Multidrive Cvt Transmission Problems

[Ritchie75]

new gearbox as we dont repair them cant put bulletin up as not at work till next monday

Hi Leepulsar,

Any chance you could post the TSB ?

Cheers,

/R

[Ritchie75]

I am sorry for bumping up the thread, but is there anyone out there who could provide any info on TSB mentioned above by Leepulsar?

I still think my car is not 100% fixed, the weird noise is still there and I get a feeling it is getting worse. The symptoms are:

- there is no noise hearable when car is idling or when car is lifted up and driven without any load

- the noise is best hearable when lifting off the throttle and slowing down with the box in D

- if I put the box to neutral while slowing down the noise disappears, if I put it back to drive, it comes back

- I tend to hear it also when accelerating, particularly slow acceleration up hill

I consulted this with the importer and they plan to do full diagnostics of the CVT box. So it would be great, If I had

that TSB with me when I go there. I do not trust them anymore, they rejected to provide information on differences between K111F and K112,

they only said I have the correct box...

Cheers,

/R.

[CharlieFarlie]

Do all Rav automatics have this CVT transmission ???

I've had a few Audi's over the Years and some had a normal auto box and some had CVT type box.

Whilst I had no issues with the Multitronic or CVT boxes in Our cars it soon became apparent on the forums that the CVT boxes were to be avoided like the plague !!The computers were one of the main issues and could cost in excess of 3K alone !!The computers were located within the box meaning box out to change them ! The transmission its self while less troublesome was still a weak point !!

It seems that No Manufacturer has yet mastered the CVT transmission ???

If We change Our current Rav for an another Rav then it would have to be an auto (For the Wife) and I simply would never buy any vehicle equipped with a CVT transmission.....

Wee Charlie.

[Ritchie75]

Do all Rav automatics have this CVT transmission ???

I've had a few Audi's over the Years and some had a normal auto box and some had CVT type box.

Whilst I had no issues with the Multitronic or CVT boxes in Our cars it soon became apparent on the forums that the CVT boxes were to be avoided like the plague !!The computers were one of the main issues and could cost in excess of 3K alone !!The computers were located within the box meaning box out to change them ! The transmission its self while less troublesome was still a weak point !!

It seems that No Manufacturer has yet mastered the CVT transmission ???

If We change Our current Rav for an another Rav then it would have to be an auto (For the Wife) and I simply would never buy any vehicle equipped with a CVT transmission.....

Wee Charlie.

Diesel RAV4 have standard 5 gears AT box with torque convertor

Gasoline RAV4 come with CVT auto box or manual only

[acetip]

Do all Rav automatics have this CVT transmission ???

I've had a few Audi's over the Years and some had a normal auto box and some had CVT type box.

Whilst I had no issues with the Multitronic or CVT boxes in Our cars it soon became apparent on the forums that the CVT boxes were to be avoided like the plague !!The computers were one of the main issues and could cost in excess of 3K alone !!The computers were located within the box meaning box out to change them ! The transmission its self while less troublesome was still a weak point !!

It seems that No Manufacturer has yet mastered the CVT transmission ???

If We change Our current Rav for an another Rav then it would have to be an auto (For the Wife) and I simply would never buy any vehicle equipped with a CVT transmission.....

Wee Charlie.

Hi Charlie,

Read in earlier posts how wonderful ravs are compared to others makes.are the two different qualities turned out then, the ones owned by the smug better than you ones,and the real world ones that can have a design problem just like any vehicle.

seems you have your feet on the ground,so could you explain.

[CharlieFarlie]

Do all Rav automatics have this CVT transmission ???

I've had a few Audi's over the Years and some had a normal auto box and some had CVT type box.

Whilst I had no issues with the Multitronic or CVT boxes in Our cars it soon became apparent on the forums that the CVT boxes were to be avoided like the plague !!The computers were one of the main issues and could cost in excess of 3K alone !!The computers were located within the box meaning box out to change them ! The transmission its self while less troublesome was still a weak point !!

It seems that No Manufacturer has yet mastered the CVT transmission ???

If We change Our current Rav for an another Rav then it would have to be an auto (For the Wife) and I simply would never buy any vehicle equipped with a CVT transmission.....

Wee Charlie.

Hi Charlie,

Read in earlier posts how wonderful ravs are compared to others makes.are the two different qualities turned out then, the ones owned by the smug better than you ones,and the real world ones that can have a design problem just like any vehicle.

seems you have your feet on the ground,so could you explain.

I've read Your above post several time and to be honest I cant understand what You are saying or what the question is ???

Wee Charlie.

[duncerduncs]

I owned a CVT (Multi-Drive S in Toyota speak) Rav for about a year. I didn't have any problems with it and it ran as sweet as a nut.

The reason Toyota used a CVT gearbox was obvious, it only adds 2g/km to the CO₂ rating compared to the 2 wheel drive manual.

[CharlieFarlie]

I owned a CVT (Multi-Drive S in Toyota speak) Rav for about a year. I didn't have any problems with it and it ran as sweet as a nut.

The reason Toyota used a CVT gearbox was obvious, it only adds 2g/km to the CO₂ rating compared to the 2 wheel drive manual.

Dont wish to sound cynical Mate but what use are the figures if Your CVT goes bang out of warranty ?

As stated above We never had even the slightest hint of a problem with the 2 Audi's We had equipped with Multitronic which is the Audi equivalent of CVT transmission . In fact that transmission is one of the best and smoothest We have had !!

But when We bought Our cars they were new and would not be kept for more than 2 years max.. In that time it became apparent that many were having problems..

If I was buying a new car again I simply would not buy a CVT equipped car because of the problems that seem to go along with them.. Its just one complication to many and I cannot see any real advantages of having one over the much simpler normal automatic gearbox..

Just look at the amount of problems the OP has and is seemingly continuing to have with His car ?? I would make a fair bet that none of these problems would have arisen with a normal Automatic gearbox.

Wee Charlie.

[Ritchie75]

I am writing this to close off this thread and let everybody know what I have found out from Mr. Toyota and how Mr. Toyota has treated me.

As you know I was trying to find out why there is K112 engraving on my new CVT box when the car should have been equipped with K111F box.

My local dealership had no clue. The local importer buzzed me off with "Toyota does not provide such technical information and I have the correct box".

Hence I contacted Toyota Europe by email to find out differences between K112 and K111F. They ignored the email for 4 weeks.

So I called them up and I got put through to the technical director (by accident I suppose). He was very helpful on the phone

and promised to come back to me by Friday (I called him on Monday). He hasn't ...

The reason why I noticed my new box had K112 on it was when I was trying to locate the source of weird sound/noise that started to appear after

the transmission was changed. I never doubted that they fitted my car with the correct box.

As for the weird mechanical noise that the car is producing now:

I contacted the local dealership that fixed my car and complained. They admitted there is a faint noise there, but they had no clue, so they advised me to monitor it and come back later if it doesn't go.

2000 miles later, the noise was still there and the dealership organized a meeting with the chief technician (of the local importer). The guy did not hear the noise (I think he did not want to hear it, because when I was leaving he told me not to worry too much, because it is likely minor issue and the car is under warranty anyway).

I consulted this with my lawyer and he advised me to ask for a written statement and that's what I did. And then things started to be interesting.

I officially returned the car to the dealership complaining about the noise, they performed all sorts of tests with the help of the local importer and they promised to contact me once the data is analyzed.

I have not heard from them in 3 weeks, so I wrote the email to the importer that they are about to run out of the legal limit in 1 week. They ignored my email. On the very last day of the legal limit (which happened to be Friday),

I got the call from the dealership at 3:30pm! That they are closing my claim, because they have to and I should come to collect the paper!!! I told them that I disagree with this because I did not receive any written statement.

They closed the claim anyway and posted it to me.

I contacted the importer again that this is not very customer-friendly approach and I would like to receive the promised written statement. Guess what, they replied within 24hours saying that my car and my CVT is 100% correct!

They likely got a call from Toyota Europe because they even explained to me why I have K112 on my CVT. This is what they said: "All RAV4 CVT boxes have the engraving K112 81 on the transmission Shell, because this Shell is reused for more transmission types. Internally my CVT type is K111F".

Basically, I am left with the squeaking car, which according to Mr. Toyota is in 100% condition. All I can do is hope the car breaks before it is out of warranty.

Today, Tomorrow, Toyota, Never Again.

Have fun,

R.

P.S. I personally think the noise comes from the torque converter, which was not replaced. IMHO it got overloaded because I had to drive the car to the dealership for 200-300miles with the CVT stuck in long "gear" ratios.

When I told this hypothesis to the importer chief technician, he laughed me off saying that there was no torque converter on my car ...

Do not worry, this is not Toyota UK that treats me like this :)

[anchorman]

The CVT does indeed use a torque converter;

CVT Torque Converter.pdf

[CharlieFarlie]

Every CVT transmission that I have heard of seems to have issues .. I only ever had one CVT transmission and that was in an Audi 3.0 Petrol. It performed faultlessly !!! But the horror stories were all over the Forums at the time !!

Personally I would never buy another CVT equipped car !!!

Wee Charlie.

[evankouros]

Hi there!

I'm Evan from Thessaloniki-Greece and I have a RAV4 CVT AWD MK3 facelift (ZSA30L).

I'm facing the same issues "Ritchie75" does, so I'm quoting what I've noticed based on his post:

- there is no noise hearable when car is idling or when car is lifted up and driven without any load

-- YES

- the noise is best hearable when lifting off the throttle and slowing down with the box in D

-- YES

- if I put the box to neutral while slowing down the noise disappears, if I put it back to drive, it comes back

--> NO, I can still hear it in my RAV, even when the CVT gear box is in "N" position, as long as the car is rolling and maintains it's speed between 15-25 kph.

- I tend to hear it also when accelerating, particularly slow acceleration up hill

-- YES

- I had a closer look at the engine and CVT today. The car specs said the CVT type is K111F. The new CVT has this marking on top of it: K112 81

-- Almost YES.

Mine should also be (according to toyodiy.com and my RAV's VIN) "K111F", but it is "K112 7". Note that I haven't changed the CVT gearbox (so far), since I have experienced no other problem than the faint whistle noise, so there's no case that somebody replaced the CVT box.

My personal contribution in trying to solve the mystery:

I've been to 3 local dealers. They've driven my car and tried really hard to find the faint whistle source in order to stop it. So far they have not succeeded.

As a Mod/Admin in "Toyota Club" & "RAV4 club", I've talked with some real experts. Local importer's ex After Sales District Manager, asked me from the very beginning if I could hear the noise even when I had "N" (neutral) in CVT, because he was suspecting problem with it's steel belt. I told him that I could still hear the noise even in neutral "N" position... and thus started my Odyssey, trying to find out where the noise is coming from.

Yesterday I googled trying to find some info regarding CVT problems and I found this thread.

I think it should be an unbelievable coincidence to have almost the same symptoms with "Ritchie75" and having a different kind of problem, just because I hear the same faint whistle noise even when I have "N" in my RAV's CVT!

What I did was to contact again "Angelos", my expert friend, presenting to him the similar case of "Ritchie75" I've find in the web.

His answer was very clear: "Since "Ritchie75" doesn't hear the noise when his RAV is rolling in neutral, most probably he has problem with the steel belt of his CVT, not the torque converter he suspects."

The relevant TSB is "CP-0046T-0611" (2011).

B/R,

- Evan

[evankouros]

Update:
After 3 years that I'm trying to figure out what must be done in order to make sure I won't have any problems because of my RAV CVT's "whistle", I'm very close to a solution:

• CVT gearbox and ECU change (according to the TSB "CP-0046T-0611" I've posted) under warranty (Toyota in Greece provides 3 years factory warranty + 3 years extended warranty)

History:

I had to go to every local dealer during the last 3 years, trying to find solution to this "whistle".

Nobody could. I've sent e-mails to local dealers and the importer, explaining (after a lot of research) what I thought the problem was (wear of the CVT's steelbelt, or wear that the steelbelt causes to the CVT cones).

One year ago, a local dealer made some tests (according to central tech dept suggestions). As I realized, with these tests they were looking for valves malfunction, that could mean low oil pressure in the gearbox, causing bad steelbelt lubrication, causing steelbelt wear.

<-- CVT Valves

<-- Diagnostic Trouble Codes (DTC) -->

According to these tests results there was no problem, so their "conclusion" was that "the "whistle" is normal and is caused by the oil flow inside the CVT gearbox"!

Of course I couldn't accept that, so I wrote my objections to the document they gave me (in order to have a written proof).

A year passed and -some days ago- I decided to visit the last (4th) local Toyota dealer in my city, in order to do the annual service and try to find a solution to the "whistle" problem.

I told them all the story, they read the e-mail I had sent to the others before, they read the TSB I informed them, they heard the "whistle", they asked (and I gave them) all the documents that were prooving I'm reporting the "whistle" & I'm trying to find a solution since 2012, we talked for about 2 hours about it... and they finally decided that they should ask for the CVT gearbox & ECU replacement!

Two days later (last Friday) they called to inform me that the replacement under warranty has been approoved! :D

Now I'm waiting for them to call me when the spare parts arrive. I hope there will be no unexpected surprises, meaning they'll change the CVT & the ECU under warranty and the "whistle" will finally stop!

I'll inform again when everything's over, so that if somebody else has a similar case with his CVT, will know what to do... since there will be (soon enough I hope) my "res judicata"! ;)

[evankouros]

I'll inform again when everything's over, so that if somebody else has a similar case with his CVT, will know what to do... since there will be (soon enough I hope) my "res judicata"! ;)

Update:

CVT gearbox ("Κ112 23" - code 30400-42030-84) and ECU (code 89661-42Q61) changed under warranty, faint whistle gone, problem solved!