Worst Automatic On Test

[FROSTYBALLS]

Which? has just published a test on eight small automatic cars - Jazz, Golf, Note, A-class, Lexus CT200, Soul, Civic and Yaris. Transmissions varied between 3 CVT's, 2 conventional autos, 1 twin clutch DSG and 2 automated manuals. The two automated manuals (Civic and Yaris) did the poorest - with the Civic suffering from a lumpy gearchange and the Yaris's gearchanges being jerky and ill-matched to the engine revs. The Yaris was described as worst on test. The CVT's (Jazz, Lexus and A-class) did the best - although the A-class was thirsty.

Interestingly Which? also gave ratings for model range reliability (out of five stars). Lexus and A-class 5 star. Jazz and Yaris 4 star. Note and Soul 3 star. Golf 2 star. Civic 1 star.

[Cyker]

Pfft, I could have told them that

IMHO the only automatics worth a damn are real torque-converter autos, DSG or Prius/HSD-style eCVTs.

Real CVTs are dead smooth but they seem so damned fragile and MMT/Tiptronic variants are just so horrid to drive in auto mode that the only people who like them drive them in manual mode anyway!

This another plus for electric motors. They don't need gears and still out perform fossil burners at all levels! :D

Now, if we can just invent a better way to store electricity than chemical batteries...

[Hartside]

I've never tried the Yaris MMT, but from what I've read I guess I don't really want to! The DSG in the Golf is superb and one of the best auto boxes out there, but they do still suffer from problems. The Civic auto I test drove was terrible and actually nearly caused an accident on a roundabout during a test drive as it got muddled up, didn't select and just went nowhere for what seemed like minutes, but was probably about 3 seconds (an eternity when a truck is bearing down on you)

I fully agree with their reliability figure on the Civic. The new Civic (manual) was the worst car I have owned in my life, bought it brand new in 06 and it was in the dealers 14 times in 18 months for all kinds of problems before I'd had enough and got rid. Honda customer service and unwillingness to do fundamental rectification work was not what I was expecting. Honda reliability - pah!

[newsboy]

I have now had my Yaris T Spirit with auto gearbox for a couple of weeks. It is not the best auto gearbox in the world but I think it has come in for some unfair criticism from people who have not really driven if long enough to get used to it. The change from first to second and second to third can be noticeable depending on how much welly you are giving it at the time.

But after that (there are six gears in all) it is really damn smooth and you have to be concentrating to tell where the changes occur. It is marvellous to be able to come up to a T junction, stop on the brake and then move off instantly without a load of clutch prodding and gear stirring.

Sure, traditional autos are now superb but the downside in worse fuel consumption due to the load of hydraulic fluid you are stirring, especially when cold. Fuel consumption with the Multi-mode Yaris is, if anything, slightly better than that of the manual and I for one am prepared to accept a occasionally noticeable change in return for no fuel penalty.

I find that you very soon stop mentally "driving" the car and just let it get on with it. The result is smooth and restful driving. You won't catch me going back to a manual in spite of what Which and others mights say.

[Cookie-monster]

In my humble opinion, you cant beat the CVT transmssion - I had CVT's in a previous Nissan Primera and a Rover 45, both with Tiptronic M6 manual override. They are so smooth and easy to drive, and as long as the CVT fluid is changed every 40K miles, they are reliable. The Primera had 120K on the clock when I sold it and the CVT was sweet as a nut.

The only thing that takes some getting used to is the full throttle response which throws the engine up to 5K+ RPM and holds it there while the car accelerates. Some CVT's have torque convertors, some have fluid clutches, but they are the best auto box by far. Toyota are sticking to the auto clutch MMT because it has less emmisions and is better on MPG than a CVT, and with the price of fuel and road tax these days, people are always after the most economical cars possible, and the CVT is not particularly economical, nor does it do well on emmisions either - most are 20-30 g/km higher than the standard manual with the same engine capacity.

Unfortunately, the smoother and easier the transmission, the more it will cost to run, and the more polluting it will be - which is why manufacturers are moving away from the standard full auto boxes.

I am surprised that the all singing all dancing Honda got 1 star in the reliabilty rating? have Honda gone to the dogs now as well in terms of reliabilty? Is there any manufacturers left any more that are capable of producing something decent AND reliable? - seems not.

[Cyker]

Well, there is once exception; The Toyota HSD is super smooth and quite economical :)

If I was (forced) to get any auto right now it'd probably be something with a HSD in it since you can't get real autos and I dislike CVT and MMT-style transmissions...

I must admit I like the control of a true manual tho', just because you have a choice of how to drive the car which you don't have in automatics.

[gloucester]

Only had Yaris T Spirit 2 weeks and the MMT box is really good. Had one for 2 years in Spain and no problems at all. My wife likes to drive it so it must be OK!!!!!!! To be fair they do take a bit of getting used to. So does a "standard" auto when one first drives them. On a light throttle the Yaris gear changes are barely perceptable. Heavy throttle more noticable. Those of you that have worked in the car trade many years back, as I did, will remember auto boxes of old when driven hard. You could feel the gear changes on them.

IE 7.3 litre Jenson Interceptor! Even Rolls Royce. Does anyone remember the Mini autos of the 60's and 70's!!!! Not that they could be driven hard. Great fun as they were someone elses cars. Don't know how I stayed on the road sometimes.

[Cyker]

It's not the fact that you feel the change, it's when the change makes it feel like someone just rammed you or you just rammed someone

The scariest thing you can do with an MMT is trying to emerge onto a busy high-speed roundabout - A manual, a real auto, a DSG, even the Prius eCVT will get you in but the MMT will probably get you into an accident unless it's in manual mode.

It's fine when driven gently, but if you put it under any sort of pressure it is just horrible.

It seems to pick gears purely on speed; It seems to have no concept of torque and doesn't sync speeds like an experienced manual driver would.

When I'm driving 'properly', you wouldn't even feel my gear changes because I use the accelerator and clutch to sync the shaft speeds so there is no '*****'.

Of course, when I'm joyriding then the shifts are a lot less refined due to the large acceleration deltas :D

[newsboy]

I have now had my new Yaris with MMT for four weeks. At first I was rather doubtful especially with first and second changes which could be bit unpredictable. But now things have settled in and I have probably got used to it, I find the auto system fine. About 90 per cent of the time it is giving smooth almost unnoticeable changes, fuel consumption is identical to the manual Yaris I had before.

Take off, especially on islands and T junctions is very reliable and instant. I think the additional concentration you can give to traffic and situations around you without the palaver of pushing pedals and sticks around more than pays off against the very occasional change that maybe you would not have chosen yourself.

Oh, and the fuel card as arrived so that makes the whole experience a lot more enjoyable.....