6 Years Or Prius Driving - Comparing The 3 Generations

[seljon]

Had my silver Gen 3 T Spirit with solar roof for a few weeks now having traded in a 2000 Gen 1 which I had for 6 years. We also have an 05 silver Gen 2 T4 which has done 3 years sterling service. Thought I would share a few thoughts on the good and bad of all 3.

The Gen 1 was fantastic - bit of an impulse 2nd hand purchase, got it for a bargain £6k still with factory warranty and put on 50k mainly trouble free miles. Averaged 54mpg in summer and 49 in winter no matter how many people. Pretty luxurious for a small car and had everything we could want. Carried 4 to 5 people with ease, loads of luggage and often 4 bikes on the roof. Thought performance was great once you adapted driving style. Bit revvy on motorway sometimes but again we got used to that. Really liked the more compact size compared to the later ones and the manual heater/air con controls - much more intuitive. Dash a bit eccentric and never really understood why the gear selector goes up and down but the display shows it going across - didn't matter too much as it was instinctive after a short time. Liked the look of the car from the front but a bit ugly and under wheeled from rear half onwards. Only problems were needing replacement 12V Battery, new hybrid sensor, replacement for heavily corroded alloys, air conditioning regassing a couple of times. Sad to see it go.

Gen 2 felt a big step up in terms of interior space, pace and style. Like having hatch but probably not a big space advantage for luggage because of high floor. Fuel economy only slight improvement but performance significantly better on motorways with cruise control a big plus. Ride isn't as good as Gen 1 - less suppressed. Don't like the touch controls for heater/air con - much less intuitive and really need to take eyes off the road to select. In fact the touch screen feels too far away - the steering wheel controls would be an advantage if there weren't so many and so fiddly, again requiring you to take eyes off the road. Really like having reversing sensors - annoying at first but now indispensable. Only problem we have had must be a really rare one - rust along the front of bonnet - it is bubbling from inside and not caused by stone chips. Initially, dealer said it wasn't covered by the 7 year anti-perforation warranty as it is not on a seam - didn't make any sense and I insisted they refer it back to Toyota which they have done and awaiting results.

For Gen 3, I decided early on that I wanted the solar roof - I am in the renewable energy business so thought it was a must. Shame about having to have the smaller wheels which are a bit naff - chose silver body colour as I felt that the colour reduced the impact of the wheels. Wished I didn't have to have T spirit spec as I don't really want most of the extras. Only other options chosen were ipod integration and floor mats. Took 13 weeks for delivery. Think the car looks great with solar roof although I haven't really got to grips with its function yet. However, love having the sun roof - lightens up the interior and really good having the fresh air at this time of year. Performance is again a step up from other two and the drive and ride both feel more sophisticated and a lot quieter, so far economy is similar. Interior is more classy, seats are more comfortable, interior is huge and boot is meant to be bigger but I can't really tell from looking at it. It is a pleasant place to spend time.

Things I don't like on Gen 3: I don't like the dash display - too cluttered - much preferred having the economy info in colour on the main screen. Kind of like the head up display but too much reflection caused by its housing (and also the rest of the dash top). Can't get the hang of the heater/air con controls which require quite a bit of looking down to select. Whatever you choose seems to create a strong blast of cold air to face and also seems very slow to reach the required temperature. My £100 Tom Tom is much better than built in sat nav and the latter is already about a year out of date as mentioned on other threads - still shows all the A1 roundabouts that were removed a year ago. And of course it doesn't have speed cameras or the low level road ahead view of the Tom Tom and voice is too quiet. I find both arm rests too low and having rear cup holders in arm rest is a really big mistake. Why can't I download all contacts from my phone to the car in one go and not individually (am I missing something here?). Ipod integration is a bit rubbish despite requiring a full size user manual - can't give you the artist names or the playlist names and is really unintuitive - a real con for the price. Keyless entry - if you are going to do this, why not have a really thin key fob so you can carry it around in your pocket otherwise no advantage - where do you put it when you are driving?

I am probably being a bit over-critical of Gen 3 as it is certainly way ahead of the other two on drivability and performance but it is the first new car I have bought and I suppose I was hoping it would be perfect! Certainly didn't expect some of the above irritations. I really wish I could have chosen the solar roof with T4 spec as I don't want stuff like park assist, built in sat nav, hard drive and so on. Will update in a year or so after more time spent with car.

[Sagitar]

Thanks seljon. Very interesting comments and insights; especially for someone like me who has not had a Prius for long and went straight to a Gen 3.

[Ancient Nerd]

Hi, Comments below are based on 40, 000 in Gen II and 20,000 in Gen III over 2 years.

I've had reversing sensors in an earlier (non-Toyota) car, and now rear view camera in three cars. The T-Spirit camera (Gen II and Gen III) is the best option.

Your dealer is talking rubbish about the anti-perforation. Read the warranty description, and don't let them get away with it.

T-Spirit spec is really worth it for the rearview camera.

Drive in your Gen III is better because of the 15 inch wheels. I think Toyota made a big mistake using 17 inch on the T4 and T-Spirit, because the ride is harder and the economy is worse. I didn't buy a Prius to look sporty (these wheels don't do much else). I much preferred the comfort of the 16 inch Gen II wheels. 17" are great on good roads, but how many of thiose are there in the UK?

The boot is bigger. I have a suitcase which would only go in the Gen II sideways, taking up most of the space. In the Gen III it goes in lengthways, leaving much more useable space.

Agree about the heads-up. the reflection from the housing is a bit annoying. Mainly I think because the dash is too reflective. It should be matt.

Agree with comments about the satnav, although I live with it to avoid the trailing wires etc. It does however hurt to be at the mercy of a greedy Toyota.

Satnav 3D display is IMHO near enough to the TomTom perspective display.

Yes you can download all contacts from your phone. Or at least I managed it OK, once I'd installed an app on my Android. Others have done it with a base phone setup. It's not the car that's the problem, although it was on the Gen II..

I won't touch anything Apple, so Ipod integration is a non issue for me

I keep my key on a ring, clipped to a belt or in my pocket. No problem.

I have to agree that the combinations of possible features is bizarre. Although it has to be a problem when the car is made in Japan.

[johalareewi]

I didn't need any of the T4 or Tspirit extas so am quite happy with the T3 and the 15" wheels. Might have been tempted if the solar panel was an option on the T3 (it already has 15" wheels!!).

[Batsran]

For us the extra was worth it for full keyless entry, cruise control, Leather steering wheel, bluetooth (with voice that we now know how to use), alloys (wheel trims seem to get pinched at work) and finally the upgraded stereo and extra pair of Speakers. The stereo I suspect is the same but the specs suggest a different amp and all the Speakers are better spec.

I don't understand why auto lights or dimming rear view mirror are not in the car, but that's Toyota for you.

[seljon]

Thanks for the responses. I will need to investigate how to download all my contacts - mine is a windows mobile phone so it is probably incompatible with everything else! Interesting point about the smaller wheels being more comfortable - I think I have already got used to how they look so won't be doing anything with them. Don't really like the camera yet - looking ahead when you are reversing feels very odd to me and has been causing me some difficulty in parallel parking for the first time. Just for interest I have tried the parking assist several times after consulting the incomprehensible manual - haven't managed to make it work yet - so much for it being an assistant - I would be interested to hear if anyone finds the feature useful. I agree that the stereo is impressive and we have had a lot of fun with the voice recognition - it often misunderstands the commands in quite bizarre ways. One other observation - as with the Gen 2, the cruise control is attached to the steering wheel - I find this a bit of a hindrance as sometimes want to adjust it when not going in a straight line and can't easily find it - I wonder if this is a common feature in other cars.

[Ancient Nerd]

Thanks for the responses. I will need to investigate how to download all my contacts - mine is a windows mobile phone so it is probably incompatible with everything else! Interesting point about the smaller wheels being more comfortable - I think I have already got used to how they look so won't be doing anything with them. Don't really like the camera yet - looking ahead when you are reversing feels very odd to me and has been causing me some difficulty in parallel parking for the first time. Just for interest I have tried the parking assist several times after consulting the incomprehensible manual - haven't managed to make it work yet - so much for it being an assistant - I would be interested to hear if anyone finds the feature useful. I agree that the stereo is impressive and we have had a lot of fun with the voice recognition - it often misunderstands the commands in quite bizarre ways. One other observation - as with the Gen 2, the cruise control is attached to the steering wheel - I find this a bit of a hindrance as sometimes want to adjust it when not going in a straight line and can't easily find it - I wonder if this is a common feature in other cars.

You just need to make sure that your phone can transmit multiple contacts by bluetooth. I just had a look at the instructions from my previous windows mobile phone. It refers to beaming contact cards by bluetooth. However, it only refers to single contacts. From memory, it was a fairly quick process, but still tedious for a lot of contacts.

The camera comes into its own in the mode showing guidelines on the display. One set of lines shows where the car will end up if the steering wheel stays where it is. The other set shows where the car will be if you straighten the wheel immediately. I have these showing all the time.

The automated modes are a waste of space as far as I am concerned, as is the other display mode, with curves telling you when to turn the wheel.

This is much better than the Honda Civic I had, where the display was almost fish-eye. The only advantage was that you could see pedestrians in plenty of time.

The cruise control controls (!) on the Civic were much better, positioned on the RH side of the steering wheel - where I think they would be if Toyota UK had provided the sadly unavailable adaptive cruise control.

[Doesn'tExist]

Today I had first a lovely gen 3 drive by where I had my coffee...it just glides and so silent...and then a gen 2...and I was amazed by how much noise it makes...well it is quiet compared to most other vehicles, but noisy compared to a gen 3....

As you've owned them all is that your experience as well?

[Sagitar]

I have a Windows Mobile 'phone (an HTC HD2) and it downloaded all my contacts in a single go. I have done it a couple of times since, when I have changed storage cards, so Win Mobile will definitely do it. I am not expert at these things - could the Win Mobile version make a difference. Mine is running Windows Mobile 6 (OS version 5.2.21869.5.0.82).

The salesman at my dealer's seemed very knowledgeable about routines for loading various different 'phones. It could be worth a question to them.

[Ancient Nerd]

I have a Windows Mobile 'phone (an HTC HD2) and it downloaded all my contacts in a single go. I have done it a couple of times since, when I have changed storage cards, so Win Mobile will definitely do it. I am not expert at these things - could the Win Mobile version make a difference. Mine is running Windows Mobile 6 (OS version 5.2.21869.5.0.82).

The salesman at my dealer's seemed very knowledgeable about routines for loading various different 'phones. It could be worth a question to them.

Could well be the version, mine was an archaeological Windows Mobile 5

[kithmo]

Today I had first a lovely gen 3 drive by where I had my coffee...it just glides and so silent...and then a gen 2...and I was amazed by how much noise it makes...well it is quiet compared to most other vehicles, but noisy compared to a gen 3....

As you've owned them all is that your experience as well?

I've had my new Gen 3 T-Spirit for just over 2 weeks now, done 398 miles and I'm loving everything about it except the road noise. On perfectly smooth tarmac it is silent but on any other surface it's noisy (Michelin Primacy HP tyres).

SWMBO just bought a 2006 Gen 2 T4 and hers is a lot quieter.

The Gen 2 is a bit more blingy too, chrome interior door handles, more steering wheel controls and nice chrome strip across the front grill.

The Gen 3 looks a bit bare on the front, it could do with some chrome garnish on the grills.

[johalareewi]

The Gen 3 looks a bit bare on the front, it could do with some chrome garnish on the grills.

I'm not a big fan of bling and like the stealth look of the gen3.

[seljon]

I've had my new Gen 3 T-Spirit for just over 2 weeks now, done 398 miles and I'm loving everything about it except the road noise. On perfectly smooth tarmac it is silent but on any other surface it's noisy (Michelin Primacy HP tyres).

Funnily enough, I was just thinking that this morning - really noisy, almost groaning over some surfaces - my gen 1 was much quieter and gen 2 a bit. I have the smaller T3 wheels with not such low profile tyres too. Gen 2 didn't absorb bumps so well though so maybe some trade off there.

[seljon]

I just came across this thread I started back in 2010 when I had just bought my new gen 3. Thought I would do a quick update 9 years on!  We still have the car and have now covered 170,000 miles.  It has been a fantastic workhorse and, although it exhibits a few scratches and scrapes, it is looking in pretty good fettle inside and out. The only breakdown has been when the inverter went a few years ago - expensive repair but other than that the car has been faultless. 

There have been a few times when we thought we would sell it, including seriously considering trading in for a gen 4, but in the end we couldn't find a compelling reason to give it up and still very much enjoy using it.  This is not to say, however, that we haven't experienced other vehicle technologies in the meantime. 

Alongside the Prius, we had a Vauxhall Ampera company car for 3 years which we absolutely loved, covering 30k trouble-free miles.  I then bought a new Nissan Leaf 30kWh which introduced a bit of range anxiety but gave that smug feeling of driving without tailpipe emissions, and was often able to charge it from our home solar.  Used it much more than expected and after 30k miles and 3 years, sold it for only £2.5k less than I bought it.

We now have a Hyundai Kona 64kWh electric which is an amazing vehicle. Had to wait 7 months for delivery but it was worth it.  The worst range we have achieved is 240 miles and that was after bombing down the motorway in winter weather with a strong headwind at 75mph. It has a huge number of safety features (some of which can be a bit intrusive), great android auto integration and is very comfortable. Quality is excellent too.

It is interesting though going back to the Prius after driving the Kona.  Of course, the Prius is a bigger car, but what is quite striking is how far ahead of the game it was on comfort and equipment when it first came out. It still feels smooth and quiet at all speeds, the suspension soaks up our appalling roads, it returns 55mpg whatever the conditions, the bluetooth integration is excellent for phone and music (wish I had known instead of wasting money on the useless ipod integration), and having the sun roof is still a big plus.

It's a real shame Toyota has been so slow to the party on pure EVs as we would almost certainly have bought another Toyota if we could.  However, the game has moved on and Toyota has been left behind, whatever it says about self-charging hybrids. If you want an ICE, there are few better cars than hybrid Toyotas.  For everything else Tesla, Hyundai (and sister company Kia) are way ahead.  That said, I don't think we will be selling our Prius for some time.

[PeteB]

Interesting to compare the views.

After 17 years and over 310,000 Prius miles (all 4 generations), I've come up with a problem with my Gen 4 that is forcing me to swap it - it's too low, and I've started having problems with my hips since getting it.  I've no idea if it contributed to (or even caused) the problem, but either way, getting in and out is now very painful (and often noisy!).

I've recently ordered the new 5th Gen RAV4 (which now only comes as a Hybrid) with e4WD - should arrive about June.

If anyone is interested, I've done a write-up:   http://www.biwel.com/pmb01/RAV4_Dynamic_FWD_Test_Drive.pdf

The Gen 2 suffered from hard seats as well as suspension, and the 17" wheeled Gen 3 models suffered from extra road noise, bigger turning circle as well as the harder ride.  A couple of people I chatted to on another group swapped Gen 1s for 2s early on, and ended up selling the 2 and buying a second hand Gen 1 for the superior comfort.

I waited until the 2012 face lift for my Gen 3, which added electric folding heated mirrors, daytime running lights and the central MFD, plus I got my dealer to fit the cruise control switch (the whole of the rest of the system was present, as in T3 Gen 2s and all Gen 1s.  My Gen 4 was the top Excel model, but it was now possible to choose 15" wheel with all their benefits (and a £400 rebate!).  THe Gen 4 also gives about 100 extra miles per tank despite it holding 2 litres less than the Gen 3, and the Adaptive (radar) cruise control is wonderful.  I enever had any problems seeing the HUDs, but the colour version in the Gen 4 is much more 'solid' looking than the Gen 3.  Although the RAV4 has almost all the same toys, it does lack the HUD which I'll sorely miss.

I still can't find an EV that works for me (even looked at a Tesla Model S before getting the Gen 4, but even with a near 300 mile range with the optional larger Battery I just couldn't do some of the journeys I occasionally make due to a severe lack of sufficiently powerful charging stations in the East of England).again 

A PHEV would be a good compromise but I'm unreasonably obstinate about wanting a spare wheel amongst other things.    Before the Tesla I'd looked at a BMW i3 with Range Extender, but again lack of spare wheel scuppered it, plus the salesman admitted the range extender was for emergency get you home only, and not to help make longer journeys.

It's a shame about the Prius though, the Gen 4 is not only in my opinion the best Prius I've driven, it's the best car I've driven (if only it wasn't so low).  There's no other reason I'd consider changing it.

[FROSTYBALLS]

Toyota sre concentrating their EV development on the Chinese market, where policy is dictating that manufacturers have EV's on sale. Hence the C-HR EV going on sale in China at the start of this year, and further EV's to follow.

[seljon]

1 hour ago, PeteB said:

I still can't find an EV that works for me (even looked at a Tesla Model S before getting the Gen 4, but even with a near 300 mile range with the optional larger battery I just couldn't do some of the journeys I occasionally make due to a severe lack of sufficiently powerful charging stations in the East of England).again 

A PHEV would be a good compromise but I'm unreasonably obstinate about wanting a spare wheel amongst other things.    Before the Tesla I'd looked at a BMW i3 with Range Extender, but again lack of spare wheel scuppered it, plus the salesman admitted the range extender was for emergency get you home only, and not to help make longer journeys.

It's a shame about the Prius though, the Gen 4 is not only in my opinion the best Prius I've driven, it's the best car I've driven (if only it wasn't so low).  There's no other reason I'd consider changing it.

How often do you drive 300 miles without stopping for a break/meal though? We used to take the Leaf on trips of around 180 miles with one 30 minute stop to charge each way.  Found it was about the time we wanted to stop anyway.  Now in the Kona we can do 200 miles, then stop for 45 minutes, then do another 150 miles if required.  Plenty of rapid chargers springing up on the main trunk roads, although frustratingly there are still many different providers, all with their own cards/apps. 

The Kona is a game changer for us - if we didn't both need a car, we would get out of ICEs for good.

Agree about the Gen 4 Prius - friends have them and they are great cars in terms of comfort, efficiency and kit although the looks are still a bit polarising!

[PeteB]

44 minutes ago, seljon said:

How often do you drive 300 miles without stopping for a break/meal ...

Never.  Stopping isn't the problem - I live on the East Anglia coast on the Norfolk/Suffolk border, and some on my big journeys are north, staying along the East side of the country.

At the time I last looked, all of the charging location resources (websites) I could find could not provide me with confidence I could do this, or a once or twice monthly 250 mile round trip to Bedfordshire, with reliable ability to recharge.  There were no Tesla Supercharger stations this side of the A1 (there is now one at Elveden I believe) and if there was anywhere on the East of England routes I occasionally take to get sufficient and fast enough charge to get home the same day I failed to find any reference to it. I couldn't find a single hotel in Hull where I could plug in. If I was able to find somewhere I could plug it into a domestic socket, I'd be looking at 20+ hours to get enough juice to get home!  If I couldn't even manage that...

Ever since I started thinking about EVs ( which I did even more after I sometimes used a Gen 2 Prius in 2007/8 that had a 3rd party plug-in upgrade and could do 40 ish miles on EV), whenever I do one of my longer journeys I make a point of checking if there's anywhere to charge.  The last time I did the Hull trip, the answer was nowhere!

[seljon]

Unless you have a Tesla, the supercharger stations are a bit irrelevant. We live near Peterborough and never had a problem charging the Leaf on the east side of the country or on the main trunk routes. The existing Ecotricity stations at the service station are a bit flakey sometimes, but the accelerating roll out of Polar rapids, Instavolts and Genies (Shell) has transformed the situation.  Just had a quick look on plugshare and East Anglia, the home counties and the trunk roads on the east coast look pretty well catered for now.

By the way, I also tried that plug-in Prius and really wanted to get the conversion but at the time it was too expensive.  It did, however, inspire me to go down the plug-in route once production cars became available. 

[PeteB]

The Tesla was the only one that got close as I could have bought an extra wheel and kept it in the FRont TRUNK.  It had such a  big Battery only a really serious charger would be suitable.  Apparently 30 mins on one if their Superchargers would give about 180 miles.

Yes, the Prius conversion was £8k, which went up to £10k shortly after.  I once got 1500 miles one one tank of petrol and lots of charges.  Back then a full charge was 22p on my overnight tariff.

[HSDish]

On 4/9/2019 at 4:33 PM, FROSTYBALLS said:

Toyota sre concentrating their EV development on the Chinese market, where policy is dictating that manufacturers have EV's on sale. Hence the C-HR EV going on sale in China at the start of this year, and further EV's to follow.

I really desiderate/miss an Toyota model like/as KIA Niro which is about the same size ( lenght, hight and width, but with better inside space) as C -HR , and avaliable in HSD / PHEV / EV ( perfect if you need two cars for different driving , easy to adapt when swaping cars) and comes with 16" wheels (dont like those 18" on C-HR), electri adjustable driver seat, hight adjustable passenger seat , heathed rear seat, heated steering wheel etc.