn't.). Our old td Pug 405 could easily keep up with the IQ's mpg figures but that doesn't make it a "greener" car.

I think with these new diesel engines what owners can save on mpg will spend on maintenance down the line. Also diesel's exhaust gas is more harmful than people think :(

Here's a short article about the issue.

[telecasterisation]

We traded in our Voyager for a secondhand Citroen C1 1.4 diesel with just 9700 on the clock a week ago. Coming back on the motorway, we got 78mpg. Since then, with a lot less 'booting', I get @ 86mpg on a motorway run.

Considering what you'd expect from a three cyclinder, very small car with no spare tyre, the MPG returned by my iQ is quite horrific. It's well made, fun to drive, but it is certainly no great shakes as a 'green' commuter's set of wheels.

Our old td Pug 405 could easily keep up with the IQ's mpg figures but that doesn't make it a "greener" car.

I think with these new diesel engines what owners can save on mpg will spend on maintenance down the line. Also diesel's exhaust gas is more harmful than people think :(

Thanks for responding, however I clearly did not cite the diesel as being in any way 'greener/green', my comment followed the mpg returned by my iQ.

The iQ was pitched very heavily by my Toyota salesman as being 'the next generation' of petrol car, low emissions (borne out by zero road tax) married to high mpg, but to get anything remotely close to the manufacturer's claimed mpg, you have to drive the iQ like Noddy.

Having had my iQ for a couple of months now, I genuinely wish I hadn't purchased one. There are numerous issues that didn't manifest themselves during the test drive, far more than any other car I have ever owned. If there was a tremendous benefit attained by owning an iQ, then this would outweigh the downsides, but it is nothing more than a novelty average small car, returning average small car mileage.

[mr dave]

We traded in our Voyager for a secondhand Citroen C1 1.4 diesel with just 9700 on the clock a week ago. Coming back on the motorway, we got 78mpg. Since then, with a lot less 'booting', I get @ 86mpg on a motorway run.

Considering what you'd expect from a three cyclinder, very small car with no spare tyre, the MPG returned by my iQ is quite horrific. It's well made, fun to drive, but it is certainly no great shakes as a 'green' commuter's set of wheels.

Our old td Pug 405 could easily keep up with the IQ's mpg figures but that doesn't make it a "greener" car.

I think with these new diesel engines what owners can save on mpg will spend on maintenance down the line. Also diesel's exhaust gas is more harmful than people think :(

Thanks for responding, however I clearly did not cite the diesel as being in any way 'greener/green', my comment followed the mpg returned by my iQ.

The iQ was pitched very heavily by my Toyota salesman as being 'the next generation' of petrol car, low emissions (borne out by zero road tax) married to high mpg, but to get anything remotely close to the manufacturer's claimed mpg, you have to drive the iQ like Noddy.

Having had my iQ for a couple of months now, I genuinely wish I hadn't purchased one. There are numerous issues that didn't manifest themselves during the test drive, far more than any other car I have ever owned. If there was a tremendous benefit attained by owning an iQ, then this would outweigh the downsides, but it is nothing more than a novelty average small car, returning average small car mileage.

Hi telecasterisation,

Could you plese expand on your "numerous issues"

Many thanks...

[telecasterisation]

We traded in our Voyager for a secondhand Citroen C1 1.4 diesel with just 9700 on the clock a week ago. Coming back on the motorway, we got 78mpg. Since then, with a lot less 'booting', I get @ 86mpg on a motorway run.

Considering what you'd expect from a three cyclinder, very small car with no spare tyre, the MPG returned by my iQ is quite horrific. It's well made, fun to drive, but it is certainly no great shakes as a 'green' commuter's set of wheels.

Our old td Pug 405 could easily keep up with the IQ's mpg figures but that doesn't make it a "greener" car.

I think with these new diesel engines what owners can save on mpg will spend on maintenance down the line. Also diesel's exhaust gas is more harmful than people think :(

Thanks for responding, however I clearly did not cite the diesel as being in any way 'greener/green', my comment followed the mpg returned by my iQ.

The iQ was pitched very heavily by my Toyota salesman as being 'the next generation' of petrol car, low emissions (borne out by zero road tax) married to high mpg, but to get anything remotely close to the manufacturer's claimed mpg, you have to drive the iQ like Noddy.

Having had my iQ for a couple of months now, I genuinely wish I hadn't purchased one. There are numerous issues that didn't manifest themselves during the test drive, far more than any other car I have ever owned. If there was a tremendous benefit attained by owning an iQ, then this would outweigh the downsides, but it is nothing more than a novelty average small car, returning average small car mileage.

Hi telecasterisation,

Could you plese expand on your "numerous issues"

Many thanks...

Hi mr dave, thanks for your request. I actually already detailed this fairly extensively in its own dedicated thread, you must have missed this, The link is further below (although I have cut and pasted the content for ease of reading).

That said, there were several things I did not include which you've kindly allowed me to now add retrospectively.

Compared to the Aygo’s fuel gauge the iQ’s is highly convoluted and does not give you any real indication of how much you have left as the display ‘tapers’. The top parts increment down nicely and you can rack up the mileage as the upper segments take ages to drop down in direct relation to usage. However, the bottom two go much quicker than the top ones and if you are not familiar with this nuance, you will be fooled into thinking you have a great many miles left in the tank than you actually do. A friend has an iQ and he got on the motorway believing he had the equivalent of the top two bars left, which he found out to his cost he didn't.

Then there is the handle that sits on the inside of the car just above the driver’s door. I am over 6’ and regularly bang the side of my head when a look to the right coincides with an offside ‘bump’ in the road. This I have also documented in another thread.

My eldest daughter was learning to drive in my previous car (the Aygo), and then switched to the iQ. We then discovered that because the visibility is so bad, you cannot take your driving test in an iQ. Here;

‘The ban was declared after a risk assessment was carried out and it was found that the iQ’s thick B- and C- Pillars and rear windows prevents the examiner from having a clear view at angled junctions, which compromises the strict testing methods. It was complaints from the DSA (Driving Standards Agency) examiners which prompted the investigation.’

This was known about by Toyota well before I took delivery and my daughter came with me when I ordered the car and we mentioned to the salesman that she would be using it to learn in. Not one word was mentioned about the ‘no good for taking the test in’. So if the examiner’s view is compromised, then so too is the driver’s. Hardly a good design feature and I have had a couple of ‘moments’ where due to the road dynamics, my view of approaching traffic was completely compromised.

Hope this helps.

The link to my earlier thread from back in February;

http://www.toyotaownersclub.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=107206&st=0&p=973382&fromsearch=1entry973382

iQ Issues From An Owner's Perspective =

I have had two Aygos and now have a very recent iQ. The last Aygo went due to an ongoing water leakage problem - it was just coming up to three years old and had been back to the dealership about 8 times, but the water just kept on coming in. So much so, that you could smell the damp/mould in the air.

The choice of a replacement wasn't easy. Toyota would give me at least £750 more part-ex than Ford or Fiat, Honda etc, but I was reluctant to go back to a Toyota. After much thought and domestic discussion, I opted for the iQ - I only wanted it for commuting to work, so space wasn't really the issue it would be for a family who'd need the extra seats on a regular basis.

I'd had an iQ several times as a courtesy car and thought I was familiar with all its nuances and shortcomings. I was wrong;

Perhaps the most disadvantaging aspect of any test drive/using a car in daylight, is that you don't get to appreciate how a vehicle changes once it gets dark. There are a whole raft of features that kick in and poodling along at 13:08 in the afternoon and you just don't appreciate the impact darkness has. The key shortcoming here is the iQ's interior lighting. This consists of an appalling underpowered spotlight that has no intention (or capability) to illuminate the rear seating area. I picked up one of my daughters and her friend at night, the friend got in the back and simply couldn't find the seatbelt as it was squirreled in its equally daft 'slot'. I eventually had to get out in the rain, open the rear hatch and find it for her. A reasonable interior light would have saved this scenario from taking place.

Following on from that, the friend could then not find the 'slot' to relocate the seatbelt when she got out, consequently I had to drive home with the belt rattling.

Then there is the lack of exterior door protection strips. Yes, adding a strip would impact the line of the doors, but I find myself attempting to park 'away' from other vehicles as I already have a slight 'dink in each side where someone has enthusiastically opened their car door next to mine.

Next, the visibility issue due to the positioning of the rear side pillars. This is highly dangerous and any angled junction that invloves you twisting to see what's coming and your vision is severely compromised. The length of the door, the pillar and the tiny window often make it a seat-of-your-pants manoeuver.

Equally, the controls of the sound system are mounted on the wheel, which although a personal perspective thing, I absolutely hate. The wife had used it, parked the wheels at an angle and I got in the following morning at 06:03, turned the engine on and Lady Gaga erupted from the Speakers and because of the lack of lighting (the spotlight), and the fact that it took me quite a few seconds to 'find' the controls, everyone in the vicinity was aroused from their slumbers.

The airbag light on the dashboard stays on all the time the vehicle is running, day and night. So I have stuck black tape over that.

Because of the length of the doors, you have to reach an unnatural distance back by twisting the torso to reach the front seatbelts. Anyone with lumbur spine problems beware.

Now to the issue of no spare tyre;

On day five post-taking delivery, I came back to a flat-tyre. I could instantly see the problem, a screw in a location that could easily be repaired. Although I had read the procedure through in the accompanying book, it was raining and it all appeared a daunting prospect and as time was pressing, I took the wife's car to work instead.

Upon getting home later, I jacked the car up, removed the wheel and ran it down to the local tyre place where they happily repaired it at a nominal cost. They asked what car it was from? It transpired that had I filled the tyre with the compressed gunk, it cannot be repaired and you have to buy a whole new tyre regardless of where the puncture is. This may not be true at all tyre dealerships, but certainly at the one I visited.

So if you have the option to avoid using the supplied inflation route, don't as it will cost you heaps - you'll have to buy a new tyre.

As it is the basic model, it requires the insertion of a key to start it. This presents problems in darkness (the spotlight again) as the ignition is positioned in a seemingly odd location and strange angle. Add to that, the key just doesn't like to go in, it is a real fiddle.

Finally, the front number plate is fixed by two screws that are very close together, not positioned at 1/4 to 3 keeping it nice and flush with the bodywork, but at 5 to 1, meaning my front plate has already started to to adopt an annoying 'curved' appearance.

Apparently, it does not need to be recalled to fix the throttle problem.

I do realise I have not endorsed any of things I like about the iQ, but hopefully this will help anyone thinking of buying one to note these issues when test driving.

[bokkie]

Tele: Excellent points you raised. I've also come close to kissing my a$$ goodbye because of the blind spot caused by the rear pillars. It's a pity that door strips were not added. Like you, we've started to accumulate dinks where inconsiderate scumbags have opened their door onto ours.

[macabeus]

Why in the world have you ever bought it?

Most/all of these things should be/could be noticed on a testdrive and others can be fixed.

But sell it then....every month you wait it's worth less.......by another Aygo.................way cheaper if you don't add al the extra's.

[telecasterisation]

Why in the world have you ever bought it?

Most/all of these things should be/could be noticed on a testdrive and others can be fixed.

But sell it then....every month you wait it's worth less.......by another Aygo.................way cheaper if you don't add al the extra's.

The problem with your response is you haven't quoted anyone, so there is no indication who your comment is aimed at? I can't see it is me, as the vast majority of the points I raised are 'unfixable'.

I am unsure what a test drive in the Netherlands consists of, but mine was down the by-pass and back again, 12 minutes tops, @ noon. You only fully comprehend a vehicle's shortcomings with prolonged use and the issue with the pillars obstructing visibility was only apparent on week two visiting the in-laws who live on an angled road and it is impossible to see traffic approaching from the left.

[macabeus]

If the shoe fits........

Testdrive is not 12 minutes.....so who's to blame? AND I'd had an iQ several times as a courtesy car and thought I was familiar with all its nuances and shortcomings. I was wrong;

So al least 3 times 12 minutes. ;)

The imense horror of at night due to the poor interior lighting: the friend could then not find the 'slot' to relocate the seatbelt when she got out, consequently I had to drive home with the belt rattling must be humongous terrible and you may need couseling perhaps?

Then there is the lack of exterior door protection strips.....................then you mention: Yes, adding a strip would impact the line of the doors, but I find myself attempting to park 'away' from other vehicles as I already have a slight 'dink in each side where someone has enthusiastically opened their car door next to mine.

YOU don't want to impact the door line and now its a major fault?.................most of todays cars don't have them!

The pilars are so true and mean you should be an experienced driver who looks at his sourroundings but also the same after 2 weeks in my car but maybe yours are inflatable or something?......you must have seen it the first couple of drives before you bought it................impossible otherwise.

Equally, the controls of the sound system are mounted on the wheel, which although a personal perspective thing, I absolutely hate. The wife had used it, parked the wheels at an angle and I got in the following morning at 06:03, turned the engine on and Lady Gaga erupted from the Speakers and because of the lack of lighting (the spotlight), and the fact that it took me quite a few seconds to 'find' the controls, everyone in the vicinity was aroused from their slumbers.

Was there form the beginning on al your IQ (test)rides and you should blame your wife instead of the design maybe?

The airbag light on the dashboard stays on all the time the vehicle is running, day and night. So I have stuck black tape over that.

It did with al your other IQ rides as wel and is mandetory for the EURO NCAP ...........most new cars do and tape works very wel......or did yours start after a couple of weeks suddenly?

Because of the length of the doors, you have to reach an unnatural distance back by twisting the torso to reach the front seatbelts. Anyone with lumbur spine problems beware.

You don't need to twist your back at all.........justuse your hand opposite to were your seatbelt is.....whats the big :!Removed!: problem?

About the spare tire: from the start and why not call the autoclub or something?.....you knew it from the start (again)

As it is the basic model, it requires the insertion of a key to start it. 99% of all cars in the world work like this.....you know you can twist the virtually non existing eyeball ligtdome? This presents problems in darkness (the spotlight again) as the ignition is positioned in a seemingly odd location and strange angle. Add to that, the key just doesn't like to go in, it is a real fiddle.......or you could have opted (key was there from the beginning i suppose) for the bit more expensive model. (worth every cent)

Finally, the front number plate is fixed by two screws that are very close together, not positioned at 1/4 to 3 keeping it nice and flush with the bodywork, but at 5 to 1, meaning my front plate has already started to to adopt an annoying 'curved' appearance.

This is not a desing "fault" but something your dealer has done......and can correct very easy.....(maybe even youself...it could raise the value of your sh*tbox car considerably

Apparently, it does not need to be recalled to fix the throttle problem.

Lucky you!

Be smart and sell it tomorrow......if the world reads this no one will ever buy one again and your's will be impossible to sell perhaps!

Maybe twist your spine in an impossible curve....put your seatbelt on and drive it with 50 mph into a brick wall?..............hope al the airbags in the thick pillars/colums work and you collect the new value from your insurance.

Then do a proper testdrive with a "normal" car which is sold over and over again and has no "flaws" .........

[telecasterisation]

If the shoe fits........

Hi macabeus, thanks for responding and I acknowledge your confusion.

Quote; ‘Testdrive is not 12 minutes.....so who's to blame? AND I'd had an iQ several times as a courtesy car and thought I was familiar with all its nuances and shortcomings. I was wrong;

So al least 3 times 12 minutes.’

My test drive was indeed @ 12 minutes, there had been a major RTC on the other side of the dual carriageway roundabout and traffic police had closed off the access just as we arrived. They sent us around the roundabout and back the way we had come. We were then going directly back past the dealership and as I imminently going to have get to work down the very carriageway that was now closed off, I therefore terminated the test drive due to the time element. Obviously, this was not a relevant part of my initial contribution and I thank you for the opportunity of raising it now.

As I had had an iQ (albeit an iQ2) as a courtesy car, I wrongly thought I had sufficient experience of one on the road to make an educated decision. However, given I had only driven the courtesy car from the garage, home and back, with no passengers and only during daylight, I clearly stated I was wrong and I still stand by that.

Quote; ’The imense horror of at night due to the poor interior lighting: the friend could then not find the 'slot' to relocate the seatbelt when she got out, consequently I had to drive home with the belt rattling must be humongous terrible and you may need couseling perhaps?’

The expression ‘immense horror’ I can only assume is courtesy of artistic licence, however, many people have commented here about ‘rattles’ within their iQ. I was asked to ‘expand on your "numerous issues", and whilst not ‘terrible’, expand I did. I have no clue what a ‘couseling’ is? Is it the manufacturer of some velcro device or type of adhesive that reduces rattles? I did a search but cannot find reference, so I am sure all the others here who have mentioned the rattley belts will be interested too.

You then state

’YOU don't want to impact the door line (by adding door protection strips) and now its a major fault?.................most of todays cars don't have them!’

I never used the expression ‘major fault’. My previous two Toyotas both had door strips and neither had any parking ‘dings’ as a result. My iQ has a dent in each door due to the carlessness of others, both avoided with strips fitted.

Remember, this is my opinion, one I was asked to supply. Can you please supply verifiable figures to substantiate your ‘…most of todays cars don't have them!’.

We move to;

’The pilars are so true and mean you should be an experienced driver who looks at his sourroundings but also the same after 2 weeks in my car but maybe yours are inflatable or something?......you must have seen it the first couple of drives before you bought it................impossible otherwise.’

My previous pre-purchase journeys did not encompasse angled junctions, therefore the visibility issue was not apparent. Admittedly it is not every junction and the number is very small and, under normal conditions it is perfectly acceptable, but there are locations where they do add an additional element of danger. Did Toyota not notice the visibility issue during design, early testing, manufacture? It appears not despite that process taking longer than two weeks.

You then comment on what I said about the audio controls;

’Was there form the beginning on al your IQ (test)rides and you should blame your wife instead of the design maybe?’

No I don’t blame the wife. There is a considerable delay when attempting to turn the audio system off, it is certainly not instantaneous. I do not personally drive with music on and unlike previous systems where you hit a button and the sound is gone, this is not the case in the iQ, there is a delay. Marry this to a steering wheel that is not horizontal and not knowing if the system is on or off until it receives power, and there will always be ambiguity.

Then the airbag light;

’It did with al your other IQ rides as wel and is mandetory for the EURO NCAP ...........most new cars do and tape works very wel......or did yours start after a couple of weeks suddenly?’

No, this was apparent from the beginning. However, as I have clearly stated, certain aspects only become apparent when driving at night. I find the airbag light highly distracting when it gets dark and it only become so post-purchase.

Regarding the seatbelt, you say;

’You don't need to twist your back at all.........just use your hand opposite to were your seatbelt is.....whats the big problem?’

The ‘big problem’ is that not everyone has the mobility you cite. The length of the doors adds considerably to the issue of grasping the top of the belt and this is compounded by the very real issue of the seatbelt’s tongue slipping down below the top line of the seat, so you can’t always be sure it is even there. My wife has arthritis in her shoulders and lower back and getting hold of the seatbelt in the fashion you describe is impossible. Again, try to grasp the concept that not everyone will have different opinion based issues and what one person does even contemplate, is a hurdle for someone else.

Quote ’About the spare tire: from the start and why not call the autoclub or something?.....you knew it from the start (again)’.

I am unsure what your point is here. Very few of the people I have talked to about ‘gunge’ inflation realise that once used, the tyre is redundant. Yes, I knew this, but it is an issue nonetheless,

Quote; ‘As it is the basic model, it requires the insertion of a key to start it. 99% of all cars in the world work like this.....you know you can twist the virtually non existing eyeball ligtdome? This presents problems in darkness (the spotlight again) as the ignition is positioned in a seemingly odd location and strange angle. Add to that, the key just doesn't like to go in, it is a real fiddle.......or you could have opted (key was there from the beginning i suppose) for the bit more expensive model. (worth every cent)’.

The value of hindsight is one to perplex humanity for generations. Yes, I could have opted for a model that did not require a key, but I didn’t, hence my comments about the car I did buy. I actually took it back on Thursday as I was having considerable problems getting the key in, and they acknowledge there is an issue for which it is booked in to be diagnosed and rectified.

Quote about the numberplate attachment; ‘This is not a desing "fault" but something your dealer has done......and can correct very easy.....(maybe even youself...it could raise the value of your sh*tbox car considerably.'

Again, I resorted to Google and cannot find ‘desing fault’ so am unable to determine your meaning? The issue here is that regardless of ‘source’ the vehicle was delivered as it stands and it is on that basis that my statement is based.

Quote; ‘Lucky you!’

I would say this is more due to manufacture date and not some indeterminate ethereal concept like ‘luck’.

Again, I thank you for taking the time to respond and you now have a clearer understanding.

And as bokkie typed, ‘Tele: Excellent points you raised’.

[macabeus]

Quick sell it.....don't waste time typing stories ;)

[codman]

r all IQowners like children? and never grow up?