Help !

[Craig Simpson]

Hi everyone,

Five weeks back I purchased a 2008 Rav4 and found difficulty with first & second gear as in difficulty engaging first gear then struggling to move up into second, the gear leaver seems to wobble and bobble stubbornly before 2nd gear can be engaged. This is made worse when setting off onto my local roundabout where traffic is quite fast and engaging second gear is a must in order to move off safely. I'm no mechanic and am stabbing in the dark as to just what might be the problem, however, I've been driving for over 25yrs and know that something is not right. Took the car back to the local dealer where they booked it in for 3 day's which they said would be the maximum time required, it would most likely be back in two. Eleven day's later and supposedly having had new gear linkages (think thats right), they said it was sorted. They blamed the time it took on the weather (snow) and gave me half a tank of diesel and a some free cleaning products and said they had valeted my car. Drove it over this weekend and still found difficulty engaging both 1st and 2nd gear, the transition from 1st to 2nd being very stiff and still wobbly, not in the slightest bit smooth. Took it back to dealership today where the service department Manager came out to test drive the car. In his opinion it felt fine, though he said he was not familiar with the Rav4 as he had just come from Mitsubishi. What's that all about ? Anyway, after much patronizing he agreed to book it in later this week and said perhaps it needed some adjustment, they would change the gear oil in case some muck had got in.........oh, and they would valet my car again.

Am I going mad or are these people taking the proverbial because they know something more costly is wrong, but don't want to sort it ?

Any help/advice much appreciated as I feel a bit sick............

Craig

[NMaria]

What a horrible experience to have, especially so soon after buying the car. I'm no mechanic either but do know that this model is known to have a notchy gear change from 1st to 2nd, and this cold weather does nothing to improve matters. I'm afraid I cannot offer advice as to whether there is something wrong with yours, but it did occur to me that, as the service dept manager doesn't know the characteristics of the car and is thus not well-placed to judge whether there is anything wrong with it, perhaps you could ask if you could have a quick drive in their RAV4 demonstrator. That way you could compare the two and would at least know whether yours was any worse than a new one in good order.

Either way I hope you get a speedy and satisfactory resolution.

[Davrav]

Hi everyone,

Five weeks back I purchased a 2008 Rav4 and found difficulty with first & second gear as in difficulty engaging first gear then struggling to move up into second, the gear leaver seems to wobble and bobble stubbornly before 2nd gear can be engaged. This is made worse when setting off onto my local roundabout where traffic is quite fast and engaging second gear is a must in order to move off safely. I'm no mechanic and am stabbing in the dark as to just what might be the problem, however, I've been driving for over 25yrs and know that something is not right. Took the car back to the local dealer where they booked it in for 3 day's which they said would be the maximum time required, it would most likely be back in two. Eleven day's later and supposedly having had new gear linkages (think thats right), they said it was sorted. They blamed the time it took on the weather (snow) and gave me half a tank of diesel and a some free cleaning products and said they had valeted my car. Drove it over this weekend and still found difficulty engaging both 1st and 2nd gear, the transition from 1st to 2nd being very stiff and still wobbly, not in the slightest bit smooth. Took it back to dealership today where the service department Manager came out to test drive the car. In his opinion it felt fine, though he said he was not familiar with the Rav4 as he had just come from Mitsubishi. What's that all about ? Anyway, after much patronizing he agreed to book it in later this week and said perhaps it needed some adjustment, they would change the gear oil in case some muck had got in.........oh, and they would valet my car again.

Am I going mad or are these people taking the proverbial because they know something more costly is wrong, but don't want to sort it ?

Any help/advice much appreciated as I feel a bit sick............

Craig

Don't know which version of RAV you have but I have an 08 XTR D4D and certainly don't experience the issues you seem to have. I did, initially, find first to second gear changes a bit 'notchy' but do not notice it at all now. I seem to recollect that there was a fix for similar problems on earlier models that involved a modified bracket being fitted but Anchorman's the chap for definitive answers on that one.

As Maria suggests, try to find a second hand one of similar age and ask for a test drive for comparison.

[anchorman]

Well! Firstly I would be nervous now they have been fiddling with it. The cables are adjustable but would you say it is worse now than when they started or no different?

Secondly, if it has had the gear oil changed in the past and it was not filled with the proper 75W oil it will be a swine to get gears.

Finally, you do need to do as the others say and try another because it depends what you are comparing it with. These 6 speed boxes are never as clean changing as we would like (some less than others) and the low temps don't help. You can get cleaner changes by shifting from 1st to 2nd at low revs (soon after moving off) and taking your time through the change. If you ever pass this way, call in and let me have a feel at it.

[Craig Simpson]

What a horrible experience to have, especially so soon after buying the car. I'm no mechanic either but do know that this model is known to have a notchy gear change from 1st to 2nd, and this cold weather does nothing to improve matters. I'm afraid I cannot offer advice as to whether there is something wrong with yours, but it did occur to me that, as the service dept manager doesn't know the characteristics of the car and is thus not well-placed to judge whether there is anything wrong with it, perhaps you could ask if you could have a quick drive in their RAV4 demonstrator. That way you could compare the two and would at least know whether yours was any worse than a new one in good order.

Either way I hope you get a speedy and satisfactory resolution.

Hi Maria,

Many Thanks for your reply. It was a bit sickening having bought a more expensive car than normal for me, then to find your elation short lived as you find fault with your new purchase. From what people have said it does sound the 'norm' that Rav4's can feel a bit notchy changing from 1st to 2nd. This does make me feel a bit more reassured. Couldn't believe the Manager when he took me out in the car and said he had little knowledge of the product and how it should feel, even worse than that I couldn't believe I didn't reply.............lol. Think I was shocked ! You are right about having a quick go in their 'demonstrator', the car goes in tomorrow so we'll see what happens.

Thanks for your help.

Craig in Burnley.

[Craig Simpson]

Hi everyone,

Five weeks back I purchased a 2008 Rav4 and found difficulty with first & second gear as in difficulty engaging first gear then struggling to move up into second, the gear leaver seems to wobble and bobble stubbornly before 2nd gear can be engaged. This is made worse when setting off onto my local roundabout where traffic is quite fast and engaging second gear is a must in order to move off safely. I'm no mechanic and am stabbing in the dark as to just what might be the problem, however, I've been driving for over 25yrs and know that something is not right. Took the car back to the local dealer where they booked it in for 3 day's which they said would be the maximum time required, it would most likely be back in two. Eleven day's later and supposedly having had new gear linkages (think thats right), they said it was sorted. They blamed the time it took on the weather (snow) and gave me half a tank of diesel and a some free cleaning products and said they had valeted my car. Drove it over this weekend and still found difficulty engaging both 1st and 2nd gear, the transition from 1st to 2nd being very stiff and still wobbly, not in the slightest bit smooth. Took it back to dealership today where the service department Manager came out to test drive the car. In his opinion it felt fine, though he said he was not familiar with the Rav4 as he had just come from Mitsubishi. What's that all about ? Anyway, after much patronizing he agreed to book it in later this week and said perhaps it needed some adjustment, they would change the gear oil in case some muck had got in.........oh, and they would valet my car again.

Am I going mad or are these people taking the proverbial because they know something more costly is wrong, but don't want to sort it ?

Any help/advice much appreciated as I feel a bit sick............

Craig

Don't know which version of RAV you have but I have an 08 XTR D4D and certainly don't experience the issues you seem to have. I did, initially, find first to second gear changes a bit 'notchy' but do not notice it at all now. I seem to recollect that there was a fix for similar problems on earlier models that involved a modified bracket being fitted but Anchorman's the chap for definitive answers on that one.

As Maria suggests, try to find a second hand one of similar age and ask for a test drive for comparison.

Hi,

Thanks for getting back to me. My Rav4 is an 08 XTR D4D same as yours. When looking to buy the car it was high up on a ramp stupidly I didn't test drive it, they took me out in a similar model, this was fine and showed no sign of the problems I'm experiencing now. Having said that, from what you are saying it sounds par for the course for 1st & 2nd to be a bit 'notchy'. It seemed 'notchy' when I first drove it and that's why I took it back, thing is, after eleven day's of them looking at it and giving it me back........it went from 'notchy' to downright difficult/dangerous when pulling out of junctions etc. The car goes back in tomorrow, so fingers crossed eh !

Thanks for your help.

Craig.

[Craig Simpson]

Well! Firstly I would be nervous now they have been fiddling with it. The cables are adjustable but would you say it is worse now than when they started or no different?

Secondly, if it has had the gear oil changed in the past and it was not filled with the proper 75W oil it will be a swine to get gears.

Finally, you do need to do as the others say and try another because it depends what you are comparing it with. These 6 speed boxes are never as clean changing as we would like (some less than others) and the low temps don't help. You can get cleaner changes by shifting from 1st to 2nd at low revs (soon after moving off) and taking your time through the change. If you ever pass this way, call in and let me have a feel at it.

Hi Anchorman,

If I wasn't 'nervous' I am now..........lol. Just kidding. Never having had a 4x4 before I'm not used to 'notchy' and downright difficult gear changes and obviously thought this can't be right. From what you are saying it seems this can and does occur with 6 speed gearboxes. When they returned my car after having renewed some linkages it was worse......this seemed weird to me given the mechanic said they were worn down and they had replaced them. I have been driving for over 25 years and have never experienced a near accident because I couldn't engage second gear on pulling into a very busy roundabout. So I went back and they have booked the car in for tomorrow and said it might need some adjustment and that they'd replace the gear oil (presumably they'll put the right stuff in?). When I purchased the car it was on a ramp so I couldn't test drive it, so the sales rep took me out in the same model though it was a 2010 as opposed to my 2008. There was no such problem changing gear in the Rav4 I took for a test drive so I guessed what I was experiencing wasn't the norm. But from what you are saying it sounds like perhaps I might have to live with it.

Just hope they don't have it eleven day's like last week.

I'll keep you posted........

Cheers mate,

Craig in Burnley.

[Davrav]

By all accounts, the gear change in the 2010 version is a LOT smoother than the previous version. When you drove the demonstrator you were not comparing like for like. It was unfair of the dealer to do this in my opinion.

[anchorman]

By all accounts, the gear change in the 2010 version is a LOT smoother than the previous version. When you drove the demonstrator you were not comparing like for like. It was unfair of the dealer to do this in my opinion.

Having said that Dave, there is now scope to put pressure on the dealer to make it as good! He's shot himself in the foot there

[Davrav]

By all accounts, the gear change in the 2010 version is a LOT smoother than the previous version. When you drove the demonstrator you were not comparing like for like. It was unfair of the dealer to do this in my opinion.

Having said that Dave, there is now scope to put pressure on the dealer to make it as good! He's shot himself in the foot there

Agreed

[redrob]

Hi craig

Have a quick read of my post? It seems that you have a very simular problem to me. My Rav4 is an XTR 2.2 diesl 2009 (7000mls) and I have started to get gear selection problems from 1st to 2nd gear. Mine crunches when selecting 2nd gear, and also it can be difficult to reselect 1st gear. Trouble is though, mine is intermittent. Its doing my head in! Have a read and see what you think!

Dave

[Craig Simpson]

Hi craig

Have a quick read of my post? It seems that you have a very simular problem to me. My Rav4 is an XTR 2.2 diesl 2009 (7000mls) and I have started to get gear selection problems from 1st to 2nd gear. Mine crunches when selecting 2nd gear, and also it can be difficult to reselect 1st gear. Trouble is though, mine is intermittent. Its doing my head in! Have a read and see what you think!

Dave

Hi Dave,

Certainly sounds like the problem I'm having. The thing is, you perhaps naively trust these people to do right by the customer and not treat you with contempt. When I went back to complain they looked at me like I was stupid, drove the car and passed over the fact it was 'bobbling' with difficulty to go in the selected gear. In short I felt like I was being 'humoured' as someone who was particularly fussy. I have to take the car back in tomorrow and I'm in fact dreading it, it's embarrassing !

Purchasing a new car (new to me) should be a pleasurable experience unless you buy one from some backstreet garage, you don't expect this from the main Toyota Dealer in your area.

Craig

[redrob]

I am going to do as Anchorman has stated! Do a comparison test run, and if that car has no fault write to TGB and or demand a gear box exchange under waranty. If yours is a 2008 model its still under waranty, You should do the same!

Good luck! I think we need it!!

Dave

[Craig Simpson]

I am going to do as Anchorman has stated! Do a comparison test run, and if that car has no fault write to TGB and or demand a gear box exchange under waranty. If yours is a 2008 model its still under waranty, You should do the same!

Good luck! I think we need it!!

Dave

Taking my Rav4 2008 with 25,000 miles back in at 9am tomorrow, we'll see what they say this time........I'll keep you posted Dave !

Craig

[anchorman]

Careful demanding!!! You have to negotiate with the person who will decide what you can have. It pays to be diplomatic

[redrob]

Hi Craig

Did you have any joy at the dealer today?

I called my dealership this morning and told them that I am not satisfied with what has been done. :ffs: The car is just as it was when I took it in the first time.

I requested that I would like to do a like for like comparison test drive, even though they say they have done one.

Well!! Now I'v got another treck back to the dealer tomorrow for a test run in another Rav4.

Lets hope it's for good reason!! Let you know how I get on.

Dave

[Craig Simpson]

Careful demanding!!! You have to negotiate with the person who will decide what you can have. It pays to be diplomatic

Took the Rav4 in yesterday morning at 9am. Told the mechanic I was aware of several Rav owners with similar problems to mine, to which he replied smiling....'I couldn't possibly comment'. Asked what they intended to do and they said they would have another look & possibly they could do some adjusting to linkages they put in last week, change oil etc. Asked if it required a new 2010 Gearbox as the one I test drove appeared smooth, he replied, 'it might come to that'.

4PM today and they hadn't phoned so I got on to them and spoke with the service Manager. He was very apologetic and said he wasn't satisfied with the vehicle & had been onto Toyota where it was identified there had been some problems, he said they were going to fit a new Hub & Synchro which wouldn't be in until Monday when they would give me a call back. Thus far I purchased the car on 1st November, noticed problems with gear changing which got progressively worse, booked car in 29th November for 3 day's for them to carry out work, they had vehicle until 9th December. Went back to Toyota on Monday 13th December to say there was no change, couldn't book car in until 16th December when they said it needed new Hub/Synchro etc which won't come until Monday 20th December..............*****, they've had the car almost more than me!!!!!!

I did, however, remain calm throughout. But buying a £17,000 car is not meant to feel as bad as this.

Craig in Burnley..........Now with Flu.

[Craig Simpson]

Hi Craig

Did you have any joy at the dealer today?

I called my dealership this morning and told them that I am not satisfied with what has been done. :ffs: The car is just as it was when I took it in the first time.

I requested that I would like to do a like for like comparison test drive, even though they say they have done one.

Well!! Now I'v got another treck back to the dealer tomorrow for a test run in another Rav4.

Lets hope it's for good reason!! Let you know how I get on.

Dave

Hi Dave................No Joy as such.

Gonna put in new Hub/Synchro which won't come until Monday. So it's back to driving the Toyota Aygo.

They've had the car more than me............

Will keep you posted and you likewise.

Craig

[redrob]

Craig! Keep me informed on your situation....

!

I have been to dealer today - Read my update!!! :ffs:

Dave

[anchorman]

Its the very first gearbox problem requiring new syncros I've heard of. I have heard of input shaft oil seals and I have heard of "notchier than expected" but never resulting in a strip down. We don't always get to hear of everything though.

At least they are doing it - I've known other manufacturers walk away from the owners.

[Craig Simpson]

Its the very first gearbox problem requiring new syncros I've heard of. I have heard of input shaft oil seals and I have heard of "notchier than expected" but never resulting in a strip down. We don't always get to hear of everything though.

At least they are doing it - I've known other manufacturers walk away from the owners.

Hi Anchorman,

You are talking to a mechanical moron here and the technical stuff is wasted on me I'm afraid, however, surely it would be a bit much for manufacturers to walk away from a problem as dangerous as that which both Dave from Durham & I are experiencing. It's one thing to have a 'notchy' gear change and another to experience serious difficulty engaging 2nd after pulling into a busy roundabout, surely it's a safety matter as well. Can't quite believe that Toyota with all there vast experience expect your average driver to have to put up with this after only having purchased the car a few weeks ago.

It's downright diabolical......If I'd have know I'd have purchased a Freelander, Volkswagen or Honda 4x4 instead.

Craig.

[anchorman]

I can understand your frustration but you keep using this example of starting away at an island. I'm not aware that joining an island too slowly is a life threatening or dangerous situation.

It would appear that yours has been identified as having a fault but Dave is saying his is the same as the others he's tried so you can't compare the 2. Let them have a go at fixing it and see what happens. Hopefully you will be pleased but as I said at the beginning, these can be notchy boxes at the best of times so don't expect it to be perfect. From what I can see they are not walking away, they are going to great lengths to fix it. Stripping that box down is a huge job.

You may have had a better experience with another brand but LRs are notoriously unreliable and my mate who has a CRV with 16k on it is having great difficulty in getting Honda to fix a rumbling noise from the front transmission area. They claim they can't hear it let alone fix it and you can barely hear yourself think when it is doing it. The Germans aren't all they are made up to be either and I know people that have had horrendous problems with VW and BMW 4X4s.

I honestly understand your frustration but if they can just get that gearchange acceptable for you I think you will struggle to better that motor. Keep your chin up.

[bothwell_buyer]

changing gear on a damndrover is comparable to stirring a mix of haggis and porage oats. At least with the haggis, you know what the outcome is !

[anchorman]

[Craig Simpson]

I can understand your frustration but you keep using this example of starting away at an island. I'm not aware that joining an island too slowly is a life threatening or dangerous situation.

It would appear that yours has been identified as having a fault but Dave is saying his is the same as the others he's tried so you can't compare the 2. Let them have a go at fixing it and see what happens. Hopefully you will be pleased but as I said at the beginning, these can be notchy boxes at the best of times so don't expect it to be perfect. From what I can see they are not walking away, they are going to great lengths to fix it. Stripping that box down is a huge job.

You may have had a better experience with another brand but LRs are notoriously unreliable and my mate who has a CRV with 16k on it is having great difficulty in getting Honda to fix a rumbling noise from the front transmission area. They claim they can't hear it let alone fix it and you can barely hear yourself think when it is doing it. The Germans aren't all they are made up to be either and I know people that have had horrendous problems with VW and BMW 4X4s.

I honestly understand your frustration but if they can just get that gearchange acceptable for you I think you will struggle to better that motor. Keep your chin up.

Don't mean to rant or keep mentioning 'Roundabouts', but where I live there is a large one and traffic from the M65 Motorway filters onto it. They have a head start at you from some distance, obviously, having pulled away in 1st and then not being able to engage 2nd asap DOES cause some stress when a car/lorry is about to punch you up the rear............I rest my case & won't mention them again.

Well, the snow is here and my Rav4 is in the garage. As you say, they do seem to be attempting to sort it, I'll give them that. So I'll just have to bare with them and see where it all ends. To be honest...........I just want my damn car back !!!!!!!!!!

Sorry to go on so..............

Thanks for all your input/advice. We'll get through to the next stage next week and hopefully there will be some improvement then as you say, I may well just have to live with it.

Craig in a Sunny & Snowy Burnley.