New D4D Engine Being Fitted - Advice On Egr

[jabalczar]

I took my 2007 2.2 D4D to the dealers today due to the engine management light coming on. They phoned me back two hours later and said they are going to give me a complete new engine under the extended warranty.

My question is (because I forgot to ask the dealer):

Is the EGR valve part of the engine? Will they fit a new EGR valve when they put the new engine in?

I pick it up on Friday.

Thanks.

[+robster+]

its a bolt on to the engine

dont know if they fit one as a matter of course on thier extended warranty

they may just clean it with the manifold if it is servicable?

the egr is the root cause to why the engine fails due to carbon scoring and hg failures is it not?

[Druid Boy]

Ring your dealer and discuss your concerns with them. They are best placed to help you - and they want to help you. They need you to be happy with what they do otherwise their reputation will suffer. Don't worry about them cutting corners or ripping you off - it is not in their interests to do so. This fault is one that Toyota really work hard to rectify. GIve them a call.

[Devon Aygo]

its a bolt on to the engine

dont know if they fit one as a matter of course on thier extended warranty

they may just clean it with the manifold if it is servicable?

the egr is the root cause to why the engine fails due to carbon scoring and hg failures is it not?

The root cause of AD engine failure is either:

Piston ring issues causing excessive oil consumption, creating excessive soot

Head gasket failure, causing poor combustion, creating excessive soot

Injector failure, causing poor combustion & excessive soot ( rare )

or again pretty rare DPNR failure causing soot to build up

The EGR rarely fails but its clogging is an indicator of the above conditions, when a recon engine is fitted the operation of the EGR , DPNR & injectors are all checked and they are replaced along with the engine if required otherwise they are cleaned and reused.

Devon

[jabalczar]

Thank you for the replies.

Re: Devon

They've told me they will be fitting new injectors too as mine are outside of normal tolerances. They are also going to put a new water pump in.

I'll check on the EGR tomorrow. But so far the dealer has been very very helpful.

And Toyota have offered me a hire car too seeing as the garage is out of courtesy cars. V. impressive customer service.

[Seggy]

Dear Jabalczar,

Intrested in your posts, I have just had a replacement engine in my Verso, but have been told that the car needs new injectors as these are out of tolerance. However my Toyota dealer says that replacement of the injectors is outside the terms of the goodwill warranty and I will be faced with paying a big bill for these. !

[jabalczar]

It's probably because I have a Toyota Approved Used Warranty on my car. The engine and EGR valve was replaced under the goodwill warranty, the injectors were probably replaced under the Approved Warranty. The water pump was leaking and was definitely replaced under the Approved Used Warranty.

However, I notice that some dealers are more lenient than others, and some seem to know how to play the system. I would consider speaking with another dealership -- preferably one in a big city as they seem to know how to play the game better and seem to look for warranty work.

Toyota customer service has been excellent, and I like my Toyota, but I'm not sure I'd buy a Toyota diesel again, probably stick with Japanese petrol engines, esp. as the new 1.8 Avensis has the same fuel consumption as my 2.2 D4D.

[Seggy]

Dear Jabalzcar, Thanks for that , I have been asking a few questions on the RAV forum as well. Appreciate your response. I'm just not sure how I stand , however I did take a 3 year service plan when I bought the car at 17,000 miles, back in 2010 and excessive readouts at MOT must, or should have sounded alarm bells with Mr T. I certainly got caught out. There doesn't seem to be a clear answer to what is and what is not included. I will have one more try ,...as injector replacement is big bucks. I think you are also correct in your assesment of ' playing the system '.

Like you I have been put off diesels after being a big fan for a long time. Petrol next time. But on a parting note Mr T has been better than most all other manufacturers in my experience. Thanks again.

[t-spiritpete]

Dear Jabalczar,

Intrested in your posts, I have just had a replacement engine in my Verso, but have been told that the car needs new injectors as these are out of tolerance. However my Toyota dealer says that replacement of the injectors is outside the terms of the goodwill warranty and I will be faced with paying a big bill for these. !

According to Devon Aygo who is normally correct the injectors could have been the cause of the engine failure so how can they now say you have to pay for new ones, it doesn't make sense to me .... !

Pete.

[Devon Aygo]

Dear Jabalczar,

Intrested in your posts, I have just had a replacement engine in my Verso, but have been told that the car needs new injectors as these are out of tolerance. However my Toyota dealer says that replacement of the injectors is outside the terms of the goodwill warranty and I will be faced with paying a big bill for these. !

According to Devon Aygo who is normally correct the injectors could have been the cause of the engine failure so how can they now say you have to pay for new ones, it doesn't make sense to me .... !

Pete.

Close but the other way around, there is no warranty extension on injectors, they can only be replaced along with a faulty engine ( h/gasket or oil consumption ) if they are shown at the time to be out of specification as under this situation Toyota will accept that poor combustion causing carbon build up is the cause of the injector failure.

Jabalczar where your injectors diagnosed when the engine was replaced?

[t-spiritpete]

Dear Jabalczar,

Intrested in your posts, I have just had a replacement engine in my Verso, but have been told that the car needs new injectors as these are out of tolerance. However my Toyota dealer says that replacement of the injectors is outside the terms of the goodwill warranty and I will be faced with paying a big bill for these. !

According to Devon Aygo who is normally correct the injectors could have been the cause of the engine failure so how can they now say you have to pay for new ones, it doesn't make sense to me .... !

Pete.

Close but the other way around, there is no warranty extension on injectors, they can only be replaced along with a faulty engine ( h/gasket or oil consumption ) if they are shown at the time to be out of specification as under this situation Toyota will accept that poor combustion causing carbon build up is the cause of the injector failure.

Jabalczar where your injectors diagnosed when the engine was replaced?

I understood that the new engine had been fitted very recently, if the injectors were checked at that time then it seems very strange that they have failed so quickly, my money says they were faulty before the new engine was fitted ... just my humble opinion.

Pete.

[jabalczar]

Yes, my injectors were diagnosed as being out of tolerance at the time of the engine failure. I took it in due to an engine management light.

However, two months prior the tolerances of the injectors were checked during the winter check up at the dealers due to noise at 2500rpm. At that point they were just within normal tolerance.

[Seggy]

I had kept a log for the two weeks prior to the car going in for the engine replacement describing the symptoms I was experiencing. One symptom and the one that persists is the blue smoke, which is intermittent. The car starts fine from cold and runs fine, but if i leave it several hours after a 12 mile run then at start up the idle is app 700 / 750 rpm and blue smoke for about 30 seconds and then it usually runs fine again. The engine is new, the injectors as I understand are out of the old engine. In my opinion they were faulty prior to the engine change so must assume they were not checked prior to engine replacement !. Also in my opinion the issues I had with Carbon clogging, oil consumption etc must have damaged the injectors. I spoke with the mot mechanic this morning who failed the car on emissions back in January , his opinion was also that the injectors would have been damaged and thought they would be replaced as a matter of course. The only fault showing with the car on the Toyota analysis are 2 injectors being above the correct value figure. I presume all 4 will need replacing at app £400 per injector , problem is if the diagnosis doesn't cure the problem !

[t-spiritpete]

Seggy

Have you pressed them vey hard over this and told them you will contact toyota GB if they don't sort it.

Jabalczar

Did you get injectors fitted FOC with your new engine?

Pete.

[jabalczar]

Yes, my injectors were replaced free of charge.

My impression of the dealers was that they were going to replace as much as they could, without too many 'accurate' checks as it was all warranty work billed to Toyota. Interestingly, I went to one dealers and my injectors were spot on. A few days later, another dealer's (the one who did the engine replacement) found them to be completely over the allowed tolerances, so replaced them with the engine free of charge.

[Seggy]

No I haven't pressed for this yet as I needed to gather as much information as possible first. I was advised to run the car for a few weeks and log the performance and any other issues during this period. I dont expect things to improve. I have contacted several diesel injector specialists who will for app £20 per injector test each one. The injector analysis was the only item to come up as a possible fault on the Toyota diagnostics.Will see how it goes, I do however appreciate your comments. Cheers.

[Devon Aygo]

Seggy where your injectors diagnosed when the engine was replaced or later on after the car had been returned from having the recon engine fitted?

[Seggy]

The engine was replaced and I still had some issues so I took the car back , it was then that the possible fault was identified with the injectors.Two of the injectors had readings above 3, and the other two around 1.

So the fault with the injectors was diagnosed after the new engine was fitted. Cheers