Driving In Mainland Europe

[webleymk3]

Car will be getting a full service before we leave. Not taking the chance on it.

[Merseyshark]

Just back from a 2436 mile journey from Stockport via Diss, Dover, Dunkirk, Amiens, and Caen to the far west of Brittany and back without a hitch.

Managed an overall mpg of 44.2 (brim to brim method) and so delighted with the old jalopy.

Incidentally, supermarket diesel was hard to resist, one Super U had it for 1 euro 26.9 cents !!!

Great, great fun although my pal's Garmin had us driving through a field (on the screen) when in fact we were on the A84 - poorly updated maps !!

[Guest]

And no bingo in Portugal ..... Even watching and you are in trouble....

[DominicPriestley]

Get one of these....

https://www.saneftolling.co.uk/what-is-liber-t

Makes the tolls a dream in France and you can use the fast lane.

The Peripherique is an experience at any time of day. Be decisive. Don't expect to be let in. The French don't do that. Not sure if Toyota Satnav does, but my TomTom on iPhone converts the Kph into Mph for you. A handy tool to have. Speed cameras are clearly marked so no worries there. Diesel on Autoroutes 2 weeks ago was 1.48 a litre. Off Autoroute in town I filled at a BP garage for 1.31 a litre. I averaged 48.1 over my 2100 miles 2weeks ago with a fair bit of weight and full spare in the back.

[Len7]

There is an outer ring road around Paris called the A104 or La Francilienne which might be a help

There are a number of garages on the road with fuel at non motorway prices

Sounds a brilliant trip and hope you have a great time

Full report expected when you are back of course!

[webleymk3]

Planning on avoiding Paris this time. I don't think my marriage could take a drive like that!!!

[flyboyprowler]

Get one of these....

https://www.saneftolling.co.uk/what-is-liber-t

Makes the tolls a dream in France and you can use the fast lane.

The Peripherique is an experience at any time of day. Be decisive. Don't expect to be let in. The French don't do that. Not sure if Toyota Satnav does, but my TomTom on iPhone converts the Kph into Mph for you. A handy tool to have. Speed cameras are clearly marked so no worries there. Diesel on Autoroutes 2 weeks ago was 1.48 a litre. Off Autoroute in town I filled at a BP garage for 1.31 a litre. I averaged 48.1 over my 2100 miles 2weeks ago with a fair bit of weight and full spare in the back.

Not completely sure, but I think that speed camera alerts or information on sat navs MAY be illegal in La Belle France. However, nice to see the petrol prices are down a bit over there. I am "doing" France in a couple of weeks, mostly north coast, and then south to Spain. Looking forward to the trip!!

[Merseyshark]

the great thing about most French speed traps is that you get a fair warning, then a speed limit sign and then the camera - your own fault if you get caught IMHuO.

[Sooty torques]

Yep can confirm that any device capable of notifying the driver of speed traps (ie: SatNav speed camera databases) are illegal in France. We have them switched off on our TomTom when driving through France (easy to do). Most fixed speed cameras are signposted way before and usually have reflective black & yellow warning stripes on their little grey boxes on the hard-shoulder; so agree if you get caught, your own fault. Fixed speed traps in France are to slow you down at / before accident black-spots, bends, hills (to stop you running into the back of slow lorries) or junctions by and large. They almost always face the on-coming traffic.

If the Gendarmes / Agents de Police stop you and find any warning system is active for France in any SatNav, etc. they will confiscate the device (you won't see it again) and fine you.

Be aware that the French motorway police use small hidden remote radar video speed traps just off the hard shoulder (little tripod about 2ft / 600mm high) and the police car is hidden *way* back from the road side. Very difficult to spot - we saw a couple of these last Christmas driving down the A75 / E11 en route to Spain. In Normandy we've seen the long-range version in use on the A28 / E402 where the police are a couple of kilometres away on a crest / hill top over looking the AutoRoute; usually a big tripod with a kind of huge binocular set-up on top - but by the time you are close enough to see this, they've clocked you a few hundred meters beforehand....

A fave trick is to have a radar trap set-up in the "deceleration zone" before an AutoRoute toll bar - the bit where the signs say 90km / 70km / 50km.

My advice for what it's worth is stick to the speed limits. Unless you like gambling, have hundreds of Euros to pay in fines (they can escort you to a cash-point in a nearby town to force you to pay-up there and then!) and also like getting points on your licence as they will report you to the UK police who may also decide to add a few points...

In Spain the Auto-Route traps are also well signposted, often with flashing gantry signs warning you they are ahead in the next couple of km - but are pale grey boxes on the hard shoulder, like the French, but no black-yellow warning markings; they generally face away from on-coming traffic. You may face the Guardia Civil (don't mess with these guys!) or the local police in road-side traps or spot-checks. The Spanish police are very keen on folks driving without seatbelts on and having a dog unsecured in a car, especially the front - my father-in-law got done for both: kerrching!

[Dippy]

Tomtom on my iPhone declares that all speed camera info is disabled for France, or similar. Never checked if this is the case but I can believe it.

Triple check your aircon before leaving, we are having 35C in lisbon now and you could probably add up to 10 for southern Spain.

If you go to Andorra, switch your mobile off! Went skiing there in February and found to our cost that it is not part of the EU "max tariff" agreement - bill shock! Not sure why you'd go to Andorra, having been there. It is out of the way, there is no motorway to or from (in our case) which negates the cheaper fuel, and I was massively unimpressed with the "tax free" shopping. We went to supposedly the biggest shop (like a debenhams) and even my wife struggled to buy anything.

I think one of the shorter routes door to door, at least to lisbon, is via San Sebastián. Do NOT pass through here in the second half of August expecting to find a hotel room. In the last week they are sold out for a 100mile radius, I can tell you that having done it twice, thinking the first time was a fluke.

Do consider a day trip to Seville. We went a month ago, fantastic. For a day trip I strongly recommend a horse carriage ride, about 40eur for 40 mins (no bargaining, prices are fixed), expensive but a way to see some incredible buildings that you probably wouldn't see on foot. And then look at the Alcazar and its gardens. Tapas - mmmm....

Hope it goes well :)

[Big Kev]

Aye Dips min....we have all been trying to get him to go to the Lisbon Coast, Estoril, Cascais, but he will probably end up in Southern Portugal where all the Edinburgh folks go......and call each other "Ken" aw night.......and ask how much is it for a 5 Euro beer........

[webleymk3]

Tomtom on my iPhone declares that all speed camera info is disabled for France, or similar. Never checked if this is the case but I can believe it.

Triple check your aircon before leaving, we are having 35C in lisbon now and you could probably add up to 10 for southern Spain.

If you go to Andorra, switch your mobile off! Went skiing there in February and found to our cost that it is not part of the EU "max tariff" agreement - bill shock! Not sure why you'd go to Andorra, having been there. It is out of the way, there is no motorway to or from (in our case) which negates the cheaper fuel, and I was massively unimpressed with the "tax free" shopping. We went to supposedly the biggest shop (like a debenhams) and even my wife struggled to buy anything.

I think one of the shorter routes door to door, at least to lisbon, is via San Sebastián. Do NOT pass through here in the second half of August expecting to find a hotel room. In the last week they are sold out for a 100mile radius, I can tell you that having done it twice, thinking the first time was a fluke.

Do consider a day trip to Seville. We went a month ago, fantastic. For a day trip I strongly recommend a horse carriage ride, about 40eur for 40 mins (no bargaining, prices are fixed), expensive but a way to see some incredible buildings that you probably wouldn't see on foot. And then look at the Alcazar and its gardens. Tapas - mmmm....

Hope it goes well :)

Aye Dips min....we have all been trying to get him to go to the Lisbon Coast, Estoril, Cascais, but he will probably end up in Southern Portugal where all the Edinburgh folks go......and call each other "Ken" aw night.......and ask how much is it for a 5 Euro beer........

Kev... When the out-laws have a private villa in the south of Portugal, it make sense we go there!!! We are considering a run up the west coast on the return leg of the journey, although the plans are still in the planning stage..

Tomtom on my iPhone declares that all speed camera info is disabled for France, or similar. Never checked if this is the case but I can believe it.

Triple check your aircon before leaving, we are having 35C in lisbon now and you could probably add up to 10 for southern Spain.

If you go to Andorra, switch your mobile off! Went skiing there in February and found to our cost that it is not part of the EU "max tariff" agreement - bill shock! Not sure why you'd go to Andorra, having been there. It is out of the way, there is no motorway to or from (in our case) which negates the cheaper fuel, and I was massively unimpressed with the "tax free" shopping. We went to supposedly the biggest shop (like a debenhams) and even my wife struggled to buy anything.

I think one of the shorter routes door to door, at least to lisbon, is via San Sebastián. Do NOT pass through here in the second half of August expecting to find a hotel room. In the last week they are sold out for a 100mile radius, I can tell you that having done it twice, thinking the first time was a fluke.

Do consider a day trip to Seville. We went a month ago, fantastic. For a day trip I strongly recommend a horse carriage ride, about 40eur for 40 mins (no bargaining, prices are fixed), expensive but a way to see some incredible buildings that you probably wouldn't see on foot. And then look at the Alcazar and its gardens. Tapas - mmmm....

Hope it goes well :)

Thanks Mate. Our planned route down takes the Pyrenees National Park down to Zaragoza so we're missing out San Sebastian. I had wanted to go to Andorra purely because it is another country visited. There is nothing specific we want to see. If there is nothing to see then I think we'll give it a miss. Thanks.

Still looking at the GPS options. Is the Tom Tom on iPhone ok? The current version is being slated in the App store. The car goes in for a full service before we go and i'll get the A/C looked at although it seems to be running ok, but we're not exactly dealing with 35C at the moment.. I use it all the time, so there is no risk of the seals cracking up!

[Dippy]

I rarely use tomtom, and when I do I have nothing to compare it with. Why is it being slated, bad mapping? Or software glitches? My main criteria are user friendly interface and good coverage of Portugal. TT scores well on the first and seems ok on the second.

In central Seville it took me a mile down a bus lane in the city centre and kept telling me to turn left across a central reservation. But this was after I'd wantonly ignored its pleas to take me round the ring road (which i learned were completely justified) in order to see the city. It also told me to go straight on across town, ignoring signs for the motorway I wanted, to pick it up 20 mins later. But I think they were the only glitches in a week of driving, I would definitely use it again. The Spanish ring road junctions are scary, sometimes you exit into what looks like a breakdown alley to find that is indeed the exit, I'd miss them if it wasnt for tomtom and its 10m countdowns.

We know that if you don't move over for a PT driver they will get closer and closer to your car, eventually being 2m off your rear bumper at 90mph. I've had a couple that then pull in front of me and obstruct me for the next 10 mins. Spanish don't do that, but we did notice in Seville that going from the centre of a 4 lane roundabout straight out to the exit seems normal. Could have cost me a new front end, twice.

[Sooty torques]

Zaragoza is a lovely city and well worth a day or two to explore. We use Plymouth-Bilbao in summer (we have a place in Vinaros, just south of the Ebro delta on the Spanish east coast) and drive across (5 hours-ish), but like to stay in Zaragoza when we can. In winter we do the Chunnel and drive down thru France over 2 or 3 days - much depends on weather & snow over the passes south of Clermont Ferrand.

Only really scary thing happened to us was an attempted car-jacking on the free section of the AP-7 / E15 AutoRoute around Barcelona - 2 guys in a BMW (what else...) hurtling past us in 4th lane throwing rocks at our car and shouting at us to pull over. We didn't but car was badly dented and the wife scared sh*tless. Not nice. However, in over a decade of driving through Spain and much longer through France (with / without caravan) it's the only time any horror stories have happened to us.