53 Yaris Clutch Sqeak

[lozat1990]

I have a 53 plate Yaris which has recently had a new clutch due to reverse grinding. Gears now seem fine but clutch pedal sqeaks... the squeak happened before clutch was replaced and i thought that replacement would also solve this. Needless to say it did not and the mechanic has now "greased" it but problem still remains :( is there a quick fix to solve this problem?

Thanks

Lauren

[ormi]

the gear box needs to be removed...... the clutch fork pivot ball has not been greased thats the cause of the squeek

[Chris81]

The mechanic probably greased the clutch pedal mechanism but the noise is probably coming from the gearbox end. Instead of having to remove it, read this thread and open up the picture. Should help.

http://www.toyotaownersclub.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=25353&hl=

[ormi]

thats a cracking idea.....?????? lets contaminate the clutch with spray grease/wd40 etc...

[Chris81]

Is it really such a bad fix? I've read on the Corolla forum that it's the fix many people there use, and it seems to have worked in the thread I linked to above.

Seems a common prob on the Toyotas as I've heard it on the Auris as well.

[Chris81]

*Duplicate post*

[Geoff Peace]

Before you spend a large amount of cash removing the gearbox, eliminate the 'easy to do' cures first. Push the clutch push rod back into the slave cylinder a little way, clean the end of the rod and the recess in the clutch arm then grease the recess with white grease or moly grease. Then pull back the rubber cover on the slave cylinder and grease the other end of the rod with rubber grease. I have done this a few times to cure a clutch squeek.

Regards Geoff Peace.

[Chris81]

The reason I've returned to this post is my clutch pedal squeak has now become a creak and a loud click noise which comes on about 3/4 of the way down when the pedal is depressed. It's definitely coming from the slave cylinder area. It used to be just a creak but now it's a loud click as well. Is this where the clutch fork is? Are we talking a lot of money to fix as I don't think a squirt of grease will solve it!

[chatterbox]

Now on second Yaris, first one now banana shaped, but both cars had same squeaky noise when clutch pedal depressed and when let back up.

Both were 2004 models, first one was 1.0ltr engine and second one is 1.3ltr engine.

First one started squeaking about 30,000 miles, car was squashed at 35,000 miles when had just started squeaking again.

Second car was squeaking when bought with 28,000 miles on speedo.

My cure was lifting up the edge of rubber boot on slave cylinder and using the small pipe extension squirting some silicone spray inside, soaked it actually and hey presto, squeak gone for nearly 5,000 miles before it came back.

Now done same on second car.

From what I can gather is very common problem on these models and from link above is on auris models as well.

If you can be bothered then I suppose using the grease method shown elsewhere might be a more long term option?

[Chris81]

Interesting stuff. I'd have greased mine if I was only getting a creak, but now I'm getting a loud distinct click as well so something behind that rubber boot in the slave cylinder must be knackered. I guess the grease would solve the creak but does anyone know what the loud click noise could be?

[chatterbox]

Just a thought, but could the click noise be coming from the actual pedal area?, am thinking pedal bushes or mounting box loose.

Only ask because on a nissan terrano we have this is a common problem with both the bushes and the mounting box problems, even box cracking on older models, so might be something to check out?

over the years have had 3 terranos and had this problem with bushes on two of them, one only had 24,000 miles on it.

Anyway, might be worth a look at.

By the way, how many miles on clock?

[Chris81]

About 45k on the clock. The click is definitely coming from the slave cylinder area. It started out as a creak but it has very rapidly turned into a creak with a loud click part way through the creak!

Did you squirt the grease into both the slave cylinder and behind the rubber boot covering the clutch fork/bearing?

[chatterbox]

mine was only silicone spray and I fully soaked inside cylinder and rubber boot so much it was running out, worked within a day or so and removed the squeak but as i said before the grease method would be better I think, and if you can get a dollup into the cylinder area that really should be all that is needed as the rod moving back and forth should soon coat the shaft of the rod, maybe try using silicone spray first to see if it helps but it is not a long term solution, You could just buy a new slave cylinder and fit and bleed it yourself, it is not that hard to do but is easier in summer, and they are not that expensive.

you could also try spraying the silicone spray at the front of the rod where it connects to the clutch actuating fork end just make sure you do not spray any into the opening to the clutch housing !!!!! you do not want any of it to get on the clutch, ho no, not at all.

[Chris81]

chatterbox, your warning seems to reflect that of ormi above so I'm confused as to where is safe to spray some silicone/grease and where isn't.

In the thread I mentioned above there is the following pic of point A (slave cylinder) and point B (clutch fork/bearing)

http://www.talon747.plus.com/y.jpg

Are you saying it's safe to spray as much as you want into these 2 areas or should one of these be avoided? Where is the clutch housing that must be avoided?

[Geoff Peace]

chatterbox, your warning seems to reflect that of ormi above so I'm confused as to where is safe to spray some silicone/grease and where isn't.

In the thread I mentioned above there is the following pic of point A (slave cylinder) and point B (clutch fork/bearing)

http://www.talon747.plus.com/y.jpg

Are you saying it's safe to spray as much as you want into these 2 areas or should one of these be avoided? Where is the clutch housing that must be avoided?

There is a spring behind the slave cylinder piston which can click. Never put any other type of grease except rubber grease in the slave cylinder or anywhere else where it will come into contact with hydraulic seals and brake fluid.

Regards Geoff Peace.

[Chris81]

Geoff, by rubber grease, do you mean white grease (lithium?) or silicone spray? Also, in the pic I linked to above, where is this spring you mention? In the slave cylinder itself or behind the release fork rubber boot?

[Geoff Peace]

Rubber grease is not mineral based, any mineral oil or grease will destroy hydraulic seals. It is sometimes called red rubber grease, definitely not lithium or silicone. The spring is inside the cylinder behind the piston. Hope this helps.

Regards Geoff Peace

[chatterbox]

Sorry for not answering earlier, but the actuating fork comes out from the bellhousing area usually in a square or rectanglular hole to where the slave cylinder sits.

You would want to ensure that you place a rag just over the hole and arm to make sure no spray goes into that hole as that is where you clutch plate is which has the pressure plate sat above it and this is attatched or sat on your flywheel and if any spray got on the plate, flywheel or the face of the pressure plate it would mean your clutch would just slip and you would have no drive.

Query? I had used the silicone spray over 1 year ago in old car and up until 23 dec when car written off, no probs at all apart from squeak had just started to come back

Am I to infer from the above that the silicone spray would have contaminated the fluid inside slave cylinder?

If so, then I can only state that where our car was concerned, that nothing untoward had happened prior to losing our car.

Does anyone know if it is possible for the silicone to mix or corrupt the fluid, or if it is possible that it would or could get past the rubber seal into the fluid area?

I would be interested in the answer, even if it is technical as it is also in our new/replacement car.

Just one more point as regards the silicone spray.

It is usually sold to stop annoying squeaks from steering wheels rubbing on the plastic surrounds on the steering shaft/controls area.

It is also used to help the windows, especially on electric powered windows, to be sprayed on the rubber/felt which the window glass slids up and down in.

I have even used it on the bushes for the clutch pedals.

It is made to be used on rubber as a lubricant so I do not think it would actually harm the rubber seal in the slave cylinder, but I am also aware that it is made from very fine molecules which may be able to to get past the seal itself so this is why I ask above how it may interact with the actual fluid used in the clutch system.

[Geoff Peace]

Sorry for not answering earlier, but the actuating fork comes out from the bellhousing area usually in a square or rectanglular hole to where the slave cylinder sits.

You would want to ensure that you place a rag just over the hole and arm to make sure no spray goes into that hole as that is where you clutch plate is which has the pressure plate sat above it and this is attatched or sat on your flywheel and if any spray got on the plate, flywheel or the face of the pressure plate it would mean your clutch would just slip and you would have no drive.

Query? I had used the silicone spray over 1 year ago in old car and up until 23 dec when car written off, no probs at all apart from squeak had just started to come back

Am I to infer from the above that the silicone spray would have contaminated the fluid inside slave cylinder?

If so, then I can only state that where our car was concerned, that nothing untoward had happened prior to losing our car.

Does anyone know if it is possible for the silicone to mix or corrupt the fluid, or if it is possible that it would or could get past the rubber seal into the fluid area?

I would be interested in the answer, even if it is technical as it is also in our new/replacement car.

Just one more point as regards the silicone spray.

It is usually sold to stop annoying squeaks from steering wheels rubbing on the plastic surrounds on the steering shaft/controls area.

It is also used to help the windows, especially on electric powered windows, to be sprayed on the rubber/felt which the window glass slids up and down in.

I have even used it on the bushes for the clutch pedals.

It is made to be used on rubber as a lubricant so I do not think it would actually harm the rubber seal in the slave cylinder, but I am also aware that it is made from very fine molecules which may be able to to get past the seal itself so this is why I ask above how it may interact with the actual fluid used in the clutch system.

As you say silicone grease is used on plastics etc. but the only safe lubricant for any brake cylinder is red rubber grease, It is a vegetable based grease which will not cause hardening or swelling of seals and is compatable with synthetic and natural rubber. We are talking about brakes, so use anything else at your peril. Something you may not have thought of, in the event of a serious accident, insurance companies are now testing for water in the brake fluid, and there are cases where insurance companies have refused to pay out on claims if the fluid was contaminated.

Regards Geoff Peace.

[chatterbox]

Thanks for the info Geoff, well at least its only the clutch were talking about so thats a relief anyway.

I appreciate your point that the slave cylinder is the same as a brake cylinder in its operation and so water is not a good thing.

I never thought to check to see if the spray is water based or not, will have to dig in to the shed and have a look at the can

So this red rubber grease, will it lubricate the areas that are making the noise enough just by squeezing some into the shaft area behind the rubber outer sleeve?

I am presuming that it is the outer edge of the rubber seal that is dried out and is rubbing on the cylinder walls, or does the shaft itself also need greasing?

I suppose what I am asking is does the seal slide up and down the shaft/rod or is the seal afixed to the shaft and so just rubs up and down the actual cylinder.

Have never taken one of these off and taken it apart so do not know really how it works.

Will have to wait for summer as not wanting to do anything to car at moment with this weather.

Thats what you get for cheating and just using a spray to fix things.

[chatterbox]

Just chating with mate concerning this water absorption in brake/clutch fluid.

He reminded me that brake/clutch fluid naturally does absorb water because it is hygroscopic.

Silicone repels water.

Silicone and brake/clutch fluid in theory should not mix because the silicone is a smaller molecule and would not be able to be absorbed by the brake fluid, also the seal that is holding the fluid inside would as the rod/shaft moves would also stop any silicone going into the fluid chamber so therefore no contamination or if any so possibly small as to be (hopefully) of no matter.

This is assuming that the seal is not leaking, but if it was it would mean a new slave cylinder anyway.

This was interesting to me but maybe very boring to others, but if anyone disagrees please feel free to comment.

Additional info on our car,

Gone has the creak from the pedal area and the squeak from the slave cylinder but checking today while mate was here, still slight squeaking from bellhousing area so he thinks it is the ball pivot that might need greasing but he suggests that in summer we give it a go using a special syringe that he has to get some through the small hole where actuator arm comes out.

So thanks to the gent above (Ormi) who posted earlier concerning this ball pivot area.

[Geoff Peace]

Just chating with mate concerning this water absorption in brake/clutch fluid.

He reminded me that brake/clutch fluid naturally does absorb water because it is hygroscopic.

Silicone repels water.

Silicone and brake/clutch fluid in theory should not mix because the silicone is a smaller molecule and would not be able to be absorbed by the brake fluid, also the seal that is holding the fluid inside would as the rod/shaft moves would also stop any silicone going into the fluid chamber so therefore no contamination or if any so possibly small as to be (hopefully) of no matter.

This is assuming that the seal is not leaking, but if it was it would mean a new slave cylinder anyway.

This was interesting to me but maybe very boring to others, but if anyone disagrees please feel free to comment.

Additional info on our car,

Gone has the creak from the pedal area and the squeak from the slave cylinder but checking today while mate was here, still slight squeaking from bellhousing area so he thinks it is the ball pivot that might need greasing but he suggests that in summer we give it a go using a special syringe that he has to get some through the small hole where actuator arm comes out.

So thanks to the gent above (Ormi) who posted earlier concerning this ball pivot area.

The seal is located in a groove in the piston. It takes the form of a tapered ring, largest diameter inward. The piston travels up and down the cylinder and has a spring behind it to keep the pushrod in contact with the clutch arm. The release bearing is always in light contact with the clutch, there is no free play as there used to be when clutches were adjusted manually. These clutches are self adjusting, any wear is taken up by the spring. To lubricate the cylinder, release the rubber boot, you can push the piston back with your finger, then liberally smear red rubber grease on the inside of the cylinder and the dish in the end of the piston where the pushrod makes contact. What you are also doing here is preventing rust on the inside of the cylinder, as the clutch wears the piston travels further along in the cylinder to compensate for the wear, if it is rusty the seal wears quickly and the cylinder leaks, same applies to wheel cylinders. Replace the rubber boot. Lubricate the other end of the push rod where it contacts the release arm with, ideally white grease because it is waterproof but any lithium or moly grease will do the job. Here endeth the first lesson on slave cylinders There will be a test next week!

Regards Geoff Peace.