Space Saver?

[namead]

Hello oh fonts of knowledge

Ok, having disposed of my BSRs and got "normal" tyres now, what's the best source of a space saver that would fit - having looked at eBay for a full size spare.

There are Avensis space savers at 125/70 17 but will it fit? The sizing would be right not to have a drop on a corner for the T180, but???

It does ride better without the BSRs in now, and although I asked for normal duellers, the garage have fitted ones with that nice logo. I suspect they had them in stock so thats why I've got them. Quite odd really - the new Rav has the same tyres as the T180, just not BSR enabled, and no BSR logo.

As for the BSRs - interesting discussion with the dealer. They don't know how long they will keep the special BSR machine and what they do when it goes wrong, because the new Rav isn't BSR. And I was amazed at the weight - carrying another passenger with you the whole time

[CharlieFarlie]

Most of the information is here....

http://www.toyotaownersclub.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=133751

I have never heard of anyone sourcing a space saver. There has never been one for the Rav and I'm unsure if one would work if you found one cos of the weight of the car..

Many of Us T180 owners have swapped to normal tyres and use either a normal sized spare or I now carry a tyre repair kit cos lumping that Very heavy wheel is just a pain..

I think only the Rav4 uses the BSR kit so its well known that the fitting kit lies redundant so how can they be expected to keep and maintain the very expensive machinery..

The weight of the combined BSR kit and wheel and the tyre have a huge detrimental effect on the cars fitted with them...

[Guest]

There will be a space saver available in June for the new Rav apparently, I asked the question of would it fit the 4.3 and it was confirmed that it would, the new Rav appears to have a 17 & 18 inch wheel, so we may all be in luck.

Mind you I have a full size spare thrown in the boot for long journeys and a puncture repair kit/ compressor in all the time, so do I need a space saver? :)

Gus

[Davrav]

, so do I need a space saver? :)

Gus

Only if you want to save space I guess

[namead]

Many of Us T180 owners have swapped to normal tyres and use either a normal sized spare or I now carry a tyre repair kit cos lumping that Very heavy wheel is just a pain..

I think only the Rav4 uses the BSR kit so its well known that the fitting kit lies redundant so how can they be expected to keep and maintain the very expensive machinery..

The weight of the combined BSR kit and wheel and the tyre have a huge detrimental effect on the cars fitted with them...

Sorry I wasn't clear - I've gone across to the dark side and the BSrs will form nice flower pots in the garden when I've cleaned them up.

I have got a pump and puncture repair kit - not sure about weights though - the Avensis is similar weight I think

[Big Kev]

Most of the information is here....

http://www.toyotaownersclub.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=133751

I have never heard of anyone sourcing a space saver. There has never been one for the Rav and I'm unsure if one would work if you found one cos of the weight of the car..

Many of Us T180 owners have swapped to normal tyres and use either a normal sized spare or I now carry a tyre repair kit cos lumping that Very heavy wheel is just a pain..

I think only the Rav4 uses the BSR kit so its well known that the fitting kit lies redundant so how can they be expected to keep and maintain the very expensive machinery..

The weight of the combined BSR kit and wheel and the tyre have a huge detrimental effect on the cars fitted with them...

Charlie......are we missing sumfink here....? Namead.....please totally clarify.....are you now running tyres with the BSR LOGO, but no BSR rings fitted.....?

Big kev

[namead]

There will be a space saver available in June for the new Rav apparently, I asked the question of would it fit the 4.3 and it was confirmed that it would, the new Rav appears to have a 17 & 18 inch wheel, so we may all be in luck.

Mind you I have a full size spare thrown in the boot for long journeys and a puncture repair kit/ compressor in all the time, so do I need a space saver? :)

Gus

I had noticed the wheels on the Rav in the showroom and it had 235/55/18 Bridgestone Duellers but without the BSR logo on the side and I had assumed I'd be getting a set of those but no, I got ones with the logo on it.

Call the justification for a space saver as belt and braces - pretty much doing the same as you do with your full size, but going for a smaller wheel.

[namead]

, so do I need a space saver? :)

Gus

Only if you want to save space I guess

Its partly because I could only find one T180 wheel and that was "collection only" and in Cumbria - and I'm near PomP

[namead]

Charlie......are we missing sumfink here....? Namead.....please totally clarify.....are you now running tyres with the BSR LOGO, but no BSR rings fitted.....?

Big kev

Can someone tell me how to change my username from namead for starters - not exactly friendly is it, so apologies for that

And yes - my Toyota (note - that's right, Toyota) dealer fitted a complete set of Bridgestone Duellers with the BSR logo and I have the set of BSR rings in my garage

My guess is that they had them in stock so thats what I got - they said they couldn't get Yokohama's which was my first choice because they are on my wife's XT5, but I could have Dunlops. I opted for the Bridgestones

Actually - I need to clarify - the dealer isn't my local dealer, but one in the midlands who has the gadget to do the job near my work. No names, no pack drill

[LeeADAB]

Not sure about the 4.3 but I was looking at alloys for when mine corrode too much. I will either have them refurbished or buy new ones. The Avensis although 5 stud has 5x100 pcd and my 4.2 Rav has 5x114.3 pcd so prob won't fit? I may be wrong but before you spend out on Avensis alloys maybe worth someone confirming.

Lee

[CharlieFarlie]

DO NOT fit tyres with the BSR logo on without the BSR kit inside.. It has insurance implications because it indicates that the car is equipped with run flat equipment when its not....

Doesn't matter that you may be the only driver and have knowledge.. Trust me I put some amount of time into researching this subject as did Big Kev !

Removing the tyres AND BSR kit and replacing with normal tyres is not a problem.. Just notify your insurers of the changes to the cars original specification and away you go.. BSR logo tyres are a big no no ...

Read the thread and all will be revealed...............

[Big Kev]

Forget no names no pack drill, namead.....no Main Dealer should be fitting these tyres without the requisite gubbins inside. I am also having a thicky......these are brand new tyres, fitted to replace your actual worn out runflats which previously had BSR rings?

I would have no problem in naming them, and asking them why such a deviation, which they wanted me to sign a disclaimer to?

Big Kev

[namead]

these are brand new tyres, fitted to replace your actual worn out runflats which previously had BSR rings?

I would have no problem in naming them, and asking them why such a deviation, which they wanted me to sign a disclaimer to?

Big Kev

Yes, they are brand new tyres fitted to replace my worn out tyres. I opted for front and rear despite the rears having some tread to avoid the inconvenience of having to go back, as my local dealer doesn't have the kit to work on BSRs and the one near my work does

Sequence:

• I called the dealer to request if they would supply NON BSR tyres for the Rav and remove the BSRs. I requested Yokohama Geolanders
  
• They agreed they would supply and fit tyres having removed the BSRs
  
• I selected Bridgestones over Dunlops as they could not source Yokohamas - there was a £1 difference per tyre and I've found Dunlops to be noisy in the past
  
• Tyres fitted, BSRs removed (and now in my garage)
  

And there's more...

The tyres fitted are Dueller H/T 687 - tyres that Bridgetone don't have on their web site any more - they have 689 and 682 - neither appears to have the logo. Putting "find my car" into the Bridgestone site finds 687, within the 4x4 section and not the run flat section (gets more confusing as I go along)

Step-son-in-law (if that's right, its my step-daughter's husband) works in the trade and he's seeing what he can find out. And here's another twist - according to the dealer, ANY tyre can be fitted with BSRs, not just the Bridgestone, and the logo is there to tell a fitter it is present - anyone care to comment?

As far as it appears, all I have is discontinued stock that just happen to have the logo on

[namead]

Just spoken to Bridgestone technical:

They say the logo is only only one side of the tyre, which doesn't matter because its unidirectional. They say the BSR is NOT inetgral to the operation of the tyre and it will work perfectly well without it.

It does appear the 687 is being discontinued, hence not being visible on the website as a "current" product

[Big Kev]

Sorry mucker.....I have never heard such hypocritical pish in my life !!!!

You hit the nail on the head.....the logo is there to tell the fitter about the presence of the BSR, or at least warn him OR A SUBSEQUENT USER OR BUYER they are in some way bloody different.

They have sold you old stock at new prices just to move them on......now go tell your insurance you have runflat logo'd tyres which are not actually runflat enabled, and you will get the same answer as Charlie got.....go forth and multiply. As has been said, you can fit normal tyres and inform your insurance of this minor deviation to original spec.

The honesty part is they are indeed absolutely normal tyres which can be used with or without the BSR.......that is part of the original con which upset many like me.....asking why were they 230 quid to change.

Trust you understand this rant is not aimed at you.....the research that some of us in the past have done is being contradicted by somebody who needs to move redundant previously over priced stock. I bet they didn't charge you 200 quid plus per tyre....?

You should have heard the carp we used to be told about these tyres having specially flexible sidewalls in order to stretch over the BSR ring, so they really were "special"......had that guy been Pinnochio, I would have been blinded in both eyes.......

Big Kev

[namead]

You should have heard the carp we used to be told about these tyres having specially flexible sidewalls in order to stretch over the BSR ring, so they really were "special"......had that guy been Pinnochio, I would have been blinded in both eyes.......

Big Kev

Here's an update from step daughter's husband:

Their sup.plier says that they can get 687's and they come with a new support ring as standard, but are supplied only to "specialist" dealers.

As Toyota garages tell you that they will only replace a BSR if its broken, and that they carry a couple in stock just in case, the comment from the supplier seems to be absolute twaddle

"Oh what a tangled web we weave" springs to mind in this whole debacle. And if BSRs were that good, why did Toyota stop using them? Why doesn't the new Rav have them? Why doesn't anyone else use them?

never mind... I'm free of them now and I'm sure they will make nice planters for the garden

[CharlieFarlie]

One huge point being missed here is this...

YES a BSR tyre can be used without the kit inside... BUT the tyre is different from a normaly constructed tyre as they have to be stretched onto the wheel over the BSR ring... If they were constructed as normal tyres the we could all have used Nt tyre we liked instead of being held to ransoms for the one fit only tyre .......

Why on earth would you even consider fitting anything but a normal tyre now you have removed the BSR kit ?? Sorry it just does not add up...

The BSR logo is to tell everyone and that includes the garage The Driver and anyone else involved with the vehicle that the vehicle IS equipped with Runflat kit so can be driven within certain limitations even if it loses its air..

OK this is going to sound extreme !! But try telling a policeman or accident investigator that its OL Boss the logos don't matter cos they are on the inside .....

Your insurance company would take a dim view at best and leave you withot cover at worst ....

Your gamble mate !! Good luck !

[CharlieFarlie]

Sorry for the spelling errors I have only the phone for a while .....

[voyager t180]

, so do I need a space saver?

Gus

Only if you want to save space I guess

Its partly because I could only find one T180 wheel and that was "collection only" and in Cumbria - and I'm near PomP

Ive just ditched my runflats today,and was thinking of carrying a spare as well..

But like Charlie says it seems a bit pointless saving weight on the runflats only to replace it with a spare wheel,apart from losing valuable boot space.

I'm gonna get a pump and sealant from Halfords and hope I never have to actually use it ha.

[Hoovie]

Just a comment about this "inside" thing .... If I am reading this right, the OP has been told tha the logo is present on only one side f the tyre and if the BSR ring is not fitted, then the tyre can simply be fitted 'the other way round', thereby having the logo on the inside and so avoiding confusion of whether BSR was fitted or not?

Well ..... I do not believe tyres are actually made in this and the vast majority (all?) have a designated "INSIDE" side, with the word. "INSIDE" written on it in raised rubber. I'll have a look at my NON-BSR 687 Duellers on Monday to see if they have an "INSIDE" indicated on them, and be be very surprised if they do not!

FWIW, I will have two 17" RAV4 wheels (as fitted to the XT-R) available in about a week, (possibly even with brand new tyres on) and suitable for use as main wheels for an XT-R and as spares for those RAVs with 18" wheels :)

[anchorman]

They only have the word "inside" on them if they are directional.

[Hoovie]

They only have the word "inside" on them if they are directional.

Are you sure about that? I have a set of Michelin Alpins that are not directional and have "inside" on them.

[anchorman]

Not now you've said that but why would they say "inside" if not> Mine don't have a symetrical directional tread but the tyres are different on the inside.

[Hoovie]

Did a little research on this ....

directional tyres will have an "inside" noted on them

Also NON-directional tyres, but with asymmetric tread patterns also have a designated "inside" and must be fitted appropriately as the tread is designed to direct water to the outside of the car, so if fitted wrong way found, the water drives into the wheel arch.

Most modern non-directional quality-brand tyres are now asymmetric, and I would guess soon probably just about all will be :)