Climb, Cruise, Descent - Is The Prius For Me?

[Jetmoo]

Hi Everyone,

I've just joined the website as I would love to pick your collective brains about the Prius and its suitability for my life/driving style.

I chose my subject line carefully as that best represents my commute to work. Allow me to explain.

I live one side of the Pennines, in Yorkshire, and commute over the moors to Manchester Airport. The journey is 35 miles and I currently achieve around 55mpg from my 7 yr-old Fiat Stilo whose manufacturer combined mpg is 67mpg extra-urban and 53mpg combined cycle.

Driving from my house up onto the moors is an altitude gain or Climb of around 600 feet. At the end of this phase I'm looking at about 38mpg on the OBC. Over the moors I'm Cruising straight and level at around 60mph and by the end of the cruise I'm showing 44mpg.

Now here's the crucial bit...

Coming down the other side in my Descent I basically glide the car and quite often coast. My best mpg by the time I land in Saddleworth has been 67mpg reducing to 61mpg by the time I get to work via the M60 motorway (which I plod along at 60-65mph)

Obviously the descent part of my trip is upping the average economy considerably, but I can't help but feel that there's a lot of energy there going to waste. I drive as smoothly as possible and rarely touch the brakes but it still annoys me that I'm not storing up the gravitational potential for use later.

And this is what turns me on to hybrids - particularly the Prius.

But it raises a question... What is the maximum amount of recovered energy that the Prius can store? Is it equivalent to the EV mode (1.7mile at 30mph or whatever it is)? If so, over the remainder of the trip of around 10 miles urban and then 15 miles motorway will it be sufficient to better my current mpg?

I'm almost trying to justify not buying a Prius at the moment. It would be a 3rd gen used example at best, and I am totally in love with everything about the car from the looks to the interior, especially the interior).

Before my heart writes a cheque that my brain can't cope with, does anyone have a similar journey? Can I expect to achieve better than combined mpg given that I manage this in a crappy old Fiat?

Thanks for reading and, in advance, for any answers. Apologies for the pretentious description of my commute but I'm a pilot and therefore inherently disposed to tedious, borderline moronic aviation-based comparisons :P

Morgan

[Grumpy Cabbie]

I don't know where to start with that massive post :) but there is a limit to the amount of regen electricity able to be stored and it's not a great amount. If I go down a steep hill a mile long the car is usually fully full by the time I get to the bottom. The excess is wasted.

I've driven the same journey as you when heading to Manc airport and would get about the same mpg's as you. The Prius should get between 55-65 mpg at motorway speeds which is on a par to a small diesel and depends how you drive, but the Prius is a family sized 5 seater petrol automatic. The benefit of the Prius is that you'll still get superb mpg's in town too. It's still a nice car to drive and has free road tax etc.

Is there not any way you could get an extended test drive for a day or two to test? Saying that, it usually takes a little while before you can get the best out of a hybrid anyhow.

[Jetmoo]

Hi Grumpy,

Many thanks for your reply. Those are certainly the mpg figures I hoped to hear - and the charging downhill - well it was perhaps the best I could expect out of this generation of the car.

It seems everywhere I go online it's the motoring press bashing the Prius for its motorway economy vs a diesel.

But you're quite right, it's a big family car, a safe car and it also feels like the ultimate gadget for a gadget freak!

Another nod towards me going for one. I've been looking for an elusive fully specced out example but I don't like the tyre costs on bigger wheels so the 15" would suit. Looks like I really want the solar roof which I believe comes with 15s as standard. Rarer than the proverbial though every advert I see claims to have a solar roof despite the photos not showing anything that resembles one.

[johalareewi]

If you are feeling adventurous, you could get a normal prius and convert it (with a kit) to a PHEV. Flaninacupboard has done it and did have a thread about it on here somewhere. You can read more about the actual modification process over on Prius Chat.

http://priuschat.com...-modifications/

Our if you can wait a little longer, look at the Toyota plug in prius due out soon. This has a bigger Battery, and a longer range on EV, and can go faster in EV mode.

The solar roof doesn't really do much. It drives a small ventilation fan when the car is turned off to keep the inside cooler when parked in the sun. It doesn't top the Battery up.

[Habu]

From the top of the M62 at Saddleworth all the way down to Deansgate in central Manchester I'd be disappointed if I didn't average at least 80mpg. I've done this journey many times and regularly show the full 100mpg for the 30 minute drive :) Different matter going the other way.

I'll rephrase mine: Manchester, Manchester, good afternoon. Pirate 1 departing Leeming passing FL50. TAD 124, back box 125, main Go!. Squawk xxxx.

[Seamaster73]

Surely the Prius is an excellent choice in these circumstances, as zero fuel (or close to) will be used during the descent?

[sjrainsford]

Its also worth pointing out that the above is slightly better than a normal car with the prius as well, as they coast much better with less resistance than a normal car. When you back of in a petrol car you get engine compression and gearbox resistance, in the prius it's hardly noticable. The only noticable resistance is the energy recovery.

[Jan&tone]

The motoring press will always do two things.

They will 'bash' the Prius, they don't like it full stop...

They also always forget that they are NOT comparing a family size AUTO with the Prius.

When that happens the Prius cannot be beaten.

I regularly travel fro South Essex to the Isle of wight, indeed I'm on the Island as I write this... Consumption a13-m25(s)/a3 and then local roads on the IoW gave me 68mpg coming down on Friday keeping the all speed limits.

If you can't borrow one for a couple of days, hire one, check the tire pressures, which are critical, and enjoy driving again.

[Grumpy Cabbie]

Hi Grumpy,

Many thanks for your reply. Those are certainly the mpg figures I hoped to hear - and the charging downhill - well it was perhaps the best I could expect out of this generation of the car.

It seems everywhere I go online it's the motoring press bashing the Prius for its motorway economy vs a diesel.

But you're quite right, it's a big family car, a safe car and it also feels like the ultimate gadget for a gadget freak!

Another nod towards me going for one. I've been looking for an elusive fully specced out example but I don't like the tyre costs on bigger wheels so the 15" would suit. Looks like I really want the solar roof which I believe comes with 15s as standard. Rarer than the proverbial though every advert I see claims to have a solar roof despite the photos not showing anything that resembles one.

I'll answer a few more of your points. The gen2 Prius (2004-2009) isn't as economical on motorways and A roads as the gen3 but only by a few mpg's. I think when the gen2 came out a lot of the motoring press noted this, though just happened to forget the amazing mpg's in town. If you're a rep driving up and down the Country every day then get a diesel as the Prius will offer no significant benefit to you as you'll get similar mpg's as noted earlier. If you're commuting into towns then get a Prius. The relaxing and quiet drive in town is something else. Also, your engine will be off in traffic so you're not contributing to air polltion.

On that note, did you know the Prius emits 20 times less than a diesel Mondeo, and that's a brand new Mondeo. If you take one that's a couple years old (2009 Mondeo), you will note the Prius gen3 emits 200 times less smog/poisonous emissions. You could drive 20 Prii to emit the same as ONEbrand new Mondeo diesel or 200 2009 model year Mondeo diesel. If you have anyone in your family with asthma you owe it to them to get a Prius for that reason alone.

I always say to my customers that the Prius appeals to your inner nerd :) It is a gadget in itself.

Regarding tyres. The special low rolling resistance tyres for the 15 inch wheel are only about £75 fully fitted. A non known make tyre is about £50 but will cost you much more in fuel consumption. Low rolling resistance tyres make a significant difference, as do correct tyre pressures.

The low profile tyres on the 17 inch wheels look nice, but they're not cheap and if you're doing a lot of miles, then that might add up. You also get a very small loss of mpg's with the 17 inchers.

Any other questions?

[Red diesel]

Its always hilarious to see the press compare the prius to something like a Polo Bluemotion.

If diesels are that good find one the same size as a Prius with similar performance.

Red diesel

[Jetmoo]

Wow, thanks everyone. This is indeed a goldmine of just the info I wanted to hear.

I do like the sound of the new plug in Prius, but I think I prefer the current shape... Also I have nowhere near the budget for a new one. If I did I'd probably be including Leafs (urgh) and Amperas etc. in my considerations but I am moving to Edinburgh base in a couple of months and have a longer commute in my days off than a Leaf would allow.

The range extending EV types though are interesting... but then again I think I'd much rather have the proven concept that the Prius provides, along with such a rich seam of info here!

My Pa is rooting for me to get a Prius now and forwarded a link to a chap in the US (a radio Ham like himself) who has made all sorts of mods to his fleet of hybrids. The more I look at the technology the more I convince myself it's the car for me.

If nothing else, the cockpit erm I mean interior is just my idea of perfection, especially the HUD. And yes, it's a flippin family size auto with 70hp diesel supermini economy. What's not to like.

And £75 a tyre! Cripes, last time paid over £500 for four. 17" 245s - Never again!

[timberwolf]

Like any car the Prius has its pro and cons. The HSD technology is brilliant, you don't feel gear changes because there are no gears, you rarely feel when the petrol engine switches off and on, and the coast/gliding is fun.

I think the biggest downsides is probably the unpleasant feel of the interior, it feels cheap and that might be okay but it is probably also going to creak and rattle.

[johalareewi]

I think the biggest downsides is probably the unpleasant feel of the interior, it feels cheap and that might be okay but it is probably also going to creak and rattle.

Depends what you are used to. I have come up from minis, metros, astras and the like so I am well used to creaking plastic. I have a sheet or two of sticky back felt handy.

[Chris Dance]

I do not know if I am lucky with my 2011Gen 3 Prius but I have no ratlles creaks or anything. It runs very quietly and smoothly. My previous Gen 2 Prius was the same. I know rattles etc have been a problem to some owners.

[kithmo]

And £75 a tyre! Cripes, last time paid over £500 for four. 17" 245s - Never again!

That's about the same price as the Prius 17" Michelin Primacy tyres

[kithmo]

I do not know if I am lucky with my 2011Gen 3 Prius but I have no ratlles creaks or anything. It runs very quietly and smoothly. My previous Gen 2 Prius was the same. I know rattles etc have been a problem to some owners.

Ditto, the only occasional rattles I've had are from loose stuff in the glove box and sunglasses holder, but the vibration noise from the roads seems excessive to me.

[Grumpy Cabbie]

But I see you have the t-spirit which has low profile tyres. What psi do you run them at?

I have the 15's and even at 37 psi they are not too bad for comfort and cheaper to buy too. But what price fashion eh?

[Chris Dance]

I check my tyre pressures regularly. I put 33PSI Front, 32 PSI Rear (This is the Recommended on the side of drivers door pillar.) I checked the pressures today and all were a pound down probably due to colder temperatures. I think you said previously Grumpie that you set your pressures a pound higher than recommended.

[kithmo]

I have mine just 2psi higher, but the pressures don't seem to make a difference to the road noise, I've tried higher and lower up to 5psi each way. Lower psi makes it a more comfortable ride but affects handling detrimentally, causing it to understeer. Higher makes the ride very harsh but improves turn in (oversteer).

[Grumpy Cabbie]

Oh crikey you can get away with 1 or 2 psi over but don't go 5 psi over or you will have handling and steering issues.

Mine are the 15's which run higher pressures than the 17's anyhow. So when I run 37 it's only 1 or 2 psi over recommended.

[Chris Dance]

Kithmo. I find road noise depends on the road surface. Most roads in our town have been resurfaced this year and road noise from the car is less. The concrete section of motorway around Leeds gives a very loud road noise. I agree with GC that tyre pressures PSI over or under recommended will cause handling problems.

[Chris Dance]

Kithmo. I find road noise depends on the road surface. Most roads in our town have been resurfaced this year and road noise from the car is less. The concrete section of motorway around Leeds gives a very loud road noise. I agree with GC that tyre pressures PSI over or under recommended will cause handling problems.

[kithmo]

Yes, the noise does vary with surface and it's very quiet on new prefectly smooth tarmac, but I think that Toyota should have done a little more to insulate the noise, as there aren't many new perfectly smooth roads in the UK. I wouldn't say it's really loud, just at an annoying frequency, probably annoys some people (including me) more than others.

Interestingly, according to one post on the Priuschat forums, it was said that it could be electric motor cogging that causes the noise and Toyota say it's normal and to engineer it out would have meant having a more expensive drive train.