Dirty Egr Stopped My Engine

[Dippy]

So I've been a member here for some time and have taken the traditional approach of "no news is good news" and have been silent for some years.

Well, I joined the 2AD Problems club it seems. I have a 2008 DCAT with 55 000 km. Yesterday on the motorway the dash lit up with errors and cut power to the throttle, but my wife (I wasn't there) succeeded in nursing it to the destination, with two little'uns in the back. Two hours later, she drove it home (7 miles) without incident, and this morning I drove it 5 miles to Mr T. Last night I read all 32 pages of Charley Farley's thread (phew!). I told them about the tech bulletin with the replacement 3/4 engine; he said "calm down sir, we'll read the codes and find out what the errors are."

This evening he phoned me "It's just a filthy dirty EGR valve, so we're ordering a replacement. That'll be 400 euros plus VAT please."

I told him about the oil consumption issue and the replacement policy, he insisted "but you're not burning oil, so that's irrelevant." I said the UK letter said "any related problems we would accept" but he insisted they're separate. He seems very reluctant to engage in that line. He says he knows nothing about the replacement engine issue. Said it's easier to discuss face to face rather than by phone, and rang off rather unsympathetically I felt. This group (if not this particular service centre) is the biggest Toyota dealer in Portugal.

Of course, nothing is simple. I bought the car in Madrid, Spain, but I live in Lisbon, Portugal (Toyota Portugal refused to sell me a car with a sunroof) so I'm a bit stuck for any "sale of goods" angle to the retailer or even the national importer. I don't have an immaculate service history, I forgot the last service, but the rest was fine. Water pump was replaced under warranty at a service when 2 yrs old. A year ago we'd thought it was burning oil (puffs of grey smoke out the back, low oil light came on a couple of times, I put a litre in) but didn't mark mileage to prove it; that's when we took it in to look at and they noted we'd forgot the previous service. When they serviced it last Oct they gave me a bottle of cleaner and told me to put it in the tank the next time I filled up - hmm. Just before I went to Andorra last month we asked them to give it a "service" to check antifreeze (and oil) levels. It's just been to Andorra and back, 2500km, and is still showing half-full on the dipstick, so doesn't seem to be burning oil recently. I looked at the coolant expansion overflow, there were some spots of ejection on the top of the tank but not much, nothing I'd think of as shocking.

So there's my jumbled thoughts - and right now, or up to tomorrow morning, I have to decide whether I want to pay EUR500 for a new EGR. It's our family car so every day without is inconvenient. Wife said she's scared to drive it right now, she was trembling all evening after it cut out. We have a two-seater also so not the end of the world but irritating.

Aside from any other advice you can all kindly offer - whether the guy has a point, EGR can soot up independently, or whether he's clearly evading - I have one specific question. Could you magicians with access to the TSB etc database find a copy of that Warranty Bulletin 553, or an equivalent, in Portuguese? I think the WB was written by Toyota UK, but I guess it was on the basis of a TME doc which would have been translated into all European languages. Even the ref number of the original TME doc would be handy to give to my service centre. I asked them to look for it but they didn't sound particularly interested.

Sorry if I should have put this on the end of the other thread, but I thought here would give me more chance for a quick answer...

Thanks for reading this far.

D

[sonixtorm]

Well, my initial thought would be that a dirty EGR valve needs a clean, not a new EGR valve! I believe the EGR was modified as the 2AD issues unfolded, but I am guessing a 2008 car will have included some of the revised parts.

The missing service may be an issue with the extended warranty. If I were you, I would run a quick oil consumption test yourself. Top up to the line, drive for 1000km and then top up to the line again, noting the amount used. At least you'll know whether you satisfy the basic requirement for a claim.

[anchorman]

You really need to write to Toyota in Portugal and give them all the details. In European law they can't treat you any different than us. However, they can ask you to the oil consumption test and if it doesn't meet the requirement it simply won't qualify for a new engine. You are not stuck with a €500 bill either. A new valve will cost you a lot less and it is very easy for you or a local garage to fit. You can of course try cleaning the valve as Sonixstorm has suggested.

All instructions are pinned.

[Dippy]

Thank you both for your replies. I'm a little calmer this morning! It seems then that I've misunderstood the wording of the warranty advice letter - so oil consumption is compulsory for a claim, not just the primary reason. In that case, considering I've recently done 2500km and gone from full (I didn't check) to halfway down the dipstick, it sounds like there is not enough consumption to qualify.

Considering I currently have a reputation of spending all my hours in the office and not lifting a finger at home, I think I'll cough up rather than fit it myself. I don't know reputable mechanics round here. There's an ulterior motive also, that they log the repair and they do it, so if there is such a claim in future it might improve my chances ("reasonable service history"). Tenuous but I'll go with it.

I'll watch all factors more carefully from now on.

Thanks again for the objective view :)

[sonixtorm]

Others may have a more definitive view of the position, but I believe that oil consumption or a blown head gasket are the only reasons a warranty claim will fly (any form of carbon clogging will support it and may influence the parts renewed under the warranty).

If you are going to go ahead with the EGR change, why not just ask them to run the consumption test? In the UK, even mentioning the extended warranty appears to prompt dealers to offer you to run a test.

[Big Kev]

You really need to write to Toyota in Portugal and give them all the details. In European law they can't treat you any different than us. However, they can ask you to the oil consumption test and if it doesn't meet the requirement it simply won't qualify for a new engine. You are not stuck with a €500 bill either. A new valve will cost you a lot less and it is very easy for you or a local garage to fit. You can of course try cleaning the valve as Sonixstorm has suggested.

All instructions are pinned.

Don min.....for the oil to go "halfway down the dipstick" in 2500km, actually how much oil has disappeared approx........?

Sounds like quite a lot.....

[Dippy]

Sonic, it's all been rather informal or casual up to now. The last time I complained about oil consumption, I was told 'well if you want, we'll top it up, you drive 1000km, and then we'll see if it's used more than normal.' I felt it was just a sensible offer to placate a nervous customer, there was no sense of urgency, I wasn't told 'sir, some of these cars develop a serious problem and we'd like to see if yours might be one'. Otherwise I'd have paid more attention!

I authorised the repair, 450eur all in and I can get the vat off that. Some we win, some we lose I guess.

[anchorman]

Well it doesn't quite meet but you might be able to negotiate.