Aygo Mmt Clutch Failure & Toyota Extended Warranty

[ihpj]

I hope everyone had a happy new year!

I wanted to post today because our Aygo suffered it's first real mechanical issue, namely clutch slip that was accompanied by extended BING/BING/BING whilst driving.

Vehicle was parked up at home and Toyota Assist contacted (provided through The AA). They turned up within 20 minutes of the call, checked the car over and after test drive came to the conclusion the clutch was definitely slipping and deemed car undriveable as a result. Recovered to local Toyota Garage by them and now I await to see what Toyotas stance will be tomorrow morning.

Part of the reason I took out the Toyota extended warranty was with an eye on MMT related failure; the other being peace of mind in case of unexpected repairs (suspension).

Our car is a facelift 2009/09 MMT. It has behaved faultlessly in its little over 3 years (from new) that we have owned it and with a shade over 30k miles. It has a full Toyota main dealer S/H and recent MOT. By reading people's experiences, clutch slip/failure was expected - to find myself here is a bit surreal as I guess I hoped it wouldn't happen to me...but it has.

I am posting this thread with a view of sharing my experience of dealing with Toyota, their extended warranty, my local franchise dealer and the MMT gearbox itself.

I am hoping that Toyoa will accept the claim under the terms of their (extended) warranty because in the face of a rejection, my contention will be that an MMT is an enclosed unit. I have no bearing or control over how it works and elements within it (like the clutch) are totally and wholly controlled by the vehicle itself. I have a drive by wire throttle and drive by wire gearing system, any failure of that or associated components cannot be attributed to me because the entire unit and system is enclosed and self governing.

I do hope Toyota won't fight me on this, but if it comes down to it, I want to be ready!

Any thoughts/comments/observations/etc. welcome.

[ihpj]

Just an afterthought, I doubt it is the clutch itself that is at fault; having re-read the (many) similar threads, it would appear the culprit tends to be the thrust bearing and/or actuator itself. I'm hoping that, in my case, this holds true and being purely mechanical parts, wear and tear should not come into consideration when assessing the failure of these components.

I doubt my local garage will be able to fully assess the fault as tomorrow is a Saturday, but I will update with full details as I learn them (guessing Monday).

[rajivrattna]

I bought a used Aygo 2008, from toyota dealer here in Sweden and got what is known as "toyotas quality guarantee" for used cars, free. The only condition is that I get the service from Toyota once a year. It is valid till the car is 8 years old i.e. till 2016. The water pump that was leaking got changed free under that guarantee and I am hoping that the clutch will go before 2016 so that can be changed as well. During my last service, I asked the toyota workshop and they said that it was fully covered if it failed before 2016. Your extended guarantee should be even better than my freebie guarantee, since you are paying extra for it.

[S_J_P]

I'll be following this thread with interest!

I had a Black MMT, and was preparing myself for the three-year failure and the argument with Toyota over whether a wearable-part such as the MMT's clutch is truly wearable in the usual sense or whether it should be classed as a mechanical item. Before I had a chance to find out, Mr.T offered me a new Fire at a discount so I switched back to manual.

The MMT (in my opinion) is an abomination and should never have made it into production, the way it slips the clutch in the lower gears is horrendous and it's no surprise that the clutches fail so swiftly, I'd like to think that Toyota will either recognise the premature failures as inherent faults or mechanical failures both of which should be covered by their duty of care/warranty.

Have you checked the T&C of the extended care package to see whether there are any specific exclusions, or even a reference to the MMT clutch itself?

[mrpj]

When I purchased a MMT Yaris in 2010 the salesman was specifically asked about clutch failure and warranty cover, in the presence of an independent witness, we know what they're like don't we?! My reasons were as mentioned in the opening post. He went away to find out because the question had never been asked of him before - or so he said.

He said the clutch was covered under warranty, that's the original new car version though. I didn't have the car long enough to put them to the test.

[T.F.S.B.I.G.W.S.]

Good luck with that! Let us know how you get on

[Bemused2]

ihpj I really do wish you a positive outcome to your problem.

If the clutch plates are worn then they may say that its wear and tear on a friction plate that has a limited life. A bit like brake pads.

Their contention may be that its the style of driving that has contributed to the failure. A lot of town driving, leaving it in drive when stood still with only the handbrake on, being a boy racer, etc. Be prepared for such a reply..

It appears that from reading other internet posts that some go at 40k, yours seems to have failed relatively early which hopefully may point to a mechanical failure. Anyway, the best of luck.

[mrpj]

But with the MMT "style of driving" is determined more by the electronics, the driver really not having much control over what happens. After all it's impossible to drive with a foot resting on the clutch pedal etc.

Lots of manual cars are subjected to town driving, isn't the Aygo a so-called "city car"? Therefore it should be fit for that purpose. The MMT doesn't come with a warning about not to be used excessively in an urban environment. The MMT may be left in drive with the handbrake on too, the clutch disengages as it does with the footbrake pedal pressed.

"I am hoping that Toyoa will accept the claim under the terms of their (extended) warranty because in the face of a rejection, my contention will be that an MMT is an enclosed unit. I have no bearing or control over how it works and elements within it (like the clutch) are totally and wholly controlled by the vehicle itself. I have a drive by wire throttle and drive by wire gearing system, any failure of that or associated components cannot be attributed to me because the entire unit and system is enclosed and self governing."

This was exactly my reasoning with regards to the questioning of the salesman which they agreed with. Also a clutch assembly should last more than 30k miles and three years.

Good luck to the OP too.

[ihpj]

Many thanks for the comments, words of advice and contributions.

As expected although recovered to locals Toyota garage, they were unable to check over the vehicle. Hopefully should have some answers Monday so will put back then.

[ihpj]

Right, update (and it's good news!):

Garage called and advised clutch itself had failed. I played a little dumb and asked them as it was an auto, why the clutch? They explained the whole drive-by-wire system and that the 'car controls the clutch and gears and it's a self contained system'. Queried if there were any upgraded parts they would fit etc. to avoid this failure again; they stated they would be fitting revised parts and the process would involve any updates to MMT ECU etc. etc.

They informed me that they had also found a leaking driveshaft seal, explained these were two unrelated instances and they had submitted a warranty claim for this as well. The garage advised they were waiting for go ahead from Toyota Extended Warranty to get this all done; as we have been without car since Friday and entitled to hire/replacement car, garage advised they were confident they could have all repairs completed today or early tomorrow morning - as they couldn't see why warranty would reject the claim etc.

So, in a matter of hours the fault had been identified, parts sourced and ready, claim sent off to warranty company for authorisation, replacement car standing by, and repair turnaround of same day on this job. Right now, everything is proceeding as I hoped and why I paid for Toyota Extended Warranty.

Imagine the hassles if I had saved a few ££ and gone with a Third Party Provider who would be working to reject the claim rather than working with me to fix and get sorted!

I am waiting to hear about confirmation of repair authorisation and will update again; but looks like the motivation for buying the warranty was prudent and I would urge others with similalrly aged cars (i.e. those that came with 3YR/60k) to heed my experience and consider the MMT box as a key motivator for buying the Toyota warranty. Any questions/thoughts/comments please let me know!

[ihpj]

Claim accepted in full by Toyota Extended Warranty; repair authority given and Aygo should be back with me by afternoon tomorrow.

Overall very impressed and precisely what I expected in terms of service. Very happy!

I hope my experience helps others (when I collect the car I will ask Toyota what the repair cost would have been if not for warranty. At a guess I'm going to say £500?).

[ihpj]

Thought I would post a link to a previously discussed thread on a similar topic where we discuss the MMT and warranty:

http://www.toyotaownersclub.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=106987&st=0

[Bemused2]

Very pleased for you. Not that it went in the first place but they have agreed to fix it for free. Shows that it can be worth getting a decent warranty.

With dealer labour charges and parts probably over £1k to fix.

[mrpj]

"Imagine the hassles if I had saved a few ££ and gone with a Third Party Provider who would be working to reject the claim rather than working with me to fix and get sorted!"

Yes, most, if not all of these aftermarket, third party warranties are not worth the paper they are printed on! In fact, in the event of a claim, it would become very difficult to come up with something they actually cover.

Good news, glad it's being sorted.

[ihpj]

Got the car back this afternoon. Confirmation of work completed:

* replaced clutch pressure plate

* replaced friction plate

* replaced release bearing

(complete clutch kit fitted)

* O/S driveshaft seal also replaced due to a weep having been found by them (warranty)

Gear changes are crisp and snappy; increase in revs. now equal momentum rather than 'revs flaring' - very pleased with everything and in particular with the way the claim was handed by Toyota Extended Warranty and my dealer.

Should anyone ever ask what's the worth of Toyata warranty? Let this be an example why. Will I be renewing my warranty in June 2013? You bet I will!

[tdwuk]

Hi,

I am happy to hear that you got your car sorted. I just bought a 58 plate Corolla Verso Auto and I am considering the extended warranty as the car has done 64k miles and is just over 4 years old, I understand the requirement is under 100k miles and 7 years. I checked the service book, serviced every year at Halfords Auto Centres not Toyota so hopefully that won't be a problem. I am worried about the MMT now after feeling a bit of jerking and reading various threads.