Poor Performing 2.2d4d Sr

[HoneyBear1980]

My 08 plate 2.2 diesel SR has now done just under 30k miles and has started to run very poorly. I have just filled up and it took 43 litres to do 445 miles - that's barely 47mpg (the worst I have recorded since new). It also sounds rattly and loud - like a ford transit in the morning, I have not noticed that it was that poor for refinement before.

Additionally last week when trying to catch up and overtake a Citreon C4 Picasso I could only just keep up with it under acceleration from a 30 zone moving into a 60 zone let alone pass it.

Another disappointed Toyota owner at the moment... has anyone else noticed a drop off in performance at 30k miles? I hope the service due in a couple of weeks improves things.

[cabcurtains]

It may be time to join the EGR valve cleaning club, have a look in the Auris pages for Rick D4D's guide. Ask the dealer to do this as part of the service and then report back with their findings. The change of oil and general inspection may improve things slightly as well.

I started a thread in the Avensis pages with an issue we are having with ours, might be worth seeing if yours does the same.

[HoneyBear1980]

It may be time to join the EGR valve cleaning club...

I didn't know about that problem, i'll get them to have a look.

Thanks

[hertsnminds]

I have just filled up and it took 43 litres to do 445 miles - that's barely 47mpg (the worst I have recorded since new).

That is pretty much the average mpg I have had in just coming up to 2 years and 20k miles and still better than the quoted combined 44.8 mpg figure in the brochure.

I have had better figures on longer motorway runs and lower figures with lots of town driving, what mpg figures had the car been getting until now?

[HoneyBear1980]

...what mpg figures had the car been getting until now?

I normally get 52 mpg when just doing short trips around town. Mixed driving is around 56 mpg and long runs on duel carriage ways and M ways normally get me just over 60 mpg. Therefore 47 mpg (note not gone out of the relatively flat Anglia region) is quite a drop. It has steadily decreased in the last 3 fills ups from mid to low 50's and now 47 mpg!!!

[dbritt]

...what mpg figures had the car been getting until now?

I normally get 52 mpg when just doing short trips around town. Mixed driving is around 56 mpg and long runs on duel carriage ways and M ways normally get me just over 60 mpg. Therefore 47 mpg (note not gone out of the relatively flat Anglia region) is quite a drop. It has steadily decreased in the last 3 fills ups from mid to low 50's and now 47 mpg!!!

Could it be partially down to the cruddy fuel that is sold during winter?

[Cyker]

How have you been driving it?

I tend to drive like a hypermiler on tranqs (Easy acceleration, never going above 2000rpm in a given gear etc.) and found my Yaris D4D was slowly starting to loose power over time. Asked about on here, and the two main suggestions were soot crudded up injectors and soot blocked EGR valve.

Easiest solution is to basically take it on a joyride on the motorway and/or some country roads every now and then to help burn away the soot

Injector cleaner can help, as can dropping in a tank of V-Power diesel now and then (But V-Power affects the way it drives too; It shifts the torque to the higher end of the rev-range which makes it feel even worse at low revs, e.g. when pulling away)

Another thing is engine oil, but you don't sound like one of the people Reece is leading a campaign against

[HoneyBear1980]

"Could it be partially down to the cruddy fuel that is sold during winter?"

I only ever use Supermarket fuel (tried BP ultimate twice and didn't notice any difference - if anything the recorded mpg figures were slightly worse). I have noticed that when filling up after the winter fuel comes out the engine doesn't rev quite as sweetly.

[HoneyBear1980]

How have you been driving it?

I do drive it gently most of the time, but I do make an effort to be a "Larry Leadfoot" on occasion. When I do it leaves quite a big greyish / brown haze in my wake for several burst of acceleration. After exiting approx 3 to 4 roundabouts like a "Ronnie Rever" it then produces no smoke.

I do check the oil and I have never noticed it drop so I have never added any.

[cabcurtains]

I don't buy Supermarket fuel, it gives my Passat a strange flat spot around 1800 RPM, i also think it will clog the EGR quicker.

You need to rule the EGR out before anything else, you wont clear it out with a blast if its already clogged.

[HoneyBear1980]

I don't buy Supermarket fuel, it gives my Passat a strange flat spot around 1800 RPM, i also think it will clog the EGR quicker.

You need to rule the EGR out before anything else, you wont clear it out with a blast if its already clogged.

You may be right. I'll get them to check the EGR valve.

[Cyker]

Yeah... if it's not too blocked, then getting the exhaust hot enough will help burn some of the soot away otherwise it'll have to be opened up.

Additives can help reduce/prevent the soot building up by making sure the fuel is burnt more completely, but they won't help remove it. They can help remove soot deposits from the injectors tho'.

Just flooring it for a bit won't achieve this; You really need to go on a long burn; A long steep hill in 3rd/4th is good for this, otherwise a long run along the motorway at about 70+ can help. It also helps remove soot deposits from the injectors.

What is the point of an EGR anyway? What possible benefit is there of feeding your exhaust back into the engine?!

It's like... I dunno... peeing into your tea or something!

[hertsnminds]

What is the point of an EGR anyway? What possible benefit is there of feeding your exhaust back into the engine?!

Have a read of these...

http://www.misterfixit.com/egrvalve.htm

http://autorepair.about.com/od/glossary/gr/def_egr-valve.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EGR_valve

The short answer is, it is a way of reducing emissions.

[cabcurtains]

Yeah... if it's not too blocked, then getting the exhaust hot enough will help burn some of the soot away otherwise it'll have to be opened up.

Additives can help reduce/prevent the soot building up by making sure the fuel is burnt more completely, but they won't help remove it. They can help remove soot deposits from the injectors tho'.

Just flooring it for a bit won't achieve this; You really need to go on a long burn; A long steep hill in 3rd/4th is good for this, otherwise a long run along the motorway at about 70+ can help. It also helps remove soot deposits from the injectors.

What is the point of an EGR anyway? What possible benefit is there of feeding your exhaust back into the engine?!

It's like... I dunno... peeing into your tea or something!

Cleaning the EGR takes a fair bit of effort, driving it won't get it cleaned out IMO. Urban use will block any car's EGR regardless of additives, constant cold starting speeds up the blockage process as the EGR is in use over and over again.

EGR = Typical emission's related overcomplicated *******, ok on a petrol as that clean burns. Burning Diesel creates soot = blockage, on older cars you can block it off, newer models put the EML and or Pollution control light.

[Cyker]

Those articles are just confusing me more!

What I've gleaned from them is that the EGR retards the reaction a bit to stop NOx's forming, but the cost for a diesel engine is lower efficiency and increased CO, CO2, HC, soot and particulate emissions?! How does that seem like a good idea?! Especially since NOx can be catalysed... (Ironically, with what is basically pee! )

I might not be groking it fully tho' since, if I understand those articles correctly, a blocked EGR valve should increase the performance of a diesel engine!

But I guess this is all part of the regulation insanity that's bouncing around atm., like why they think diesels are less polluting than petrol (Petrols = lots of CO2 and water; Diesels = less CO2 but instead cancer, toxic, particulate, acid rain and ozone killing emissions )

(Erm... I'm not really hijacking the thread, I'm just keeping it running until HB comes back with his repair results... yeah... :D )

[cabcurtains]

All they are is a pain in the *****

Modern diesels are over complicated for emissions reasons and thats it, your spot on the global warming vs horrible illness's as well ;)

[HoneyBear1980]

(Erm... I'm not really hijacking the thread, I'm just keeping it running until HB comes back with his repair results... yeah... :D )

Still not been able to book my Verso in to the local dealers on a day I don't need the car. Never had this problem before, can't understand why they could be so busy......

[Cyker]

[HoneyBear1980]

Just got my car back from local Toyota garage after its 30k service. They also did an engine flush (refused to check EGR valve) and changed brake fluid. I complained about the performance and mpg. They did a test drive, said it did 40mpg which was what it should do and they didn't think the performance was poor. £250 down the drain! Toyota have a lot to learn, very disappointed although it does change gear much better now into 1st & 2nd, it felt notchy before when cold.

[cabcurtains]

Just got my car back from local Toyota garage after its 30k service. They also did an engine flush (refused to check EGR valve) and changed brake fluid. I complained about the performance and mpg. They did a test drive, said it did 40mpg which was what it should do and they didn't think the performance was poor. £250 down the drain! Toyota have a lot to learn, very disappointed although it does change gear much better now into 1st & 2nd, it felt notchy before when cold.

Time to find another dealer, refusing to check the EGR, clowns.