Replacement Engine For 7Gen Celica

[TiggerUK]

Hi there.

I have a seventh gen Celica - by far the most awesome car i've ever owned, it truly makes driving a pleasure and I love it very much!

I bought it second hand a couple of years ago when it had 60k on the clock - its now on 85k and unfortunately due to a change in jobs which has had me doing 150miles a day to work and back the oil problem which i was aware of but had not anticipated how much faster it would go through oil when it does a lot of motorway miles.

I took it to the garage as I was concerned about a rattling coming from somewhere in the engine and I've been told that somethings rattling in the bottom end of the engine and its going to need a complete new engine.

I love that car very much and so I am inclined to go ahead and get the engine replaced but would like to ask your advice before i decide how to proceed.

I am told that I can get either a new engine from toyota (does anyone know how much I'd be looking at and how to go about arranging that) or a reconditioned/used engine which may or may not come with a warranty/guarantee - if anyone has any advice/recommendations/warnings about this please let me know.

Given that the car has 85k on the clock is it worth my while replacing the engine - will the car then last me or is it likely to develop new faults?

My car is the 140bhp VVTi model - can I consider getting the 190bhp engine from the VVTLi?

I've read somewhere that it may be possible to get the engine for a gen 8 fitted (which i read has a better bottom block) has anyone got any insights into that possibility?

I'm sorry for dropping a load of questions on you like this, but I'm a little bit panicked here and really need to get the best advice I can as I don't know what path I'd get led down if I just took it to a garage and asked em to fix it!!

Thankyou in advance for any advice you can offer - I'm sure everyone here shares my love for celicas so I know you can understand how much I want to get my baby back to full health!

Tigger

[Scarlett Arrow]

Hi there.

I have a seventh gen Celica - by far the most awesome car i've ever owned, it truly makes driving a pleasure and I love it very much!

I bought it second hand a couple of years ago when it had 60k on the clock - its now on 85k and unfortunately due to a change in jobs which has had me doing 150miles a day to work and back the oil problem which i was aware of but had not anticipated how much faster it would go through oil when it does a lot of motorway miles.

I took it to the garage as I was concerned about a rattling coming from somewhere in the engine and I've been told that somethings rattling in the bottom end of the engine and its going to need a complete new engine.

I love that car very much and so I am inclined to go ahead and get the engine replaced but would like to ask your advice before i decide how to proceed.

I am told that I can get either a new engine from toyota (does anyone know how much I'd be looking at and how to go about arranging that) or a reconditioned/used engine which may or may not come with a warranty/guarantee - if anyone has any advice/recommendations/warnings about this please let me know.

A new Short Block from Mr T would cost more than the car is worth. I'd strongly advise against having a reconditioned Engine fitted too. Far too many fail again through crap rebuild quality

Given that the car has 85k on the clock is it worth my while replacing the engine - will the car then last me or is it likely to develop new faults?

That depends on the cost of either getting your Engine repaired, or a 2nd hand replacement.

My car is the 140bhp VVTi model - can I consider getting the 190bhp engine from the VVTLi?

Yes, but you'd also need an Engine Mounting/ECU/Loom too. On top of that your insurance and fuel consumption would increase.

I've read somewhere that it may be possible to get the engine for a gen 8 fitted (which i read has a better bottom block) has anyone got any insights into that possibility?

The Gen 8 won't be on sale for a while yet, what you mean is the face lift model introduced in late 2002. Fitting a face lift Engine would seem to be the best option, but only if you can find one at the right price. Sorry to say it, but I'd also consider getting rid of the car sharpish, is part exchanging yours for the face lift an option?

I'm sorry for dropping a load of questions on you like this, but I'm a little bit panicked here and really need to get the best advice I can as I don't know what path I'd get led down if I just took it to a garage and asked em to fix it!!

Thankyou in advance for any advice you can offer - I'm sure everyone here shares my love for celicas so I know you can understand how much I want to get my baby back to full health!

Tigger

HTH :)

[Son of MGmike]

Tigger,

Your plea for help encouraged me to register and respond to your post....

I too have recently become a Gen7 owner and I love it..

Yes it burns oil on motorway runs and, like you, I expect to do an engine rebuild sooner rather than later!

The difference between us is my dad MGmike has all the kit and years of practice with old motors to DIY..

His recommendation is refurbish not replace. You can fit a 190 but these come with there own problems (valve lifter issues). He reckons the best way to go is to recondition the engine you have or buy an exchange unit. If you don't know of any local workshops, have a search on fleebay for many people offering supply and fit. It'll cost about a grand... Forget buying new that'll be mega bucks..

Get a one with warranty and relax for a year....

MGmike says ask the followng questions before buying:-

Has the engine been fitted with new pistons, if no walk away! If yes check they have post 03 oil holes in them. Apparently they have better oil return holes and flow back to the sump (what ever that means)....

Ask if the crankshaft is new or reground, new is better, reground is ok but should be cheaper.

Ask if there is a record of the bore measurements before the pistons were fitted. You might need help interpreting these but if you post them on here I'm sure you'll get a lot of help to confirm they are good...

MGmike say don't panic but expect the car to be off the road for a couple of weeks while you get it sorted. That might cause you a few problems getting to work but you could always throw a sickie for a week! I hear there's a bad flu virus going around again!!

Good luck and let us all know how you get on

Son of MGmike....

[TiggerUK]

Thanks for that reply Son of MGmike, some invaluable information there. Much appreciated =)

[Scarlett Arrow]

Thanks for that reply Son of MGmike, some invaluable information there. Much appreciated =)

:(

[TiggerUK]

Oh my God, Scarlett - I'm so sorry, I honestly just thought your post contained HTH which I thought may be forum slang which i wasn't up on yet!! Doh!!

Thank you very much for your advice - I'm getting some quotes for a rebuild today, we've found a pretty good performance specialist garage that I'm favouring for this job.

Once again, I'm sorry for being so rude - thankyou for your advice, you're a superstar! =D

[Scarlett Arrow]

That's OK, I suspected that might be the case. HTH stands for "hope that helps".

Hopefully the quotes for getting your Engine repaired won't prove too painful, but I was keen to point out how risky it is to buy a re-con Engine, that area of the trade has many cowboys operating.

Keep us informed of developments :)

[BGDaz]

Ive had this issue (well still do :( )

It has come down to a SERIOUS rattle on the bottom end, I have been to a Specialist in refurbs and they have told me the with the amount of rattle there is, a replacement really is the only way to go on mine (They said there may be too much damage inside to repair)

Is this going to be the case or am I being optimistic to hope for a repair ... Ive been looking on Fleebay and there are some reputable sellers on there that seem pretty genuine about the £800-£900 mark for a recon at about 50k that includes fitting?

[Son of MGmike]

BGDaz,

If its still running on all 4 pots the damage is likely to resticted to the crankshaft and maybe one rod. If the crank is too far gone to regrind the only option will be to replace. The extra cost over a regrind will be around £200 (there are some new ones listed on the well know auction site!). A replacement engine might be the easier option as long as its from a facelift model but these do cost ££££

Keep us posted on progress and if you do replace (Tigger this applies to you also) I'll give you a tenner for the duff one just for the practice of taking it to bits!!

[BGDaz]

I have taken your advice further up this thread Mike (Many Thanks !!) and have emailed the seller of them all those questions, It doesn't state the Engine year so if it was post face lift so that will be my next question ! It does say it has the hardened Oil pumps and Blocks ...

If I still have then engine at the end of the replacement, you are more than welcome to come take it off my hands (I do live in Bristol though).

[Son of MGmike]

BGDaz, I should've checked that! I do like driving but Bristol is a bit of a trek!!

The good news is I'll have my own spare to play with soon! I've just agreed to buy a 26K unit out of an 05 bodily abused motor and I only need to collect it from Preston! It was too good to pass up at the price as it was cheaper than most of the eBay recon units and will workout about the same as a rebuild. I don't intend to strip it to find out the differences with the early unit :D

I will be stripping the early unit and rebuilding for resale but that won't be until the end of the summer.

[tros84]

I am thinking of replacing my celica vvti engine because of a ratteling sound it gives off... the site idealengine popped up and I requested a quote..before I go ahead and buy it, the there anyone who has done business with them and are satisfied with the reconditioned engine they sell???

thanks much

Alex

[Scarlett Arrow]

I wouldn't consider a recon engine, as you have no idea of the standard of work carried out. Source an engine from a face lift VVTi.

[tros84]

Here is a list of what has been done to the reconditioned engineUnits sourced from low mileage vehicles

Engine blocks throughly cleaned and surfaces treated

Engine Block Surfaces Machined Flat

Tolerances checked on wearable items

Oil pumps inspected or replaced where needed

Cylinder heads skimmed or replaced where needed

New OEM oil seals installed

New OEM valve seals fitted

Valve seats machined

Valves lapped to ensure a tight seal

Block cylinders inspected for cracks

New cylinder liners fitted

Cylinders machined to factory specs

New uprated gas nitride piston rings fitted

Connecting rods inspected and machined where necessary

Crankshaft crack tested, ground and polished to specifications

New OEM big end bearings fitted

New OEM main bearings fitted

New OEM spec Eristic head gasket fitted

All bolts torqued to OEM specs according to Autodata

Assembled units oil pressure tested

Assembled units compression tested

[tros84]

Can U have a look and give a response

Thanks

[armoredfist2002]

Listen to Scarlett Arrow, avoid a recon engine, just because they said they have done something doesn't mean they have, and they usually just change parts for the cheapest available, I'm not saying all recone engines are bad but you need to find out from past customers and see how good the company is not just a list of what's been done.

What's the price of the recon engine?

[tros84]

Its 800 for the engine

[Scarlett Arrow]

armored and I have been frequenting Celica forums for many years (2004 personally), and have lost count of the number of horror stories arising from recon engines.

If the engine is costing £800, how much do you think your 2000 140 is actually worth?.

[Parts-King]

OEM is one of the most overused / misused words ever!!!! It has no value, all it means is that the specific manufacturer makes parts for the original manufacturers, it does NOT mean it is the original quality and can be far from it, and very often is. Original is original manufacturers part, OEM can be any cheap and cheerful part, made by the people who made the original parts, but not the same quality

Kingo

[Devon Aygo]

Although the parts listed state new piston rings, are they the new modified piston ring design along with the modified pistons used by Toyota to cure the oil burning issue, I very much doubt it.

You stand a very good chance of inheriting a recon engine that has none of the required modifications to stop it burning oil