2.0 Vvti Timing Chain Rattle

[antony17]

Just took my 2004 Avensis T Spirit in to the main dealer for a service and to identify a rattle and they inform me that its the timing chain. Engine has dome 127,000 miles but as I have no other problems I thought i would have it fixed. They quoted me £1000 to replace!! Wow and then said it wasnt worth it and got a saleman to call me to offer me 750.00 to part ex against any car, Cheeky B's. Anyway I want to fix the problem is it a possible DIY task I have basic mechanical knowledge or do any members know anywhere around Luton or North London that could do the work at a reasonable price?

[BigMo82]

I don't think it's an easy task as I believe the head has to come off. The chain kit isn't much more then a belt kit but obviously the labour charges are the expensive part. Is it really noisy?

Mo

[BigMo82]

£750 is a joke considering Toyota Bromley are trying to sell a 04 plate T-spirit for £6000! Admittedly it has under 40,000 on the clock but that price is still ridiculous.

Mo

[antony17]

Just took my 2004 Avensis T Spirit in to the main dealer for a service and to identify a rattle and they inform me that its the timing chain. Engine has dome 127,000 miles but as I have no other problems I thought i would have it fixed. They quoted me £1000 to replace!! Wow and then said it wasnt worth it and got a saleman to call me to offer me 750.00 to part ex against any car, Cheeky B's. Anyway I want to fix the problem is it a possible DIY task I have basic mechanical knowledge or do any members know anywhere around Luton or North London that could do the work at a reasonable price?

Had a mate of mine look yesterday and looked on the internet and it could be the cam gear Because it only rattles on start up. Has anyone come across this before?/

[Druid Boy]

I wouldn't recommend a DIY fix if you only have basic mechanical knowledge. Hopefully there is an independent specialist nearby who can advise. If its just noisy it may not need replacing.

[rogersp]

Not too familiar with this engine but it may just be the automatic chain tensioner which is worn so replacing the same may just do the trick for the short term.

That said, lack of regular oil changes can punish the cam chain itself from my experience.

Go visit an independent and trusted mechanic, he will advise you and not try to sell you another car.

Good Luck

[fastbob72]

I'm not familiar with which engines in the t-sprint model so if I'm completely off the mark with this suggestion then I appologise in advance.

A rattling or tapping sound on start up that goes away fairly quickly ??

My initial thought would be,does it have hydraulic tappets ??

If it does then they're being starved of oil on initial start up causing the rattling but once oil pressure is up and they are sufficiently lubricated they quieten down.

On a 100,000 + mile engine rattley tappets isn't unexpected and normally doesn't indicate a serious problem,even if you have solid rather than hydraulic tappets they may still rattle until properly lubricated although it usually indicates a greater degree of wear if you have rattling solid tappets.

With hydraulic tappets they need sufficient pressure to operate so that initial lack means they're not operating as they should straight away which causes the rattle.With solids the rattle is due to wear and slack in the valvetrain.

Either way a good engine flush and oil/filter change with top quality oil should show an improvement.

********************************

As for the timing chain,the only real thing that would make it rattle would be if it had began to stretch or if the tensioner was going.In either case there would be more than a rattle at start up that disappears,either way it's a potentially serious situation though it doesn't sound applicable in your case from what you describe.

£750 may well be par for the course considering what most dealerships/garages charge an hour for labour these days but still it seems steep.

I wouldn't give a second thought to changing a timing chain but I wouldn't recommend doing it DIY unless you are confident and compotent in your mechanical abilities as the consequences of getting it wrong could be disasterous depending on the piston/valve clearance of your type of engine but if your methodical,careful,have the tools,time and a good understanding of engines,also take your time then it isn't beyond doing it yourself.

I'll do it for you for £250 :)

[fastbob72]

Oh well,just read the title ~ 2.0 vvti timing chain rattle.lol.

In that case you have solid tappets not hydraulics,in which case any valve rattle would tend to indicate wear.

Although,when was the last time you valve clearences were checked,if they are out or any of your followers/shims have worn then that would create a rattling sound that may be quietened down once your oil pressure is up and they're properly lubricated.

Is the rattling definitely coming from the area of the timing chain.i.e behind,around the cover or just from around the top or front of the engine ??

Do you believe it's from the chain or are you basing that on what you've been told ??

Have you ruled out it coming from water pump/altenator/air con compressor bearings,the drive belt or the tensioner ??

As they're all down around that same area and it can be difficult to determine where a particular noise is coming from at times.

Anyway,on the VVT-i engine the valve clearances should be checked when the engines cold using a feeler gauge.

Inlet ~ 0.19 to 0.29 mm

Exhst ~ 0.30 to 0.40 mm

If you find the clearances are greater than above then that would be the most probable cause of rattle.

Set the engine,by using a ratchet/socket or spanner on the crank pulley,so No.1 cylinder (timing chain end) is at TDC on the compression stroke (when the cam lobes on both cams are pointing away from the followers,if they're not you'll need to turn the crank 360 degrees).

Measure the inlet clearances on cylinder 1 and 2,exhaust clearances on cylinder 1 and 3,make note of each clearance.

Turn the engine 360 degrees or one revolution and measure 3 and 4 inlet,2 and 4 exhaust.

Almost as important as the measurement and whether they're within the tolerances I noted above is whether they're even across all 4 cylinders.

If they do need adjusting that requires working out the size of follower you need to fit but also removing the cams.

If you had to it may well be worth fitting a new chain,dampener and tensioner at the same time :)

Personally,i much prefer timing belts even though i've never experience timing chain problems with any car I've had :)

[antony17]

I'm not familiar with which engines in the t-sprint model so if I'm completely off the mark with this suggestion then I appologise in advance.

A rattling or tapping sound on start up that goes away fairly quickly ??

My initial thought would be,does it have hydraulic tappets ??

If it does then they're being starved of oil on initial start up causing the rattling but once oil pressure is up and they are sufficiently lubricated they quieten down.

On a 100,000 + mile engine rattley tappets isn't unexpected and normally doesn't indicate a serious problem,even if you have solid rather than hydraulic tappets they may still rattle until properly lubricated although it usually indicates a greater degree of wear if you have rattling solid tappets.

With hydraulic tappets they need sufficient pressure to operate so that initial lack means they're not operating as they should straight away which causes the rattle.With solids the rattle is due to wear and slack in the valvetrain.

Either way a good engine flush and oil/filter change with top quality oil should show an improvement.

********************************

As for the timing chain,the only real thing that would make it rattle would be if it had began to stretch or if the tensioner was going.In either case there would be more than a rattle at start up that disappears,either way it's a potentially serious situation though it doesn't sound applicable in your case from what you describe.

£750 may well be par for the course considering what most dealerships/garages charge an hour for labour these days but still it seems steep.

I wouldn't give a second thought to changing a timing chain but I wouldn't recommend doing it DIY unless you are confident and compotent in your mechanical abilities as the consequences of getting it wrong could be disasterous depending on the piston/valve clearance of your type of engine but if your methodical,careful,have the tools,time and a good understanding of engines,also take your time then it isn't beyond doing it yourself.

I'll do it for you for £250 :)

Thats exactly what I need is someone who knows what they are doing to fix it for me but I fear you are too far away as I am in Hertfordshire or back in the midlands for all of next week. Anybody help??

[antony17]

Not too familiar with this engine but it may just be the automatic chain tensioner which is worn so replacing the same may just do the trick for the short term.

That said, lack of regular oil changes can punish the cam chain itself from my experience.

Go visit an independent and trusted mechanic, he will advise you and not try to sell you another car.

Good Luck

Where can I find a independent and trusted mechanic? I live in Hertfordshire and work in Warks/Leics/Staffs borders any ideas anyone?

[antony17]

Just took my 2004 Avensis T Spirit in to the main dealer for a service and to identify a rattle and they inform me that its the timing chain. Engine has dome 127,000 miles but as I have no other problems I thought i would have it fixed. They quoted me £1000 to replace!! Wow and then said it wasnt worth it and got a saleman to call me to offer me 750.00 to part ex against any car, Cheeky B's. Anyway I want to fix the problem is it a possible DIY task I have basic mechanical knowledge or do any members know anywhere around Luton or North London that could do the work at a reasonable price?

[Racer555uk2003]

Just got my 2.0VVT Spirit out of Dingles at Norwich and a new camchain, sprockets, gaskets, seals, oil, filters and a few other bits - came to £640.00 and the car is like new to drive again.

PS the job was done without removing the engine.

The Menu price for a cam chain change including all the bits is £640.00 - this is a Toyota Menu price.

T