Mmt Gearbox Yet Again Flashing N In Drive Positions

[Spyros_Corolla_2006_MMT]

Hello guys

I refreshed my English and came again
Hey guys. I am the owner of a Toyota Corolla 2006 MMT 1,4 D4D with a semi-automatic gearbox. My problem is that sometimes it won’t shift upwards from 2nd to 3rd gear. The display will show that it’s shifted to 3rd but it will actually be in neutral and I have to let go of the gas pedal until it falls back to 2nd or change to manual controls and take it from there. I’ve noticed this happening when I’m “pushing hard on the gas pedal” to shift gears (RPMs getting above normal range); when I’m gently easing into a higher gear everything works smoothly. Sometimes it will shift up to 4th directly from 2nd instead. Rarely, and if I let go of the gas pedal, it will actually go into 3rd as it should have but only after a few seconds have passed.

Similar thing happens occasionally when I’ve managed to go into 3rd and then push it to go into 4th but it will jump up to 5th instead.
The guys at the official service told me I needed to change clutch disk, pressure plate and releaser (done that) and also the clutch actuator which is rather expensive though, so I’m trying to figure out if I can have it repaired instead? Or any other ideas how to fix this? Is it definitely the clutch actuator at fault in this situation?

[Justhandguns]

On 2/14/2018 at 6:59 AM, Spyros_Corolla_2006_MMT said:

Similar thing happens occasionally when I’ve managed to go into 3rd and then push it to go into 4th but it will jump up to 5th instead.
The guys at the official service told me I needed to change clutch disk, pressure plate and releaser (done that) and also the clutch actuator which is rather expensive though, so I’m trying to figure out if I can have it repaired instead? Or any other ideas how to fix this? Is it definitely the clutch actuator at fault in this situation?

Sounds like a combination of both the clutch wearing out and actuator getting old. What is the mileage of your car, has the clutch disk ever been changed? Do you also find the car has less power than before the shifting problem started?

[kostas35]

hello from me again... 2 years past and had this wellknown broblem again: flashing N and no gear to move.

Same solution again... changing the clutch disk set and problem fixed

Let me say all the story,,,,,,,,,,,,first gone to toyota where they said that they have to change actuator,disk set and trasmission ecu all cost about 2000e+

hahaha,,,then gone to my local mechanic and have changed only the disc set cost 140e+120e work.of course i knew my actuator and the trans ecu was ok.

Then we called the toyota official computer guy to programm the car(toyota corolla 2006 d4d mmt) but he said that he couldnt do it because a faulse codoccured every time he tryed to programme,,so he left saying that i have to change the ecu absolutely.

so i programmed 

 the gearbox by myself(the thing by wiring the obd,,etc,,this process is written in many sites)

ANOTHER problem i had some time ago was that i had a serious problem when the car stsrted changing gears from 1st to 5th or 3rd to 1st and generally the gearbox gone crazy//////.GONE to toyota service and they had the car for a week to fix it.After done nothing at all i took the car home and find out that a fuse was burned and when this happend the gearbox gone crazy///This fuse is a general fuse under the steering weel fusebox 10A. After changing a 100 fuses in 2 monthes period i discoverd that a false

lamp was the cause for the reverse when changing Rgear/////i cried my parking sensor thrown away at first and after find out the reverse lamp was the problem/.

GOOD LUCK TO ALL

 

[Simon1982]

I have just posted this update on the issue:

 

[Brookek91]

Hi, i have read through the feed from beginning and now know how common the problem is! 

I'm wondering anyone can give me the details of a specialist that deals with these semi automatic cars as no mechanic i know will touch it! 

I'm in Essex UK 

any help appreciated 

Many thanks 

[Simon1982]

I think you should report this to DVSA. I did and DVSA were concerned that this happened to me out of the blue with no warning, driving along and the car suddenly stuck in neutral. After keeping on top of things with the DVSA they have recently forced Toyota to do an inspection on my vehicle, which I am now awaiting the results of. I think the more people that report this to the DVSA the more likely they are going have to force Toyota's hand on this issue. For far too long this issue has remained unresolved. 

Even if you did get the expensive repair done at a Toyota garage, who's to say the issue won't re-occur 30k miles down the line?

Please please report this issue to DVSA as it is something they are currently looking into.

[Justhandguns]

On 9/12/2018 at 10:18 AM, Brookek91 said:

Hi, i have read through the feed from beginning and now know how common the problem is! 

I'm wondering anyone can give me the details of a specialist that deals with these semi automatic cars as no mechanic i know will touch it! 

I'm in Essex UK 

any help appreciated 

Many thanks 

I would say it is a very common problem for the early generations of MMT. You will probably find even more threads from the Aygo.

Few independent garages are will to deal with it due to the extensive work that has to be done. i.e. changing the actuator, maybe clutch as well, and most importantly reprogramme the gearbox ECU. 

 

[Simon1982]

You say common for the early generation of MMT. I would just like to add that my vehicle was one of those early generations of MMT that had the Customer Satisfaction Campaign done back in 2009 and yet the problem materialised a mere 30k after. As I didn't own the vehicle back then I cannot say whether or not the MMT issue occurred prior to this work, but what has been proved is even the remedial work done on the vehicle doesn't resolve this known problem.

[kostas35]

On 9/13/2018 at 5:26 PM, Simon1982 said:

I think you should report this to DVSA. I did and DVSA were concerned that this happened to me out of the blue with no warning, driving along and the car suddenly stuck in neutral. After keeping on top of things with the DVSA they have recently forced Toyota to do an inspection on my vehicle, which I am now awaiting the results of. I think the more people that report this to the DVSA the more likely they are going have to force Toyota's hand on this issue. For far too long this issue has remained unresolved. 

Even if you did get the expensive repair done at a Toyota garage, who's to say the issue won't re-occur 30k miles down the line?

Please please report this issue to DVSA as it is something they are currently looking into.

Mailed toyota europe for this.Toyota came up by ToyotaHellas the dealer of my country and they said they have nothing to do because the car was bought used from Italy!!!!AAAAAHHHH yeaaaah!THEN ITS NOT TOYOTA???Hahahaha .What i cannot acxept is...that if you open the Toyota's web site the most you'll read is that they produce SAFE cars bla bla bla,,,and they are very concerned about passenger safety blabla bla...Very funny,,,isntr it?

[Arthur123]

you will have same problem if you will remove 90080-87030 relay, which is under the bonnet.

change relay. price 7£ on eBay (5 minute job).

or it can be problem with Throttle Position Sensor 89457-52010  price on eBay 20£.

[Tonyjs007]

Hi I baught a 2012 Auris 1.4 d4d mmt automatic last week and today the car didn't start because I couldn't change gear to N from E after few minutes tried again and it started .Now I am afraid is my car is also affected with the above problems?

[Mike169]

Hi Tellboy, without trying to be nasty at all the Toyota MMT gearbox is more trouble than it's worth.

My advise would be sell the car at the earliest you can. 

Regards, Mike.

[mrpj]

18 hours ago, Mike169 said:

Hi Tellboy, without trying to be nasty at all the Toyota MMT gearbox is more trouble than it's worth.

My advise would be sell the car at the earliest you can. 

Regards, Mike.

Seconded!

[sceh]

I have had this problem on and off for years. I tried a coupled o ODB readers to see if they could throw some light on errors but the two I used  simply wrecked the ECU and removed all learned settings. I have just changed the battery  and the problem has reappeared in spades so I can't drive very far and it always disengages the box when I stop.

I had two Yaris at one stage and the problem was so bad on the first I scrapped it even though it only had 45K on the clock - mainly because Toyota wanted more than the car was worth to 'repair' it.

The current car is going to go the same way.

The MMT box is a total failure but until you understand the Japanese mentality you cannot imagine why they ever decided to do it rather than cutting a decent deal for proper auto boxes in volume.

Avoid all version of this junk and btw, it is not worth repairing  because you will get the same problems again

[sceh]

Also, I won' sell the car since if I did it would be very cheap and might be bought by a young person or worse, by a father for his daughter. Imagine what might happen if it suddenly disengaged or refused to engage when you pull out!

Toyota should be ashamed of themselves as should their useless garages

[FROSTYBALLS]

52 minutes ago, sceh said:

Toyota should be ashamed of themselves as should their useless garages

The Club has no association with Toyota, and we don't know whether anyone from Toyota visits these forums, so comments like this are probably wasted efforts.

[mrpj]

13 hours ago, FROSTYBALLS said:

The Club has no association with Toyota, and we don't know whether anyone from Toyota visits these forums, so comments like this are probably wasted efforts.

No, they aren't and probably don't, but there's nothing untoward in someone having an opinion. Or is that frowned upon now?

[FROSTYBALLS]

2 minutes ago, mrpj said:

No, they aren't and probably don't, but there's nothing untoward in someone having an opinion. Or is that frowned upon now?

No it isn't, but if the poster was hoping Toyota would take note, it is fruitless.

[John MMT]

Hi

I had this exact problem, while driving mainly when slowing to E1 or E2 the car would go into neutral and the N light would start flashing, if I turned the ignition off for a minute and started the car it would drive for another while. Here's what I did to fix it, I put the car in neutral and removed the clutch actuator at the front of the gearbox, I removed the Battery and air box, I unplugged the motor and the position sensor and removed the three bolts and removed it. I held it in a bench vice, removed the clutch position sensor 2 philips screws dont loose the rubber o ring, then the 3 allen head bolts for the motor when removed take out the special washer and make note of the direction it faces. Then I used a flat head screw driver and turned in and out fully where the motor turns, I noticed that the shaft that goes up to the clutch position sensor would pivot at a certain point, the bushes that secure this shaft were worn and causing the issue, note when the clutch rod is near fully out you will notice resistance this is only internal spring pressure. Also check that the 3 brushes look good and making contact on the motor. I ordered a clutch actuator repair kit on eBay it came from Lithuanian and I paid extra for quick post I ordered it on a Friday and received it the second Tuesday. There is a video on youtube clutch actuator repair rebuild by Yuri Maevski, this is a massive help use it. I received 2 bushes, 2 bearings, bag of grease and a technical bulletin on MMT system learing. I assembled it, the video shows you everything, note don't dog tighten the nuts or bolts, when fitting the actuator pull it towards the left wheel direction to take up any clearance in the rod against the fork and tighten the 3 bolts, I then followed page 3 and 4 of the technical bulletin, I dont think it done exactly what was discribed but I went through the process. Now she's flyin it again Thank God no problems. Also Toyota garage wanted about €1000 for a full actuator assembly. Take your time doing it and go handy.

[John MMT]

Hi

About 3 weeks after this fix same problem came back, when I press the ES button and drive with that on it drives perfect, the MMT system needs to be re calibrated correctly I have it booked in to a garage with proper diagnostics to do this reset / relearn procedure. I will up date when done and attach the technical bulletin for relearn procedure.

[John MMT]

MMT Technical Bulletin.pdf

[John MMT]

Finally have it permanently fixed😀, I got the diagnostics done was getting P0900 actuator circuit fault code I ordered the motor on eBay from UK for €117.00 fitted it and no more problems. There was 2 issues with the actuator first was one of the internal bushes was worn and the other was an internal fault in the actuator motor which gave intermittent problems. I never got it reprogrammed there is no need if doing the job your self the youtube video is very helpful. When fitting the motor make sure that the clutch rod is fully out and when fitting it to the car take up all slack from the fork and rod when in place. Another good website I found was ecutesting.com {Toyota MMT} it gives a list of fault codes and common failing parts they also do reconditioned units. Another thing main dealers are a rob. All thats needed is to get diagnostics done do some research and fit the faulty part. 

[Dung]

On 2/4/2015 at 6:39 AM, bazhokbaz said:

Hi People,

I've just signed up to contribute to this thread and i hope it helps someone. My dad's car (2006 aygo mmt) was having the intermittent fault where the transmission red light would go on just after starting the car. The 'N' neutral light/letter would be visible and solid on but when I moved into another gear, it would flash. He couldn't move the car.

After a lot of investigating I learnt the following. The gearbox is actually a manual gearbox but with an electronic clutch actuator and a shift/select gear actuator - these both do what we do to manuals, they replace needing to push a clutch pedal or physically move manual stick.

The N light typically flashes when the gear the MMT ECU thinks one thing but actual transmission thinks another OR there is a sensor fault so its sensing something unusual.

Now toyota were quoting just over £1k to diagnose and replace parts to fix my dad's car so i had a bash myself.

You will read on forums that one one sprayed a lubricant into a rubber bellow of the clutch actuator which sits on top of the gearbox housing. First I looked at my clutch actuator and I noticed that the clutch actuator was pushing the clutch fork lever- as if it was taking the manual gearbox out of gear - akin to pressing the clutch. When the engine is off, the clutch actuator is supposed to go back in and release the pressure from the clutch fork lever. Have a look, if the lever is push far left, it means either the CLUTCH STROKE SENSOR is faulty or the clutch actuator is jammed - and this is where some people have succeeded in spraying lubricant inside it.

For my dad's car, the problem was the CLUTCH STROKE SENSOR - it sits on top of the clutch actuator. It is removed by 2 philips head screws. You can easily remove it and replace it BUT you must note that the little spindle inside it turns nearly full circle so it knows when the clutch is electronically fully depressed or not. Just a note for people replacing the sensor: you push the sensor back on the housing of the clutch actuator making sure the connector plug part is at 6'clock position (where you found it before unscrewing) AND while the screws are hot it, it must be able to rotate about its position to the 10'oclock position. It must stop itself turning after the 10'oclock position and stop itself going to a 5o'clock position. If you don't ensure this before !Removed! it in, the clutch actuator will break the sensor's spindle. Our sensor somehow had taken water in because i saw corrosion on the pins and water got inside it. I replace the CLUTCH STROKE SENSOR and bingo all was back to normal again!

You will read online about ways to reset the MMT gearbox. ONLY do this if you are replacing a part (esp any of the two actuators) otherwise the simple fix of replacing the sensor above will mean you will have to lock the clutch position, initialise the clutch actuator and then initialise the MMT ECU and then teach the car when to change gears.

You may read some people have successfully "loosened 3 bolts on the clutch actuator" then rotated it anticlockwise then retightened. I realised that they were just reducing the slack they may have had in their clutch actuator and the clutch fork lever. I can't really see how this helps apart from if your car is acting like your clutch is slipping. If one was to lock the clutch via the service instructions (google blue-print initialise MMT ECU - its a blue pdf) then reinitialise the clutch actuator, you will find it will pull the pin in to lock it (for removal) and on initialising it, it will extend out to take out the slack before disengaging the clutch. It is also this mechanism which gives the car its "creep" on hills. The ECU will remember the position of the clutch fork lever so its far better than simply loosening 3 bolts and rotating the whole clutch actuator and tighten.

Lastly, lets say the your clutch was going in and out as normal, next is to check if the gear selector actuator (the one in pics where you can see 2 big motors coming from it). On top of the gearbox housing, just infront of the clutch actuator, there is a vertical tube/extension in front and above a sensor. You will see on top of it is a hex recess for a very large allen key to open it, unscrew this cap. its perfectly safe to do. inside it, you will see a flat head screw looking metal thing inside. This is actually the top end of the gear selector rod. You can actually manually change group of gears by simply using a screw driver and turning it SLIGHTLY either clock or anti-clockwise. To test this, first see what position the slit is on top of the rod (whats visible after removing the allen key cap). If its at 12-6pm position, it means its in neutral and if the car is off and was last in neutral, means the gear is correct and this means a sensor/clutch actuator is the problem. If you find that its either in the 2-8pm position or the 10-4pm position, then you know its in the wrong gear. Put the gear stick selector in the car into neutral and then use a screwdriver and put the rod in a 12-6pm position. You will actually hear you manually changing gears. Then try start the car and you may be lucky that the selector mechanism was jammed and after unjamming and you correcting the gear, it works.

Lastly, Both the clutch actuator and the gear selector actuator are just gears and cogs and I can't see what can go wrong with these and so this leads me to believe that our probs are sensor problems which are part of these actuators. Perhaps Toyota replaces the whole actuator and this is why its expensive. Toyota sell the sensors for £150 incl VAT. It sorted my problem out.

Hope this helps someone.

(As Google didn't have may threads coming up describing this problem, i'm putting these words below so that anyone searching google will find this post. flashing neutral N dashboard red transmission warning light can't select a gear no gears slipping clutch.)

Hello! 
may car having exact problem as you described. And I’m struggling with those problem. Could I ask you, what kind of sensor did you replace it. What is it called, please. 
thanks you. 

[H01]

I purchased an 08 Yaris in October 2020. It’s been running this fault intermittently ever since. We brought it to a Toyota specialist who cleaned it out and said it should sort itself out as it may have been water in the system from when the garage we purchased it from had cleaned it. It seemed to sort itself out for about a month before it started occurring again. I had always been able to sort it out in about 20 minutes by disconnecting the Battery for 15 minutes and it would be good to go again. After a few times of this in the new year, one day it refused to sort it out. Twice it’s occurred now where I have to sit in the car for anywhere between an hour to two and a half hours before it resets itself. 
We’ve now taken it to Toyota itself, and target initially quoted us £1840 for parts and labour. We wanted to use the warranty that came with the purchase, and suddenly the price changed to almost £3500 to fix it. They are now suddenly claiming that there are 2 actuators to replace at £1000 each. In this whole forum(which has been so helpful during all of this, so thank you all) I have never read that there is 2 actuators in these cars, and the original quote lined up with what I’ve read on here that others were being quoted. 
Are there really 2 actuators in it?

[Ashwin a]

Toyota has a bulletproof reputation for reliability and this gearbox with flashing should be repaired by Toyota for free as it is a factory fault we have been and do use toyotas in Africa and in UK 

Please Toyota replace these gearboxes as it is disturbing our confidence in your reliability and buying another one please sort this out as a gesture of goodwill it will do a world of good to your reputation take the money from marketing dept.

Please help us