Slipping Clutch

[redlew]

Morning all

The car, 2005 manual diesel XTR, was serviced on Tuesday this week by Mr T and there were no problems. Yesterday when accelerating the revs increased but the speed didn't. This is happening in all gears and I'm guessing that the clutch is slipping.

So

• Can clutch slip suddenly happen ratther than building up over time or is it more likely that an adjuster has snapped or something else has worked loose/broken
• If the clutch does need replacing, does the DMF need doing at the same time? There has been no sign of rough running
• What is best punt at the cost of the whole job (parts labour, Vat) at (a) Mr T and (b) a competent indie?

The car has done 87K and about 1k of that has been towing.

Thanks all

[Big Kev]

Similar situation as advised by Charlie re. doing the clutch at engine change time.....no brainer. At your mileage you may be one of the many luckeez that didn't have DMF failure. At your mileage and with labour charges as they are, if your clutch IS gubbed, get good advice on doing the rather expensive DMF at same time (or SMF as some have done very successfully....?).

Would hate to see you repost in 3 months re. gubbered flywheel.......

Also bear in mind my expertise is in car washing.....LOL

Big Kev

[4.1GX]

We managed to get the quote down to £1100 including DMF from a good Indy. Toyota wanted over £2k!!

What worries me is that ours wasn't slipping before it went in for a service either!? I thought these clutches were non adjustable so wonder what they did......

[anchorman]

They are none adjustable but they must have a little free play at the top of the pedal or they will slip.

[CharlieFarlie]

Chances are your clutch would have started slipping if it had not gone in for service and its just an unfortunate coincidence ..

Short if thrashing the car and riding the clutch there is nothing they could have done to bring about the clutches demise ...

[redlew]

Follow up. Mr T wanted £1700, Indie £1400 and Indie 2 who we usually wanted £1150.

Job done by Indie 2 using Lux parts. Running much smoother so I guess the DMF was showing signs of wear though not broken in the way that others have experienced.

Next item on agenda is "osf drop link knocking." Ah the joys of cars getting old.

[Tech01]

A DMF cannot "slip" in itself. Run rough, vibrate, jangle, cause clutch snatch (poor clutch control) - yes. But a DMF that is on its way out will cause accelerated wear of the clutch plate, or even cause it to break up altogether.

By all means fit a replacement DMF, but if this gives up after a period, don't fit another - go SMF. They work.

Chris

[redlew]

A DMF cannot "slip" in itself. Run rough, vibrate, jangle, cause clutch snatch (poor clutch control) - yes. But a DMF that is on its way out will cause accelerated wear of the clutch plate, or even cause it to break up altogether.

By all means fit a replacement DMF, but if this gives up after a period, don't fit another - go SMF. They work.

Chris

Just to be clear , the clutch was slipping as confirmed (not that any was really needed by the garage)

The DMF was changed in line with recommendations above , ie if you don't it will give up soon afterwards and you'll have another load of labour to pay for.

So I've now got a new clutch and a new DMF -and the car is running smoother which I put down to the brand new DMF.

Very interesting the debate about DMF v SMF -there is a long thread on it somewhere though for me the clincher is that Toyota wouldn't fit DMF if they thought that cheaper SMFs would do.

[Tech01]

I don't think that anyone in the industry foresaw the complexities and service-life implications of DMFs. Almost every major vehicle manufacturer has been caught out by their frequent failures.

[Davrav]

I don't think that anyone in the industry foresaw the complexities and service-life implications of DMFs. Almost every major vehicle manufacturer has been caught out by their frequent failures.

Or, if they did, they got shouted down............

[anchorman]

They seem to have got a grip of it on the 4.3s thankfully.

[Crofty_here]

I'm about to have this done on my Rav. Toyota quote £2k, specialist £1.5k and my very trusted local garage £1.2k or £1k for a smf. I'm going for the single mass flywheel conversion as once its done I can forget about it.

[Tech01]

Hi Chris/Crofty,

£1k sounds not an unreasonable garage price for SMF fitting. There's a full day's work involved in getting to and replacing a RAV clutch.

The 4-part kits (flywheel + 3 part clutch) are around £500. Try and go for a known and trusted make, eg Blueprint or Borg+Beck.

Do let us know how you get on.

[Crofty_here]

Had a call from the garage this morning, they couldn't find the locking wheel nut key. So a trip to the dealer ensued and after relieving me of £21 I had a new key, 'off the shelf.'

[Tech01]

Not a good start. Hopefully, things will get more positive from here on. Don't forget to let the workshop have a couple of coins for the phone, in case they need to ring you again.

Chris

[Crofty_here]

Got the car back today, a day late as there was a problem with the delivery of the clutch kit. Kit supplied was a Valeo, most of the reports I've seen / heard are that its a decent make. But what a difference it has made to the car. Biting point low on the clutch pedal, no resistance / spongeyness when pressed. No clattering vibration. To be honest if the only reason manufacturers fit DMF's is to reduce vibration then they are wasting their time and our money because there is no vibration whatsoever from my SMF kit.

Total cost £1049. Clutch 4 piece kit was £400. Labour £450. Gear oil and Mr Osbourne's share made up the rest.

But I am a very happy bunny

Chris.

[Tech01]

Good, good, good! Interesting that you've been fitted with a Valeo. Yes, a renowned and trusted make. When I fitted my SMF three years ago, I looked at Valeo, but they offered SMFs for almost every make of vehicle except Toyota. Odd!? A phone call to Valeo UK revealed (more or less) that the reason Valeo didn't offer a Toyota aftermarket SMF conversion was "commercial, rather than technical". From that, I guessed that Valeo might be supplying Toyota with OEM clutches...maybe...and therefore there was an applecart not to be upset. Looks as if things might have changed.

Anyway, a good result, at a good price. I did say that SMF would transform the way the vehicle drove, didn't I ?

Brill. Result. Done. Sorted. Well done!

Chris

[Big Kev]

Good, good, good! Interesting that you've been fitted with a Valeo. Yes, a renowned and trusted make. When I fitted my SMF three years ago, I looked at Valeo, but they offered SMFs for almost every make of vehicle except Toyota. Odd!? A phone call to Valeo UK revealed (more or less) that the reason Valeo didn't offer a Toyota aftermarket SMF conversion was "commercial, rather than technical". From that, I guessed that Valeo might be supplying Toyota with OEM clutches...maybe...and therefore there was an applecart not to be upset. Looks as if things might have changed.

Anyway, a good result, at a good price. I did say that SMF would transform the way the vehicle drove, didn't I ?

Brill. Result. Done. Sorted. Well done!

Chris

What a terrible near insinuation, Chris, that Toyota would enter into anyhing bordering on a clandestine arrangement with such as Valeo not to supply a product to Giusseppi Publico (Italian for Joe Public.......).

Same as there was absolutely no commercial reason or proof that they tied up on them Runflats with Bridgestone........

Must dash....trying to catch that flying pig oot there.....lol.

Big Kev

[Crofty_here]

Err, I've got Bridgestones fitted, what's the problem with runflats and which tyre spec is affected?

Chris.

[Big Kev]

Err, I've got Bridgestones fitted, what's the problem with runflats and which tyre spec is affected?

Chris.

You don't have runflats, so relax......nothing wrong with them as long as your pockets are same as your trouser length......