2003 Avensis, Excessive White Smoke...

[Konrad C]

Hi Coop,

The balljoint only made the noise on the roughest bump, then one day somebody fly tipped some rubbish that included building rubble. This was in a road going through the woods under a broken street lamp. It was dark and I had just looked at the instruments and looked back up. I swerved to avoid all but the biggest lump of concrete.

I had the MOT a couple of weeks later and they picked up the balljoint. I changed the balljoint and the noise that had coming from that area for a long time was gone. The previous MOT,s did not pick up the problem, but the fact the incident above aggravated the joint. Plus I took it to a different test centre, showing all MOT tests are not the same.

The drop link was touching because the anti roll bar at the rear shifted to one side. I fixed that by re-adjusting the stops so the bar stays in position.

My brother had the car serviced at Sidcup during his ownership. His MOT's were done by the council (not Bexley).

When I took over the car, I did my own service and correcting the faults when I found them.

The problem here is some faults are missed or not fixed at all.

[BigMo82]

Had the lower lambda sensor changed today. It was properly stuck and took the mechanic a good 30 minutes to get out. Driven the car about 25 miles and the engine management light hasn't come back on so that's at least 1 thing sorted. I drove the car at about 10pm tonight and noticed a little smoke for about a mile and then I couldn't spot anything in my mirror. It was about 12C so not exactly cold but I hope that's the end of it. Fingers crossed!

Mo

[Konrad C]

Good to hear Mo.

I just replied to to other guys on the forum who are going through everything to try and fix the cars.

Lets hope there are no more problems.

Konrad

[BigMo82]

Thanks for the reply Konrad. It smoked for about 30 minutes this morning and someone has advised me it could be the pcv valve. Seeing how they are not expensive that could be worth a shot.

Mo

[Konrad C]

Let us know what the result is Mo.

Konrad

[curriedb]

If there's no loss of coolant and no sign of the oil being contaminated by water then I'd suspect it's "old man syndrome" i.e.build up of water in the exhaust system due to lots of short runs without the cat ever getting chance to heat up enough and burn it off...

However, if it's persisting then have a compression check done on engine to satisfy yourself that the cylinder head isn't slightly warped or there's a tiny split in the head gasket ...

02 sensor heating circuit failure is a VERY common problem. The heater element is there to get your 02 sensor up to working temperature ASP (600 F). If you have a PRE CAT sensor heater failure your car is likely to run a LITTLE richer - in what's known as 'open loop' - using preset ECU fuel calibrations - but will run as normal once the 02 sensor gets up to temperature (without the aid of it's heater element) and switches to 'closed loop' mode...when it then uses 02 sensor data to fine-tune fuel input. Heating element failure is such a common problem that many MR2 enthusiasts place a resistor in their 02 circuitry - to 'fool' the car into switching straight into closed loop mode (saves paying out £60 for a new sensor!).

Having read this very lengthy thread I can see that you have a lot of concerns. But I believe as others have said they are likely to be unfounded...

A timing chain rattle; MIL lights coming on are what you'd expect from a car of the age and mileage you've acquired...

My CAN OBD11 (U480) scanner was one of the first things I purchased when I bought my MR2 Roadster (new) in 2003. I had my first 02 sensor heater failure just after the car was out of warranty! Now It's always in my glovebox - as I'm likely to see the MIL light come on at ANYTIME. Currently it comes on about once a fortnight. A quick check of fault codes has - so far in last seven years - told me it's no big deal!

However, you certainly shouldn't ignore a MIL light! ALWAYS check the code it throws up - to make sure it's nothing major!

[BigMo82]

Thank you for your reply. I also have the same code reader and funnily also store it in my glove box. Since having the 02 sensor replaced my fuel consumption has got slightly better and the mil light hasn't reappeared in the last 200 miles.

The smoke is still there for which I will try to clean the pcv valve. And then the throttle body to help with the rough idling. I am not exaggerating but the smoke is definitely beyond the norm.

Something else I have noticed is that when I press the clutch to change gears or put the car into neutral when coasting at around 30mph the rev counter immediately drops to around 800 - 1000rpm. If I leave it in gear and just lift my foot from the accelerator then the revs drop slowly. Is this normal?

Mo

[Druid Boy]

Yes perfectly normal. When you lift off the accelerator in gear the weight of the car drives the engine. The engine braking decelerates the car. When you depress the clutch the engine is disengaged from the gearbox (and hence the momentum of the car) and drives itself at idle speed 800 - 1000 rpm.

[Konrad C]

Mo, I think that is the way the car operates, unless there is something wrong with the clutch.

The clutch may be slow to dis-engage the drive to the gearbox.

It could be a hydraulic fault or the clutch spring itself. Pump the pedal to see if the hydraulics are okay.

For future reference on your car, try ToyoDIY.com and register, if you have not done so before.

There you will get pictures and part codes for your car. Also google PDFs for your car.

That is how I found out about my car plus gained info on other cars.

Konrad

[BigMo82]

As always thank you for the info mate.

Mo

[BigMo82]

I park my car at work in a underground car park so the temperature is usually around 18-20C. I work long shifts so sometimes the car is there for 13 hours but even then when I start it if I rev the engine I get water droplets from the exhaust. I know this is usually because of condensation but the car park isn't cold so should I still get condensation?

Sorry for all the weird questions guys, I'm just trying to learn what I can.

Mo

[Druid Boy]

_{Yes, completely normal. Its all to do with the relative temperatures of the exhaust pipe to the exhaust gases. Exhaust gases are !Removed! hot so the pipe seems cold hence the hot water vapour condenses on the relatively cool pipe and hey presto, drops of water. Also any exhaust gas left in the pipe from switching the engine off will cool down while the car is parked and deposit its water vapour in there. Seriously, its time to stop worrying.}

[Druid Boy]

Why was my last reply written so small? My computer has a mind of its own.....

[curriedb]

Re: exhaust condensation issue. Assume you've checked the basics i.e. that the thermostat is not stuck in the open position...leading to the engine block taking a lot longer to warm up than would be normal? The temp of the coolant is a VERY important factor in modern cards with complex emission control systems...

[BigMo82]

I haven't checked the thermostat any ideas on where it's located?

Mo

[Estimack]

Hi,

White smoke can be caused by brake fluid entering the intake manifold. You need to check the fluid level first and then the brake booster to see if there is any brake fluid in it - even a small amount. This can sometimes be done by taking out the vacuum line fitting and putting a bent piece of wire into the hole and see if it picks up any fluid when you take it out. Take care not to nick the bellows in the booster. The only way for brake fluid to get in there is from the master cylinder and would indicate a leak from the secondary cup.

Good luck.

[Konrad C]

I haven't checked the thermostat any ideas on where it's located?

Mo

Mo

I checked my Haynes manual and the thermostat is located on the right hand side of the cylinder block, below the alternator. The housing is the typical thermostat type semi dome elbow shape secured with two bolts. A hose will be attached to it. My manual is for the first generation Avensis, but the engines should be the same. Toyota changed the body but carried over the engines, then changed engines part way through the body run.

Konrad

[cooper12000]

does ur engine warm up normaly..... if the thermostat was stuck open it would run cold for longer. how far do u drive on a daily basis roughly and how long does it take for the engine to get up to temp.

as for the master brake cylinder does the fluid drop do the brakes feel spongy do they fade (feel hard when first press but ease off with continual pressure)

sorry to say it but ur best bet is to take it to the garage and get them to do a compleate check on it. that way at least u know everything is 100%

trying to diagnose a car with out being in front of it is hard...and forgive me but it appears that every suggestion that is made just adds to ur worries and u could end up changing things that arnt needed. i dont mean to be blunt with ya just trying to offer advice

coop

[Konrad C]

Mo,

I read your comment in another thread about a dealer and service history. The other poster who used the same dealer had found them out to be, in my words fraudulently cheating and using the word 'miscommunication' as a cover up.

This is a good reason to be concerned about the cars history. You want to have a reliable car.

I only know so much about cars, but will give the best advice when possible.

I was dubious about what was serviced on my car before I owned it. That is why I have done my own maintenance since I owned the car.

Konrad

[cooper12000]

konrad,

i usualy dont trust garages and definatly dont take the service log as gospel. First thing i do when i buy a car is check all the service items and brakes etc. Anything that needs replacing or doing i do or get the selling garage to do depending on the item. I have even been known to go and buy a tool to do a job that costs more than the job would if i took it to a garage, However having said that if there is somthing i am unsure about or not confident in doing myself I take it to the garage i recomended to Mo. I have used them lots and trust them they r a family concirn. on several occastions the boss has told me what needs doing and talked himself out of jobs that he could earn near on a grand out of. even to the point he has been on the phone giving help and advice when i get stuck for upwards of 20 mins.

i wasnt knocking anyone on the forum or even the forum its self its a good medium for sharing ideas and knowlage. and have used it myself even if just for a little reasurance. I was just trying to say that it is difficult to diagnose a car with out seeing it.

coop

[BigMo82]

Guys thanks for you help. I agree with coop that I really should take it to a garage to get a professional opinion after someone has actually checked the car. Problem is I work a lot and with 3 kids I don't get a whole load of time. I know some of you guys have a lot of experience so I just try to get what help I can to help me check the simpler issues. I really appreciate all your advice.

Mo

[Konrad C]

konrad,

i usualy dont trust garages and definatly dont take the service log as gospel. First thing i do when i buy a car is check all the service items and brakes etc. Anything that needs replacing or doing i do or get the selling garage to do depending on the item. I have even been known to go and buy a tool to do a job that costs more than the job would if i took it to a garage, However having said that if there is somthing i am unsure about or not confident in doing myself I take it to the garage i recomended to Mo. I have used them lots and trust them they r a family concirn. on several occastions the boss has told me what needs doing and talked himself out of jobs that he could earn near on a grand out of. even to the point he has been on the phone giving help and advice when i get stuck for upwards of 20 mins.

i wasnt knocking anyone on the forum or even the forum its self its a good medium for sharing ideas and knowlage. and have used it myself even if just for a little reasurance. I was just trying to say that it is difficult to diagnose a car with out seeing it.

coop

Very true Coop,

I read Parts King's comment in another thread about servicing and customer satisfaction, and it made me sit back and think.

He said that for every one bad service there are lots of happy customers. He said errors are made.

Parts King reminded me about the nature of the forum, meaning you tend to hear the complaints more than praises.

Coop your advice to take the car to a garage you trust, to get a proper opinion. What we do on this forum is give possible remedies based on what is described. I have an idea that Mo lives in South to South East London, so would gladly pass by help, but the video he posted was good enough.

Mo the weather is a lot warmer now. Your car should hardly produce any vapour once warmed up. Let us know by the weekend.

Konrad

[cooper12000]

mo, if u would rather not take it to a garage i am in maidstone on the sutton rd and willing to have a quick butchers for ya, however i am not a trained mechanic and im a lot better at older cars .

coop

[BigMo82]

Konrad and Coop your both top blokes for offering your time and assistance. I am going to book it into the garage Coop has recommended for next week. See what they suggest needs to be done. If nothing else I will at least get a compression test, and get the throttle body and idle control valve cleaned. Also I think it may be worth getting the fuel filter changed as I don't know if that's ever been done.

Mo

[cooper12000]

sorry konrad didnt realise u had offered help i miss read what u had said didnt mean to stand on ya toes sorry.

coop