White Smoke Still After Full Head Gasket Replacement And More

[angelsix]

Had white / blue smoke and bad emmisions before doing any work so failed MOT.

So fit new:

- Spark Plugs

- Air Filter

- Fuel Filter

- Oil Filter

- Exhaust Gaskets

- Intake Gaskets

- Stripped and cleaned entire engine down to chambers (but not gone to pistons)

- New Valve Stem Seals

- Valve clearances all checked

- Reground Valve Seats

- Full head gasket replacement

- New head stretch bolts fitted

- Air intake cleaning and gasket replacements

- Fuel injectors cleaned

- New timing belt

- Timing checked and spot on

- Flushed radiators and checked for any leaks

- New engine oil 10w40 filled

* Done 116k miles total.

* Had new coil pack last year

Smoke seems to of gotten worst after doing all the work, not better.

Car runs perfectly fine, very smooth, full acceleration no dead spots no misfiring. If the smoke wasn't there you wouldn't even know there was a problem.

Typical signs before doing work were spark plug one always blackened over a period of a few months then needed replacing and oil change to get rid of misfiring, then all runs sweet again for few months. Not seen if this is still the case after all the work.

Only thing I am thinking (well... hoping) is this smoke is now not blue as it was before, but just smoke. It started off black when first spun it up after all the work, but has now cleared to white. Would a bad Cat, MAP sensor or lambda sensor cause this?

I just hope it isn't the piston rings after stripping the engine right down to the cylinders and not going down to the pistons, but as a last resort I can strip it all again and check pistons, just hoping there are other options first.

[Golden bay NZ]

Wow, you,ve done a lot of work

Did you ever get white/yellow gunge inside your oil filler cap?

Thats a sign of water inside your oil

Though I have heard these motors dont crack heads and blocks

My oxygen sensors have done 160k and are fine

But that looks like water

Have you retorqued the head bolts?

Ive heard they are tricky

Are you supposed to loosen them then retighten them or something?

You can clean oxygen sensors by soaking them in petrol overnite

And by heating them with a blowtorch (not to red hot)

then dipping them in cold water to loosen the carbon

Cats are always good to remove (leave sensors in place)

But I would get a mechanic to look at it

[angelsix]

Yes retorqued the new bolts up correctly (something like up to 29Nm then half a turn past, and need rechecking in 600 miles).

No mayo in cap and car runs perfect, inspected all block and no sign of wear, cams are in brilliant condition and same with the rest.

The valve stems (mainly exhaust) were thick in black and took some cleaning, even black on the inside arm which is why I suspected stem seals were bad, but they have been replaced now so can't be that.

Haven't checked O2 sensor or Cat yet but would those two cause that smoke?

When you are saying looks like water what are you suspecting, a coolant leak or other leak?

[Golden bay NZ]

Id check simple things like your wiring to the o2 sensors and maf in case they are damaged

How many k's had your car done?

Because not a lot goes on these cars

[Golden bay NZ]

I think I might know what it is...

It could be unburnt fuel

According to the 'Dog and Lemon Guide'

There are 2 things that go on these motors at high k's

The throttle body wears and the coil packs on the sparks plugs need replacing.

Im not sure what happens when The coil packs go

But I imagine either a weak spark or an intermittent one

Both of which could dirty a plug quickly and leave unburnt fuel

[Karma Supra]

I think I might know what it is...

It could be unburnt fuel

According to the 'Dog and Lemon Guide'

There are 2 things that go on these motors at high k's

The throttle body wears and the coil packs on the sparks plugs need replacing.

Im not sure what happens when The coil packs go

But I imagine either a weak spark or an intermittent one

Both of which could dirty a plug quickly and leave unburnt fuel

Neither are anything to do with this problem.

Angelsix, two points about your post.

What does "Stripped and cleaned entire engine down to chambers (but not gone to pistons)" mean exactly,

And what do you mean by "Reground Valve Stems" please tell me you mean valve seats?

[Jamesbelfast]

Water vapour will disperse quite quickly. The smoke in the video hangs around.

That's an oil burner if ever I saw one. Sloppy piston rings or worn bores would be my diagnosis.

If the upper end has been refurbed then the compression will be that bit better thus creating more piston blow-by causing more oil to burn.

Time for a rebore or new block me thinks.:)

[angelsix]

116k it has done but in very good condition. Previous owner (only other owner) was a mechanic and looked after it very well plus didn't go many miles in it (84k when I bought it 2 years ago).

I replaced the coil pack last year as it was faulty, so I would like to think it wasn't that gone again.

Replaced MAP last year too in an attempt during figuring out it was the coil pack so that is new too.

Correct me if I am wrong but if it was unburned fuel anyway it would be black smoke, and it is all white smoke now which is water/antifreeze or oil correct?

Karma,

Yes I mean the valve seats, used a coubik and fine grinding paste and done it as usual (done it a few times on other cars).

The seats were very caked in black so couldnt of been sitting well before.

Regarding stripping out engine I have basically taken everything out in order to do the head gasket so along the way I replaced all seals, gaskets, belts, head bolts etc... and generally cleaned all crap off the cylinder heads, valves, general gunk off the blocks and pipes so everything is nice and clean.

Everything from cylinders up is like new now.

I am going to do a compression test tomorrow to see what that results in and failing any other thoughts going strip it down again to double check everything is sitting good and nothing is amiss in the engine, and if it is all OK I will go down to the pistons this time and see whats going on.

I have also checked the diagnostics and no error codes showing.

Out of curiosity can someone tell me if Bosch +47 are the correct sparks for the 7AFE as even though the in store book says they are the ones, to me when they are in and you look at their position from inside they seem a very long reach to the valves, and I would of thought they would be short reach?

[Jamesbelfast]

Do a double compression test. First a dry test followed by a wet test and compare the figures.

[angelsix]

Stripped engine down again, and water and oil all in the air intake and exhaust and over the cylinders... basically looks like the new head gasket hasn't sealed.

Any reason why this wouldn't seal correctly? It is from a Victor Reinz kit so presume it is a good one. Got another gasket coming tomorrow as the black paint coating is wrecked so don't want to re-fit same one.

Would the fact of putting a thin coating of Uni Blue gasket sealer on the gasket of caused it? Won't be adding that this time around for sure.

Perhaps the head bolts weren't torqued enough? I have gone to 29Nm then half a turn as per the Clinton manual but is that correct?

[SCOOBY1988]

Sorry to tell you this and i hope ime wrong BUT, I rebuilt my vaux 1.6 astra van engine after a valve burning out. Just pulled the head off, skimmed it, new stem seals ect regrind on the valvs then put it all back together, i got the smoke ur describing and it got worse and worse yet never misfired !!

Went to my cousins garage and spoke to a vaux mechanic who told me them engines seem to have a habbit of after having the head removed and put nback on the rings seem to go ! So a full strip down then unsued and fully rebuild it with new rigs a re-hone and new big end shells for good measure seen astho the have to come off when doing the job and now no smoke atall and a nise crisp engine with 120k on the clock.

So i would say its highly likely worn rings, mine got worse and worse the more i drove it until it was just fogging the street out with smoke

[Jamesbelfast]

Stripped engine down again, and water and oil all in the air intake and exhaust and over the cylinders... basically looks like the new head gasket hasn't sealed.

Any reason why this wouldn't seal correctly? It is from a Victor Reinz kit so presume it is a good one. Got another gasket coming tomorrow as the black paint coating is wrecked so don't want to re-fit same one.

Would the fact of putting a thin coating of Uni Blue gasket sealer on the gasket of caused it? Won't be adding that this time around for sure.

Perhaps the head bolts weren't torqued enough? I have gone to 29Nm then half a turn as per the Clinton manual but is that correct?

Modern head gaskets are not designed to be used with gasket sealer. Also were the head bolts renewed - they are a use-once only fitting.

[TARManiAC]

Don´t know bout those Bosch plugs but certainly not what I use on my 7afe. Check with www.sparkplugs.co.uk

[angelsix]

Ok just a quick update - stripped down engine again. Head gasket had failed due to the blue sealer. Refit a new gasket and pressure went up from 7 to 13 bar! So definitely solved that.

Also the engine ran much smoother than it ever had since I owned it - no vibration in the engine at all when running its as smooth as anything.

The problem was I still got white smoke on acceleration. Bad but not as much as the last video.

Stripped it down again (yes entire new head gasket swap needed again now) and turns out the valve stem seals that were fitted were all the same size and all the exhaust were leaking.

After much research and the third kit coming with 2 different sets of seals - one for the exhaust and one for the intake - it turns out the previous kit coming with all the same size seals were wrong as the exhaust needs tigher seals.

Found it incredibly hard to find any info on this fact so for anyone in the future, your seals should either be of two sizes where the larger ID hole (5.5mm) seals go on the intake, and the tighter seals (4.7mm on the ID) go on the exhaust or your kit should have all the same size seals and should all be the smaller 4.7mm ID. My first kit (Victor Reinz) were all 5.5mm so effectively that kit is useless for this engine and should not be bought!

I have read some other people having similar experience with kits supplying 16 same size but all of the 5.5mm size so meaning they had to do it all again.

Just rebuilding the engine for a third time and will let you know the results fingers crossed.