2003 Avensis, Excessive White Smoke...

[BigMo82]

Thanks for your help guys. I had the O2 sensor replaced yesterday from a local mechanic. From the diagrams posted earlier in this thread if looking at the engine bank 2 sensor 2 is located on the left side (drivers side) and it is the right sensor.

After having it replaced I reset the EML and from what I could tell the smoke stopped. Although it wasn't as cold yesterday. Bought the car to work this morning and the EML has popped back up. This time it's the same code P0057 Heated O2 sensor bank 2 sensor 2 circuit low, and also a pending code P0156 O2 sensor circuit malfunction (bank 2 sensor 2).

I am now thinking maybe I have changed the wrong sensor? the replacement sensor is faulty? Or there is a more worrying problem somewhere.

Attached is a pic of the sensor I have replaced

[BigMo82]

Ok just checked all 4 sensors with an ohm meter and I had a resistance of between 12 - 14 on 3 of them and 0 on the one next to the sensor I got changed yesterday. So I am guessing that must be bank 2 sensor 2. Just confusing that its opposite to the diagram.

Mo

[t-spiritpete]

Save your money Mo and just put a sign in the back window saying ......

Red Indian driver, No Inidicators or Hand signals .... smoke signals only! :lol2:

Sorry mate couldn't resist that one,

Pete.

[BigMo82]

Lol that's ok mate, i must sound crazy going on about this damn smoke. if I'm honest I can live with the smoke and I know as the weather improves so will the condensation. But I would like to get the EML light sorted.

Mo

[cooper12000]

told ya to test em in the first place.... u still got the old one??? if so just swap em back

[BigMo82]

I know coop, I should have tested them first but didn't have a multimeter until I got to work. Can't return the new one to eurocarparts because its already been used so I guess I will have a spare.

I also posted this on the rav 4 forum and someone there has mentioned that the pre and post cat sensors have different parameters so there not compatible.

Mo

[cooper12000]

oh sorry i thought the one u had changed was the same poss as the dud one

[BigMo82]

What are the chances of this being related to a stuck open injector?

Mo

[Druid Boy]

Unlikely given the absence of a fault code to indicate anything - and there would be black smoke due to overfueling. Sounds to me as though you are chasing shadows here. Get the correct sensor changed and leave the car alone. Just try to relax and drive it.

[cooper12000]

dont think one thats stuck closed will cause ur issues either. i know when i was in a garage they used to put a long scredriver on the casing of the injector and put the handle to thier ear to see if one was ratteling so i guess if no noise was heard from one injector and u could hear somthing from the others it would indicate an issue but as stated i suddgest you get the sensor changed if ur sure its faulty and be done with it

coop

[BigMo82]

Thanks for the replies guys. Coop I was more thinking that it may be an injector stuck open as the fuel consumption isnt great. I am averaging about 22- 23 mpg.

I have got the car now so whatever needs to be done I just want to get things sorted so its out of the way. I also think the engine sounds like a diesel and would like to get a second opinion if its the timing chain. Could take it to Toyota but they will usually recommend the most expensive treatment first!

Mo

[cooper12000]

lots of things can rattle best thing to do is try work out where the rattle is coming from. how many miles has it done?

prob the reason u have poor fule consumption is u have a defunct o2 sensor its telling the ecu to cut the fule or put more in etc....can u take it to an independant garage that u trust and get them to give it the once over????

coop

[BigMo82]

Coop it's done 78,000 miles. I have got the replacement sensor and will get it fitted in the next few days.

I have my local mechanic who is usually good for small repairs but anything out of his boundaries he simply dismisses it as nothing to worry about.

Mo

[cooper12000]

well diagnosing a rattle shouldnt be out of his boundrys especialy if its a timing chain or injector but at 78 k i would be supprised if it was a timing chain

[BigMo82]

Thanks for the reply Coop. I also think its too early for the chain and think it could be a tensioner. What worries me is that when I had it serviced a few weeks ago the oil came out black like tar although according to the Toyota service history it came with it was serviced 1700 miles ago so the oil should have been pretty fresh.

The previous owner was a retired gent who was not going to question the dealers service department unless something went wrong so I think Toyota must have just got it in stamped the book cleaned the car and sent it straight back out with a reciept for £300 odd. This is also what makes me worry that although it has a full main dealer service history I have little faith in how well those services were actually carried out looking at the evidence I found with the oil change.

Going to try to get the sensor put in tomorrow so at least I hope that stops the smoke. And I am not getting carried away with the smoke, this morning the weather was about 9C and I could still see some smoke in my mirror all the way home during an hours journey especially when pulling away. But thank you for all those that are still contributing to this thread despite me now sounding like I have OCD!

Mo

[cooper12000]

i dont blame u for being worried.... we spend a lot of money on our cars then we have to insure and tax them. i was always worried about my car and had lots of niggley faults that i kept my local garage busy with (if i couldnt sort them myself) eventualy i broke down near leeds (i live in kent) and when the car went back into the garage they diagnosed hgf. luckly i got it sorted on the warrenty but still a major head ache. This is why i suggested taking it to a garage u trusted to get them to give it the once over to put ur mind at rest.

as for the rattely tentioner i thought they were designed to last longer than the service interval for the chain/belt. mind u if u do need a new tentioner i guess ya might as well get the chain done at the same time

coop

[BigMo82]

Im glad someone understands how i feel coop. The condition of the car is mint and everything inside works perfectly. I was planning on getting the clutch done and then install a dvd headunit and upgrade and soundproof the Speakers in the doors. Then the o2 sensor has gone off, there is white smoke and now the rattlng noise. The problem is finding a garage I trust.

I did pop over to tech one in sidcup a few days ago and spoke to Derek there who said the noise was an acceptable level for a car that's done nearly 80,000 however there was a guy parked next to me at work a few days ago with the exact same car and year with 130,000 on the clock and his engine was nice and quite.

Mo

[cooper12000]

how far from maidstone r u and how far r u prepaired to travel i can recomend a garage to u if its feasable for u to come here.

[BigMo82]

I can do Maidstone I have a few friends that way.

Mo

[cooper12000]

sent ya a pm with the details:)

coop

[BigMo82]

Thanks for the PM Coop, I will give them a call and see when there free to have a look.

Mo

[Konrad C]

Mo, I have been following this thread as well as trying to help. You must live not far from me as I live in Belvedere.

The smoke or steam should have disappeared yesterday with the warm weather we had.

The rattle is harder to pin down. You said that the oil that came out if the engine was totally black, even though the service was 1700 miles ago! If the theory is correct, then the car has not had the oil changed, yet the book stamped.

My brother owned my car before me. I was with him when he bought it and noted a few minor issues with the car. He had the faults fixed and the car was dealer serviced for the 2 years he had it.

When I took over the car, I found the same faults on the car plus some new issues - old faults anti roll bar drop link on rear suspension knocking against body, front suspension knock (worn balljoint), 4 different brands of tyres, tyres worn or had sidewall cracks.

New faults - noisey wipers that smeared windscreen and needed changing, and broken cd player.

I fixed all the faults myself.

Obviously the service tends to centre around oil and filter change, but if the owner accepts or ignores the issues, then the service history has no baring to the condition of the car.

The tech at Sidcup says the sound is normal for the car, yet you were near another car that did not rattle!

That rattle coming from the engine area is telling you that something is worn and needs attention, no matter the age and mileage of the car. My car is 5 years older than your and quiet. The last time I had a noise was when the crankshaft pulley seperated and shreadded the air-con and alternater belts.

I hope you find the source of the noise and update us.

Konrad

[BigMo82]

Thanks for the reply Konrad. If I'm honest I haven't had much sleep over the last few days with working nights and the kids on holidays. So surprisingly I haven't really kept an eye on the smoke although I'm sure it can't have been that obvious or I would have noticed it.

With regards to the rattle sound it's not unbearable or worryingly loud. If a diesel pulls up next to me suddenly I can't even hear my engine any more. It is however a ticking noise and that's what makes me want to get it checked.

It really annoys me that Toyota main dealers were charging a 70 plus year old man solly money for services and not actually doing the work the poor guy was paying for. There was no way that oil had 1700 miles worth of use. It looked more like 15,000 or even more. I have had my oil change done about 800 miles ago and the colour hasn't really changed at all yet which makes me wonder how long it would take to get to that state.

I will have to wait and see what the outcome will be but one things for sure I won't be spending any money at a Toyota dealership.

[cooper12000]

i found one of the staff at the dealership at sidcup extreemly rude to me. and would never take my car back there unless it was for warrenty work on stuff they did this time. I also noticed on the inspection sheet they gave me... the commented that the rear pads were 80% worn so one would assume from that the front pads r ok..... especialy as brake pads is ticked green on the checklist however i checked today and they r worn more than the backs. I can understand them having the front wheels off to carry out the work i can also understand them taking the back wheels off for thier report(drum up more business) but for the life of me i cant see how they figgured the fronts wernt as worn as the backs.

konrad how did the car even pass an mot with a worn ball joint and droplink etc??? all that stuff should of been picked up at mot.

coop

[BigMo82]

Coop this is exactly why people have stopped using main dealers as much unless its warranty related or the car is only a few years old.

It's partly the fact that the dealerships charge extortionate amounts but even more so because half the time they don't carry out the work they are billing for. If you happen to be lucky enough to catch them out they simply apologise otherwise you would be non the wiser until something goes wrong at which point they would blame it on another part failing and not the one they had replaced.

Mo