When Does White Become Blue?

[thewingedavenger]

My son was stopped by the police today because one of his headlights was out. This despite the police car in question following an MR2 with one of its rear lenses broken and dazzling everyone behind. The Officer then decided to tell my son that his sidelights were illegal because they were blue. I was with my son when he bought the led bulbs fitted and they were described as WHITE. Admittedly they do have a slight bluish tint to them but then so does every LED bulb I've ever seen. So the question is are white LED bulbs legal and if not why are they fitted to so many cars these days. Far more annoying are the Blue headlamp bulbs the boy racers fit and dazzle everyone, at least two of these passed while supercillious plod was wasting our time. Plod then left and drove off into the gathering gloom with no lights on at all. Your thoughts please peeps.

[anchorman]

I can understand your frustration but I'm amazed that something hasn't been done a lot sooner. There are a number of blue tinted lights available on the market and you see vehicle (often trucks) with all sorts of colours displayed to the front including bright blue and green which are reserved for emergency services. The trouble is that many laws to do with vehicles are subjective so if they have stopped your son for one thing they can soon apply another while , as you say, another vehicle drives away. The bane of my life is "considerate people" that are allowed to fit big bore exhausts which come nowhere near the legal limit under which the car was originally tested.

I have just paid £13 for 2 CREE LEDs which I am reliably informed emit pure white instead of blue. However, if push comes to shove, it could well turn out that according to "Construction and Use" or EU Legislation that even they are illegal because they were not part of the original specification and I don't know if they are "E" marked.

[Big Kev]

I can understand your frustration but I'm amazed that something hasn't been done a lot sooner. There are a number of blue tinted lights available on the market and you see vehicle (often trucks) with all sorts of colours displayed to the front including bright blue and green which are reserved for emergency services. The trouble is that many laws to do with vehicles are subjective so if they have stopped your son for one thing they can soon apply another while , as you say, another vehicle drives away. The bane of my life is "considerate people" that are allowed to fit big bore exhausts which come nowhere near the legal limit under which the car was originally tested.

I have just paid £13 for 2 CREE LEDs which I am reliably informed emit pure white instead of blue. However, if push comes to shove, it could well turn out that according to "Construction and Use" or EU Legislation that even they are illegal because they were not part of the original specification and I don't know if they are "E" marked.

Oops....ah'm gonnae get the blame for this, but.....them CREE bulbs have a slight blue tinge, but my theory of additional blue tinge from the whole lens is that the CREE bulbs partially shine/diffract through the Blue Tip of the upgraded FULL BEAM bulbs I fitted.

The overall effect is a slight blue hue, but not as much as the five light LED's previously fitted which offended likes of Gus.

Just my wee theory, and have been wrong before......

Maybe they wash them in Daz at the manufacturer....the one with the blue whitener.....?

Witheld....no ageism please....

[Tony Barnsley]

Compared to 'standard' bulbs (which normally emit light at 4300K if you are lucky, often it can be down at 2700K) LEDs (particularly the high output white ones emit light at 6500K . . . which is bright daylight . . . and do appear blue when compared or next to standard bulbs. My LED sidelights are white but appear blue when I turn my dipped beam on (xenon Max Plus which have a blue tip)

The Lover the K value then more yellow the light appears. Candle light is something like 800K Bright Daylight is 6500K and equatorial daylight at noon is 14000K

[Big Kev]

Compared to 'standard' bulbs (which normally emit light at 4300K if you are lucky, often it can be down at 2700K) LEDs (particularly the high output white ones emit light at 6500K . . . which is bright daylight . . . and do appear blue when compared or next to standard bulbs. My LED sidelights are white but appear blue when I turn my dipped beam on (Xenon Max Plus which have a blue tip)

The Lover the K value then more yellow the light appears. Candle light is something like 800K Bright Daylight is 6500K and equatorial daylight at noon is 14000K

........which sorta agrees / proves my blue tipped bulb theory then, Amfiny....?

Must stop this talking sense stuff....does not sit well....

Big Kev

[Parts-King]

I'm not sure any LED bulb is "legal" as all car bulbs have to be "E" marked, if it has no "E" then it is illegal. DRL LED's are a different matter

It is getting a bit of a joke, as AM says, most lorries coming towards you have all sorts of coloured lights, and of course the local chavette will have any number of illegal lights being displayed day or night

Kingo

[Big Kev]

I'm not sure any LED bulb is "legal" as all car bulbs have to be "E" marked, if it has no "E" then it is illegal. DRL LED's are a different matter

It is getting a bit of a joke, as AM says, most lorries coming towards you have all sorts of coloured lights, and of course the local chavette will have any number of illegal lights being displayed day or night

Kingo

Good point from our German parts man, Herr Lip......could one not argue that they are being used as DRLs then, remembering to have them switched on of course.....? In the standard of light we are getting here at the moment, I mostly have my new CREE bulbs on for that reason.....like the end of the world up here.

Big Kev

[Guest]

I have been looking at DRL's this morning on cars coming towards me (seeing stars now) the factory fit DRL's are white - no hint of blue, whereas the aftermarket ones some do have a blue tinge - yep I know unscientific test.

I did notice this morning something I need to remember LED's dont produce much heat so therefore do not melt the frost on the rear lights, so need to scrape the rear lights when frosty now. :)

Gus

[firemac]

I hate those f**king blue lights! The number of times that I've jumped on the brakes when I've glimpsed a blue light in the mirror thinking it was plod when in fact it is usually some jumped-up tuwat in a clapped out Corsa or a *****-ff in a Merc.

Don's right about vehicles festooned with muti-coloured lights to the front. The last time I saw so much colur on the front of a vehicle was in the Philippines where they dress up their Jimnies & trucks like bl00dy Christmas trees. But in fairness, they are all lunatics!

[Parts-King]

I hate those f**king blue lights!

usually some jumped-up tuwat in a clapped out Corsa or a *****-ff in a Merc.

in the Philippines where they dress up their Jimnies & trucks like bl00dy Christmas trees. But in fairness, they are all lunatics!

:D: :D: :D:

Calm down Jim lad

[Guest]

What is a tuwat is it one of the creatures in star wars?

[firemac]

What is a tuwat is it one of the creatures in star wars?

It's an attempt to get around the rude word filter - and it worked !

[firemac]

I hate those f**king blue lights!

usually some jumped-up tuwat in a clapped out Corsa or a *****-ff in a Merc.

in the Philippines where they dress up their Jimnies & trucks like bl00dy Christmas trees. But in fairness, they are all lunatics!

:D: :D: :D:

Calm down Jim lad

Yes, you're right, Kingo.

But seriously, I really don't know why plod seems to ignore the really blatant forward facing blue lights on quite a few excrementmobiles. It's getting beyond a joke.

[Parts-King]

What is a tuwat is it one of the creatures in star wars?

No that was Jedi and look what happened to him

[thewingedavenger]

Did some web research today and have to say the results are sketchy. I did find the same make my son bought on the Halfords site and it does say there "For offroad or Show use Only" Could find no warnings on the packaging though and there were none at the outlet he bought them from. Perhaps Plod should start carrying a light colour temp meter to check.

[Paulus17]

What is a tuwat is it one of the creatures in star wars?

No that was Jedi and look what happened to him

What did happen to our Jedi master,did he finally get the boot??

[Davrav]

What is a tuwat is it one of the creatures in star wars?

No that was Jedi and look what happened to him

What did happen to our Jedi master,did he finally get the boot??

He couldn't resist the force of the Darkside........................

[Parts-King]

What did happen to our Jedi master,did he finally get the boot??

Potted! In off the pink via the top cushion

[anchorman]

Got my £13 CREE bulbs and if they don't turn out to be as white as driven snow as absolutely guaranteed by a certain Scot, there will be trouble..................

[Davrav]

Got my £13 CREE bulbs and if they don't turn out to be as white as driven snow as absolutely guaranteed by a certain Scot, there will be trouble..................

Anchs, you're old enough to know you need a bit of blue to get a brilliant white........................

[Big Kev]

Got my £13 CREE bulbs and if they don't turn out to be as white as driven snow as absolutely guaranteed by a certain Scot, there will be trouble..................

Anchs, you're old enough to know you need a bit of blue to get a brilliant white........................

Lack of parental control....it's his Daz fault.....

[mystic]

I class this as blue, decided to give my car some christmas treatment, a few lights and some tinsel because why not, its chritmas after all :)

[thewingedavenger]

As a follow up I have just fitted the Cree Led sidelight bulbs as mentioned in previous posts. Although a lot brighter than my sons LED's they are certainly not any whiter and still have the blue tinge. Be interesting to see if the local jobsworth plod says anything to me.

[Tech01]

Compared to 'standard' bulbs (which normally emit light at 4300K if you are lucky, often it can be down at 2700K) LEDs (particularly the high output white ones emit light at 6500K . . . which is bright daylight . . . and do appear blue when compared or next to standard bulbs. My LED sidelights are white but appear blue when I turn my dipped beam on (Xenon Max Plus which have a blue tip).

The lower the K value then more yellow the light appears. Candle light is something like 800K Bright Daylight is 6500K and equatorial daylight at noon is 14000K

I was just about to write something like this, only to find that Tony has - good job!

I don't think more than a handful of folk per 1000 population understand COLOUR TEMPERATURE of lamps and lighting. That's why people's houses and small business premises end up with both 'blue' and 'pink' fluorescent lights ('cold' and 'warm'), often in the same room, and some previously cosy living rooms end up with cold blue lights to sit and read by.

The manufacturers haven't helped until recently, but when you go out to buy a modern low-energy light bulb (CFL, LED etc), at least the packaging tries to help - if, that is, you can understand it. Often, the cheaper the lamp (eg in Chinese bargain stores), the more likely it is to be high-temperature, cold blue ('daylight'), and frequently with no colour temperature marking at all. If has no marking, then it's best to assume its cold white (bluish) - just NOT the thing for your dining room or restaurant!

In some cases, the package isn't labelled, but the base of the bulb is, eg 18W 10000h 2700K. All of the following are usually described as "white"...

2700K warm white (pinkish)

3000K warm, but less pink - probably the best IMO for domestic rooms

3200K still warm, but less so - still OK IMO for cosy room use

4000K cold white

5000K getting decidedly blue

6500K Daylight blue - efficient, high-output often, but not something you'd want to enjoy a meal by. Decidedly "industrial"!

As for the trend towards blue LED lighting for 'customised' vehicles, this is just a fashion statement IMO. It's often illegal, doesn't comply with OE spec or C&U Regs, and is frequently just plain inefficient. Anyone who illuminates their rear (UK yellow) registration plate with bluish LEDs is simply doing their best to make sure the number plate isn't legible at night. But perhaps that's the idea...

LEDs offer high efficiency, ruggedness and a long life (well, the good ones do, anyway), and, for the discerning, you can obtain them in A RANGE OF COLOUR TEMPERATURES. So, if it's originality you're looking for, and a reasonable match to your existing halogen-bulb headlights, then go for LEDs of around 3000K.

Sermon over. Hope tolerable.

Chris

PS Out here in Andalucia, a car presented for the ITV (MoT) test will be failed if has been significantly modified away from the manufacturer's OE standard. Such unacceptable mods include untested and uncertificated and non-professionally fitted bull-bars, wheel and tyre sizes, towbars, bodywork, mechanicals and suspension - and lighting. Boy racers and customisers have a simple choice: Don't get the vehicle tested (v.risky and expensive), OR remove the non-standard bits before presenting for test! The latter is what most of them do, but at least it rams home the message that seriously DIY-modified vehicles are not acceptable. For the Classic Car enthusiast, and for professionally (and safely) upgraded vehicles, there is the option of having the modified vehicle examined by a Vehicle Inspection Engineer, prior to an extra-thorough ITV test. Cost is about €140 for all this, so the 'erberts with blue lighting and raucous exhausts tend not to bother. "Trafico" police round them up later, probably. C.