Brake Fluid

[chezwot]

Can someone tell me if the brake fluid is changed on the iQ2 second service, thanks.

[johnan]

Apparently Toyota advise that it should be changed every 2nd service, but it is not mandatory and you are obviously charged extra if it is done.

I think if Toyota say it is advisable then it should be included in the service routine, not be optional and also included as part of a pre-paid service plan, which I don't think it is at present.

As ever, you may be charged for it being done but it hasn't actually been changed....the old "trust the dealer" syndrome....

John

[chezwot]

Thank's Johnan,

"Trust the dealer" is a problem here in Portugal. They were very attentative when I bought the car but emails to them about this and other questions go unanswered. My bank manager here refers to car dealers as "Cigano's", Portuguese for gypsy! I'll have to resort to tying a piece of cotten round the cap of the brake fluid container to see if it's been removed

[johnan]

Let us know how you get on, Chez, whether they do or don't change the fluid and if you are charged for it or not.

John

[s44gtw]

Did the car get re-called for the brake pipe?

If so,

it should have had the Brake Fluid changed at that point.

george

[chezwot]

Finally, this morning I received an email from my dealer confirming that the brake fluid, engine oil and filter, cabin filter and inspections per the maintainace plan are included at a cost of 220€ (£179), but I think I will still use the cotton!

[johnan]

My cabin filter was supposed to be changed at the second service but wasn't.. "only changed if it needs to be, sir".. but I know they didn't check it, so how could they know it was OK other than making an assumption that mine would be the same as others of the same age, that didn't need to be changed. They could at least have had a look.

Time for "cotton" again I think!

(of course if you are not charged for a new filter then there is no problem, but they are quite expensive so if you are charged for one you most definitely want to make sure you do have a new one.)

John

[chezwot]

Hi John, Where is the cabin filter located?

[johnan]

Hi John, Where is the cabin filter located?

Now you are asking!!

I put this thread up a few years ago which hopefully may help:

http://www.toyotaownersclub.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=94846&hl=%2Bcabin+%2Bfilter

John

[acetip]

My cabin filter was supposed to be changed at the second service but wasn't.. "only changed if it needs to be, sir".. but I know they didn't check it, so how could they know it was OK other than making an assumption that mine would be the same as others of the same age, that didn't need to be changed. They could at least have had a look.

Time for "cotton" again I think!

(of course if you are not charged for a new filter then there is no problem, but they are quite expensive so if you are charged for one you most definitely want to make sure you do have a new one.)

John

When i asked my dealer when they changed the cabin pollen filter i was told when the customer asks for it to be changed. which is a stupid answeer as many owners dont know it even exists

In my Auris handbook it suggest cleaning it by an airgun (or vacuum cleaner i suppose.

As to brake fluid change, if one does a small annual miliage as i do then your dealer can test the fluid for contaminates such as water etc,and maybe not need changing.

Brake fluid atttracts water so thats the main reason for the change.

Toyota say change every two years.Some makers give a longer time.The Ford Mondeos i had were every eighteen months.

[johnan]

Yes, I usually check my brake fluid, certainly on my other car(s) using a gadget that measures the moisture content, but unfortunately the probe will not get into the top of the reservoir easily as it is too near the top of the upper edge of the underbonnet area. I'll have to think of a way to do it.

I have never had a car whose brake fluid has absorbed a noticeable amount of water in two years, but maybe that's just luck!

It is a time thing though, I think, I don't think lack of mileage affects the potential amount of moisture absorbed by the fluid so much as time exposed to the atmosphere.

John

[acetip]

Hi John,

Many year ago i read an article in a motoring magazine by either Lockheed or Girling stating that the most of any water that gets in to brake fluid is through the brake hoses.

Of course these hoses get a good soaking in wet weather when you are driving.

so assume this does not happen so much when a car is parked up in a garage as mine is.

This time of the year my car is used very little,cos i use the wifes car as workhorse.

I have two cheap disposable dehumidifiers in my garage to protect the many tools hanging up, some are just bare metal and they would be prone to rust if i did not protect them in the winter months.

These must reduce any water being absorbed in my cars brake fluid as well.

Peter

[johnan]

That makes sense, Peter, as the surface area in the reservoir is not very large and couldn't absorb very much moisture anyway although it is not so much water as such, but the microscopic moisture particles in normal air that would find their way through the rubber by osmosis that does the damage, I believe, so dehumidifiers can't do any harm!

It is all a bit too chemical for me, really, I prefer oily, noisy things.

It would be interesting to find out what the dealer's tester says in the case of a low mileage car.

John

[chezwot]

It's obviously and age thing John, because having read your instructions, even armed with a torch I could not find the gap, or the filter cover in the passenger footwell, until I realised that your instructions were for a right-hand drive car! On looking in the drivers footwell, I discovered the filter cover, but it took a bit of fiddling around the acelerator pedal to extracate the filter. It was filthy and I will check that it has been replaced after the service.

[tarquin]

The way i see things, i have a philosophy of dealing with problems myself. I know replacement filters are in the service plan but i also see the con behind it. If they don't change your cabin filter ( pollen filter) then they save money. So they will fob you off with " only if the customer asks" and " only if it needs changing" if YOU pull it out and its clogged with dead insects etc etc then change it. Same with the air filter, personally, i found that it didn't take much with the filter looking a bit blackened to have detrimental

effect on performance so i check it myself and change it as i see fit and don't use the service plan to let them tell me when "they " think it needs changing. After all you are more likely to know your car better than them. Personally if they said they checked the cabin filter and you know they didn't, there is no point bothering with them. If you think its badly contaminated just change it. Of course if they have charged you thats a different story.

David

[johnan]

Yup, it's dead easy to do the work yourself, its the spurious charging, if it occurs, that is the real nasty.

John

[Soeley]

Does the moisture in the brake fluid not travel down to the lowest point of the system, i.e. down to the calipers? Is that not why when you bleed the brakes most of the dirty fluid comes out first and why you get brake fade as the moisture in the fluid boils at a lower temperature that the actual fluid?

If that is the case then testing the fluid at the reservoir cap would give quite a false reading.

I have also been told that modern cars with ABS need fluid in better condition than older cars without ABS as they are more sensitive.

[johnan]

That is very true, Mark, you are quite right.

The tester gadgets only give an indication of whether the reservoir fluid has absorbed moisture, not if there are globules of water lurking in the hydraulic cylinders at the lower limits of the system

i normally change the fluid in my other car every three years, not because of possible boiling of the water under heavy continuous braking, which I try not to do(!), but more to try to prevent internal corrosion of the cylinders.

I don't mind Toyota changing the fluid, I just think it should be automatically included as a necessity and not as an option if it is deemed important by Toyota, and I have my doubts if it is always changed when they say it has been but that is just me being suspicious of big garages again. Probably unfounded..Possibly..Perhaps.

John

[acetip]

Before master cylinders were made of aluminiun and changing brake fluid was not the norm, rusted bores of a master cylinder was not uncommon cause of brake problems, so some water must be retained in the master cylinder to cause rusting.

But a rusted wheel cylinder was rare,so the idea that water in a brake system drains to the lowest point seems doubtful

i have not heard much about caliper pistons rusting up in the caliper when a cars been standing for a long while.

Should have thought any water, if it drained as claimed would cause this to happen.