The Normal Brand New Boring Car Vs Something Tasty 2Nd Hand

[Red diesel]

Purely a hypothetical question as alas im not exactly lush with cash these days (being a student lol).

But this is something ive been pondering for a while - and it came up again yesterday, saw a gorgeous looking Jaguar XF yesterday. Admittedly these are still fairly new and thus on the pricey side. But even the older model S type (post 02) are still potentially a very nice way of getting one about the place lol. But regardless of whether you like Jags specifically or not, where does the point come when the prestige option second hand option start becoming attractive.

I mean obviously if you need an MPV type machine thats what you need. But suppose you don't need an MPV or you want something as a second car in addition to the MPV (because you need one etc).

Granted the Jag is going to cost more to run but then of course if you spend 10 grand on the Jaguar and 15,000 on the new car - you are already 5 grand ahead starting out. And the new car is going to lose 3 grand in value driving out the gate - so thats 8 grand to the good. Should keep the Jag going for a while lol - and of course while being sensible is obviously a good thing - how much is the pleasure of driving a top of the range car albeit a few years old actually worth*.

*My car enthusiast side is currently suffering from an overexposure to 85 percent of the way there Korean machines and rave reviews about said machines . Im looking to liven it up again with some nice dreams and ambitions

Red diesel

[Leeky]

Couldnt agree more.

I'd only buy another brand new car if i was going to keep it for a long time so that i got my moneys worth out of it. Like the FT86. I'll be there queuing up for one on the launch day, because i plan for it to be my car for the next 10years+.

But saying that, if you picked up a 1-2 year old example (of any car) then it'll still be under warranty and you'll probably save 25-50%.

Its like the brand new Prius - lovely car! But seeing as its a car all about saving the environment and also your money; would it not be cheaper to buy a MK2 Prius 2nd hand for around £5-6k and run it for 3-4 years (average mileage) than what it would cost to get a brand new prius for £20k + fuel?

Plus when you're done with it, the worst case scenario is its worthless and you've lost £5-6k..... where as a new prius will probably be worth less than £10k after 5-6 years so you've effectively lost over £10k.

Swings and roundabouts.

But look at it this way....£20k will buy you a brand new prius.... OR...... a 2001 Aston Martin DB7 V12...

[dangermooser]

I sell 2nd hand cars.....good ones and mainly prestige brands but we do also sell the run of the mill stuff too.

A mate of mine recently bought a mid range diesel Focus costing £18k, when he drove it away taking into account VAT, delivery costs and what a dealer would give him for the car once registered he lost about £5 to 6k in one hit. Now to put things into perspective we have a nice Focus ST with low miles on an 06 plate that drive like new for a shade under £7k or in other words one days depriciation plus £1 to 1.5k. The rest of the money would take care of the extra running costs and give far more smiles per miles!

There are so many great cars out there that give a lot for little and if you choose wisely a used car can be a more reliable choice compared to buying new

[Karma Supra]

I'd never buy a new car unless I had so much money that wasting some didn't matter.

The kind of cars like like are ~"premium market" nothing says bargain like a top end car that is a few years old. I'd rather drive a 5 year old M3 for the cost of a brand new mondeo.

P.S for a "mid range focus" you could buy a Maserati Quattroporte. or a 996 (although a bit !Removed!) 911.

[KPARRIS-JONES]

My step dad got his 2 year old XF this year for £22000 versus the original £40000.... work that out!

KP

[Karma Supra]

My step dad got his 2 year old XF this year for £22000 versus the original £40000.... work that out!

KP

worked out... they are rebranded fords and as such the price will plummet.

My old man for some ungodly reason bought an S type jag about 4 years ago. He has driven it once since, and taken up my spare place in the garage (next to a real Jaguar). As a result my M3 has sat in the "weather" for months and now looks manky :(

[Red diesel]

KParrish Jones - thats serious depreciation, better to be the 2nd owner than the first lol. Hows he finding it so far just as a matter of interest.

Karma Supra - agreed id rather drive an older BMW than a brand new Mondeo (the current models quite nice of the Mondeo - but id rather a top spec 4 year old 2.5 turbo than a brand new 1.6 TDCI). Incidentally one of the neighbours in my near college accomodation (college been a fair distance from home) has an E46 M3 - awesome sounding beast when started up especially first thing in the morning in cold mode (higher idle etc etc) lol.

Leeky - hope the FT 86 lives up to your expectations, looks very promising and i hope that it fulfills that promise. The industry needs a new game changer of a car. My expectations aren't high - i just want something that when i see one parked up i can look and think - fine beast of a machine. You can look at an old LS 400 or an old classic Range Rover and admire the ingenuity and achievements of the design teams behind both. You can look at both and have high respect for them even though obviously they aren't objectively as good as modern equivelents.

Danger Mooser - absolutely agree on the Focus - but would prefer the 2.5 in the current shape Mondeo because i like my comfort lol. ST Focus does have a reputations for being a very capable car - the Police seem to be able to make use of them as unmarked patrol cars for example.

Red diesel

[dervdave]

I`ve had a life time of other peoples castoffs (used cars) and can tell you theres nowt like a brand new vehicle.

No more buying a pig in a poke with hidden faults and problems caused by age/miles and newer ones with the backsides ragged out of them by uncaring knobheads.

If you can`t afford new then you have no choice but if you can........ its only money

[r04drunner1]

In general I'd support the VFM proposition of used cars.

I've had two Jaguars, an X-Type and an S-Type. Both used cars, both costing MUCH less than their previous (car lease) owner has paid. Both with full JSH. There is no way I could have afforded to buy them from new. I VERY nearly bought a gorgeous new XF instead of the S-Type, but sanity returned when I slept on it and worked out the effect on the family budget.

Both Jaguars were brilliant cars to drive. Very fast (oh boy, yes! ), extremely comfortable and their prestige attracted favourable comments.

Downside was:

- both encountered serious faults. Fixing the X-Type was covered by an extended warranty (thankfully) but the S-Type got an electronic park brake fault that cost quite a bit in hassle and money to put right. (Hint: find a good independent Jaguar engineer, I know an excellent one in NI if you want to PM me to ask.)

- large and expensive cars with lots of (early generation) complex electronics and mechanics = lots can go wrong and it costs lots to fix if it does

- very poor economy

- cost an arm and a leg to keep going

I now have a company Toyota Prius T4 (T4). My wallet loves me for it. And, yes, there is so much less hassle owning a reliable car from new, with no worries about servicing or tyres or road tax (especially on a Prius! )

On balance I think the "luxury second hand car for less" proposition is still a good one. But buy a good-un and still budget £££ for ongoing maintenance / fixes.

BTW I nearly bought a nice looking second hand X-Type for £2k yesterday, to run as a "fun car". (When I found it was just a relatively gutless 2.1 litre petrol I lost interest.) Which shows I have not yet recovered from being bitten by the Jag bug!

[KPARRIS-JONES]

KParrish Jones - thats serious depreciation, better to be the 2nd owner than the first lol. Hows he finding it so far just as a matter of interest.

He said it's the first car that he could actually really like and enjoy owning - you must remember this is a man of such modesty that when his company gave him a 1982 911 Carrera, he left it under a tree 5 houses down from him with a nest in it so that it looked shite and so that no one would suspect it was his

The road holding is excellent for a car of its size yet it is very comfortable and puts many German rivals to shame in my honest opinion. The interior is very light and fresh and well put together - I did my usual finicky pin-pointing of rubbish plastics and it honestly was hard to find anything out-standing. It was very nicely constructed and finished.

The engine pulls beautifully, it's a Diesel but still has the legs to put cars with GTi badges to shame , the thing stops very well too and the road noise isn't all that noticeable.

Overall he loves the thing and so do I, it does what it says on the tin and a few extra bits too, and for £22k against £40k or whatever it was, we really couldn't argue!

KP

[Brandane]

I`ve had a life time of other peoples castoffs (used cars) and can tell you theres nowt like a brand new vehicle.

No more buying a pig in a poke with hidden faults and problems caused by age/miles and newer ones with the backsides ragged out of them by uncaring knobheads.

If you can`t afford new then you have no choice but if you can........ its only money

Or the other side of the coin; a used car has had all the manufacturers faults fixed under warranty before you buy it! I've only ever bought one car brand new, a VW Polo and it was ok, only had to go back to the garage once for annoying rattles. But after a week, it is still a "used" car. In 30 years of buying "used" I have only ever had one dodgey car. Check them out thoroughly before you buy, and you shouldn't have too many problems. No more than a supposedly "new" car anyway!

When I was a boy in the merchant navy, I used to cringe watching the drivers unloading the car carriers in the middle east. Nice new BMW's, Mercs, Audis etc. being raced (on cold engines) along the dockside with blue smoke coming from their exhausts. They were no doubt destined for a gleaming car showroom to be sold with delivery miles only, to unsuspecting buyers. Never assume that just because your car is new, that it hasn't been ragged by some knob-head!

[Red diesel]

Yes its important when buying a Jaguar (or indeed any 2nd hand car) to buy a good example and allow a budget for repairs, Hence why i was comparing a 10 grand Jag with a 15 grand brand new car instead of comparing a 15 grand Jag to an equivelently priced new one.

But regarding Derve Daves comments - it is possible to buy very good 2nd hand cars - its also equally possible to get a complete pile of poo buying brand new. Yes you have a warranty buying new - but you don't half pay for the previlige of that warranty and for being the first owner on the log book. An inspection by an expert mechanic (who is trustworthy and knowledgeable) can help avoid most pitfalls related with buying 2nd hand. Second hand cars aren't perfect - but if you want an equivelent car to what you are buying new - they come a lot cheaper at 3 years old with 60 000 miles on the clock. Or you could instead opt to go for a car thats a lot nicer than youd ever buy knew (the exact subject of this tread). In saying that if you don't mind putting up with the depreciation - theres nothing wrong with buying new - especially when those of us who buy 2nd hand can have the same cars in 3 years time for 50 percent or less than what you paid new .

Meanwhile im off to do some day dreaming about some potential 2nd hand purchases in the next year or 3 - inspite of the comments on Jags and the like my expectations are quite modest - Peugeot 406 HDIs, Volvo S60 2.0Ts etc etc

Red diesel