My Thoughts About The Iq Design - By Bob Kneale

[bobkneale]

The IQ is quite a new and "groundbreaking" design that is quite a "bold step" taken by Toyota to create something different and very appealing to a "specific market segment" of todays motoring buyers however this challenge in itself does come with some risk if not approached very carefully and carried out in a specific manner.

Perhaps some of the problems in my view with the Design of the IQ car is as follows:

Very lightweight materials have been used that can be more suspetable to wear / breakage and possibly early failure.

Small and very compact design of some parts that break some of the standard traditional more proven engineering design trends in order to reduce size of many parts.

Cheaper materials are perhaps sometimes used to reduce manufacturing costs to a minimum.

All new design concepts will always be at a slightly higher risk of problems in a mass produced manufacturing environment.

Possibly a lack of enough "testing to failure" after the new design has been created, in order to reveal and show up any possible weakness up front, and then implement further design modifications and changes to create quite close to zero defect that matches more traditional / proven design of some parts and thus make the IQ comparable to other car reliability standards that we have come to expect from a modern motor car.

The above issues could (if it is the case ?) lead to the customers (that's us) becoming the test bed for design changes and improvements over time, and suffering some problems that could have been avoided if a different and much greater focussed testing to failure approach had been taken by Toyota.

As Toyota now offer a 5 year warranty as a selling point on new IQ's we (as end customers) are "lead to believe" that reliability will be very good, this is not always the case.

Some manufacturers are now offering 7 year warranties !

Toyota have perhaps been more "up front" regarding recalls and this is of course a "double edged sword" that can put some people off Toyota, however I believe that "up front" honesty will win over the customer rather than hiding the problem, this has been proven to be the case as I understand that Toyota sales have not suffered because of it.

The above is my view at the moment after owning a second hand IQ now for 5 months and reading this forum almost every day, plus some time taken to research on the internet the IQ design and its new concepts.

All comments regarding my above views are welcomed.

Positive Regards,

Bob.

[FROSTYBALLS]

In reality I think very few designs are actually 'all new'. Carry over of engines being one example. Motoring history has a few examples where manufacturers have been caught out by lack of testing, misjudgements, etc of cars with a high level of new design - two examples being the Hillman Imp and NSU Ro80,

As far as I'm aware, in Europe the Toyota 5 year warranty is peculiar to the UK - introduced by Toyota GB to counter the effects of the accelerator pedal recall. Germany, France, Eire, etc retain the 3 year warranty.

[sweet-dentist]

In Holland we have standard a 3 years warranty on the iQ... but one can buy an extra 2 years.. so five years in total..

Same with the Smart...

Compared with the Smart... that came on the market somewhere in the year 1998 or so... this car also had a lot of flows... To my knowledge Mercedes has done a great job in fixing the things...in the beginning years....to a certain point...

Exhaust / front springs / ABS rings / leakage / turn-signal light-handle / and more.

So my Smart (which is a model 450 from 2001) has done about 115.000 kilometers... it is known that the exhaust-thing-with-catalyst-and-turbo can break or show cracks at the age of about 85.000 kilometers...

This is a wrongly designed thing... but if it breaks now... I will have no warranty on it.

During the last checkup my front-springs have been replaced (one was broken).. and also the ball-bearings of the front wheels (worn down)...

But during the long time the Smart is on the market, more and more things show up.... as in any brand of car, that is for a longer time on the market and does not really change in model.

The iQ is now on the market for about 4 years (from 2009) ... 2007 concept / selling in Japan in 2008 and in Europe in 2009 ... See: http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_iQ

Mine is just over 3 years old now and I have the old model recirculation-valve (luckily no problems with it) ... No other problems with the car.

But I did a lot of work getting all the metal parts under the car put in Zink-spray and in Unterbodenschutz-bitumen... Because of the quick rusting...

[tarquin]

I had a Peugeot 406 estate diesel it had done 257,000 when i sold it only had 1 new clutch and a fuel pump obviously all the service parts over the years but. No rust!! A lovely car to drive. 64mpg amazing for a S reg. i only sold it because i have the iQ. There are some cars where the manufacturer gets it right. Where i worked, we had 4 fleet cars. 2 ford mondeo's and 2 vauxhall Astra's all bought new at the same time same. One. Of the mondeo's and one of the Astra's were complete '"dogs" not just starting etc but the handling was worlds apart from the "good ones" the Astra drunk oil, as much as a pint and a half every week and when taken in to vauxhalls, their answer was " its not a blue print engine sir, thats the tolerance of the build. " so i said " so if i bought 2 cars from you today, the chances are one would drink oil and the other would be fine? " "yes " he said. " but the two that drive completely differently" "thats the tolerance sir" that would suggest, That each car you buy will be unique and different to any other. Random build quality and alignment

David

[bobkneale]

Hi,

One of the intresting things from the above posts is that many people can have the same car and have very different experiences with them from very good and 100% relaibility over very high miliages to very bad.

To get a good feel of actual reliability a suitable "sample size" needs to be taken for correct comparision. This enables statistitical analysis to give more accurate results.

Most people will have heard the comment "this car was assembled on a friday night" when all the workers were not at their best that's why its giving me lots of problems !

Also comparisions need to take into account the type of use and potential abuse that some vechiles get including the servicing issue.

This can enable fairer and more accurate comparisions rather than just "one off" examples.

It seems to me that car manufacturers either don't gather this data or if they do don't publish it, so we as the end customer are left to guess and search for the correct information to enable us to try and make a good purchasing decision.

Then we spend hours trawling the internet or forums or getting others to reccomend a paticular make and model often based upon in suffecient data.

We also often stick with a make after we have had a good experience, in fear of getting caught out with a un relaiable car that we believe will give us lots of problems.

[FROSTYBALLS]

I remember when manufacturers like Toyota and Mazda sent out customer questionnaires after new cars were purchased and when any servicing was undertaken by the dealer network. I think this had a three-fold effect - customers felt that the manufacturer were interested in customer opinion of their cars, the manufacturer gained information on how well or otherwise the cars and the dealer network were performing, and (certainly with Toyota) the dealers were very keen to achieve good responses.

Aside from the new car questionnaire, I believe the Toyota customer service questionnaires are now sent out to random samples. Mazda seem to have stopped the practice in about 2009/10.

OK some people question how much importance manufacturers give to such information.

An experience we had with Mazda does show that sometimes the information is taken seriously and acted upon. When we had to have the coil pack/HT lead replaced under warranty on our Mazda 2, we had to wait 10 weeks for the dealer to get the HT lead - only resolved when I insisted Mazda UK fit the equivalent Ford HT lead (the car was made by Ford, used Ford mechanicals, etc). After we had the car serviced 8 weeks later, I received the customer satisfaction questionnaire and I mentioned my experience with the coil pack/HT lead. Then I had a letter from the head of Mazda UK customer services, apologizing for the poor service and undertaking that the next service would be undertaken at no charge to myself - costs being borne by Mazda UK. This undertaking saved us £300 on the following service.

Cannot imagine that manufacturers would publish the information they gather, certainly not all of it, as it could dissuade people from buying their cars.

Suppose organisations like Which?,JD Power, etc have tried to fill the gap. Certainly I have used the Which? recommendations to buy the majority of our new cars.

[tarquin]

Its like the EGR issue. I remember when mine would fail at the point of having just pulled out onto a roundabout. Very dangerous. And is known by Toyota to be a design failure with a bulletin. Still no recall!

Seems they would rather pay out for a fatality than the cost of a recall. Where is the customer care there

David

[s44gtw]

We spoke a year ago and a year before that about 'JD Power' or 'Which' type owners surveys.

It seemed odd that Owners/Drivers could comment on owning an iQ,

but no mention of the 'Interior light' and the lack of lighting.

The cars Standard Headlights and the lack of lighting provided by them.

The Fuel Gauge and the lack of accurate information on the amount of fuel.

But they mentioned the lack of space from a car that they were 'supposed' to have bought.

(i think all on here would agree the space in the front is amazing, and the rear ability to carry a passenger or luggage is as expected.)

It brought home the odd things about people that do survey responses.

Do they ever look or sit inside a car before buying it, did they drive one.

& once they have, do they only drive in daylight.?

george

[Lorna2]

Oops, messed up the quote :o so reposted below

Edited June 3, 2013 by Lorna2

[Lorna2]

I remember when manufacturers like Toyota and Mazda sent out customer questionnaires after new cars were purchased and when any servicing was undertaken by the dealer network. I think this had a three-fold effect - customers felt that the manufacturer were interested in customer opinion of their cars, the manufacturer gained information on how well or otherwise the cars and the dealer network were performing, and (certainly with Toyota) the dealers were very keen to achieve good responses.

Aside from the new car questionnaire, I believe the Toyota customer service questionnaires are now sent out to random samples. Mazda seem to have stopped the practice in about 2009/10.

OK some people question how much importance manufacturers give to such information.

An experience we had with Mazda does show that sometimes the information is taken seriously and acted upon. When we had to have the coil pack/HT lead replaced under warranty on our Mazda 2, we had to wait 10 weeks for the dealer to get the HT lead - only resolved when I insisted Mazda UK fit the equivalent Ford HT lead (the car was made by Ford, used Ford mechanicals, etc). After we had the car serviced 8 weeks later, I received the customer satisfaction questionnaire and I mentioned my experience with the coil pack/HT lead. Then I had a letter from the head of Mazda UK customer services, apologizing for the poor service and undertaking that the next service would be undertaken at no charge to myself - costs being borne by Mazda UK. This undertaking saved us £300 on the following service.

Cannot imagine that manufacturers would publish the information they gather, certainly not all of it, as it could dissuade people from buying their cars.

Suppose organisations like Which?,JD Power, etc have tried to fill the gap. Certainly I have used the Which? recommendations to buy the majority of our new cars.

Toyota have always sent me the questionnaires, after buying (current car bought in 2012) and after any servicing. And always a phone call from the dealers looking for feedback. Don't know why you haven't been getting yours.

[FROSTYBALLS]

Although this is now way off topic, it really is surprising how many people go into car purchase with no real idea of what they want from a car, how they are going to use it, etc, and whether a particular model is going to fulfil their needs.

How many times have you heard people say they only want something that is small and economical?

Nowadays cheap car tax also seems to be a major factor for some - where someone may be looking to spend several hundred or thousands of pounds on a car, yet they seem to be obsessed with car tax below £100 per annum.

How many people go for diesels due to the greater economy and, again, cheaper car tax - yet haven't thought of possible increased service costs or the possibility of really big bills (replacement fuel pump, DPF problems, etc), or haven't looked at whether their annual mileage justifies having a diesel.

Quite a lot of people don't test drive cars before purchase either.

On other forums you will often see topics asking for people's advice on a range of cars which may be quite different (eg buying an Astra, Corolla or Avensis [which is the next class up]).

Another example is the number of new drivers, who pass their tests and buy the same model of car they have learnt to drive in - because that is the car they are used to. No regard for whether the car suits the majority of their needs.

Rather than the issue being with survey completion, I think it is more about people not working out what they want from a car before they actually make a purchase.

The fact that some of these people go onto complete survey information is just one way that survey results can show up discrepancies.

Other points - the IQ fuel gauge is the bar type gauge as used in the Auris. I don't have an issue with the fuel gauge in either of the two Auris I have had.

Headlights - personally I find the OE headlight bulbs poor, so I always change the bulbs for brighter bulbs (and have done since around 2000). Other people may not notice the relatively poor performance.

[FROSTYBALLS]

FROSTYBALLS, on 03 Jun 2013 - 12:27, said:

I remember when manufacturers like Toyota and Mazda sent out customer questionnaires after new cars were purchased and when any servicing was undertaken by the dealer network. I think this had a three-fold effect - customers felt that the manufacturer were interested in customer opinion of their cars, the manufacturer gained information on how well or otherwise the cars and the dealer network were performing, and (certainly with Toyota) the dealers were very keen to achieve good responses.
Aside from the new car questionnaire, I believe the Toyota customer service questionnaires are now sent out to random samples. Mazda seem to have stopped the practice in about 2009/10.
OK some people question how much importance manufacturers give to such information.
An experience we had with Mazda does show that sometimes the information is taken seriously and acted upon. When we had to have the coil pack/HT lead replaced under warranty on our Mazda 2, we had to wait 10 weeks for the dealer to get the HT lead - only resolved when I insisted Mazda UK fit the equivalent Ford HT lead (the car was made by Ford, used Ford mechanicals, etc). After we had the car serviced 8 weeks later, I received the customer satisfaction questionnaire and I mentioned my experience with the coil pack/HT lead. Then I had a letter from the head of Mazda UK customer services, apologizing for the poor service and undertaking that the next service would be undertaken at no charge to myself - costs being borne by Mazda UK. This undertaking saved us £300 on the following service.

Cannot imagine that manufacturers would publish the information they gather, certainly not all of it, as it could dissuade people from buying their cars.

Suppose organisations like Which?,JD Power, etc have tried to fill the gap. Certainly I have used the Which? recommendations to buy the majority of our new cars.

Toyota have always sent me the questionnaires, after buying (current car bought in 2012) and after any servicing. And always a phone call from the dealers looking for feedback. Don't know why you haven't been getting yours.

I've always had the new car questionnaires from Toyota.

As regards the ones after servicing, when I didn't receive one after my 2009 Auris's first service, I queried it with Toyota GB - and was informed that the service questionnaires had changed to being sent out on a random sample basis.

So with our 1996 Corolla, 1998 Corolla and 2006 Corolla I received questionnaires after each service. For the 2009 Auris I didn't. Don't know about the 2012 Auris as yet as it is only 7 months old.

[Cyker]

It seems random; I sometimes get them, sometimes don't.

As for the IQ, yeah, I don't know how a driver can say it feels small! If you're in the front it feels like you're in an Avensis or Auris or something!

As long as you don't look back, it's nice illusion :)

Now this 107 I'm driving? I kinda alternative between feeling snug and claustrophobic. I think this is mainly because my Yaris has a sunroof and the 107 doesn't tho' - It's amazing how dark and cramped it feels without a sunroof!

[Dark Matter]

It seemed odd that Owners/Drivers could comment on owning an iQ,but no mention of the 'Interior light' and the lack of lighting.

I’ve never had a problem with the roof mounted light – I find it more than adequate to illuminate the interior of the car sufficient to get in and drive

off. If you need more illumination to find things put a torch in the door bin whichI have had to do with most of the other cars I have owned. The
lack of rear “boot” light can be a pain if it’s really dark - but that can be solved for a couple of quid with a small led light.

The cars Standard Headlights and the lack of lightingprovided by them.

I have never had a problem. Probably because the lights on my iQ2 are xenon. I made the decision at purchase to go for a higher spec car with better

lights as one of the main reasons.

The Fuel Gauge and the lack of accurate information on the amount of fuel.

The Fuel gauge is fine. Fill up when the last square blinks. No problem. The iQ is a city car designed to be driven in an environment where there is a petrol station every ¼ mile.

I have just completed 10,000 miles in my iQ registered June 2012- the car has been faultless and a joy to drive every day.

It may be childish ….. but I still get a kick out of pressing the start button and setting of on my next trip even if it’s only to the office.

It’ s presently at outside my office window it’s glass like white pearlescent paint shimmering in the sunshine. (which, by the way is one of the best paint
jobs I have ever seen).

The car is what it is. A very spacious and comfortable ( I’m 6’ 3”) 2 seater with masses of boot space if you forgo the rear seats. 95% of the time I am it’s only occupant something at odds with all the commuters I see dragging 3 empty seats and a huge boot to work and back with them every day. If it suits your needs it is the perfect car, I am truly amazed there are not more of them on the roads in the UK. The much less accomplished Fiat 500 seems to be everywhere. Dissatisfaction occurs when people don’t do their research, buy the wrong sort of car and then blame the manufacturer for their uninformed decision.

What would I change? Maybe leather seats next time although the seat design is very very good – but leather would a certain something to the cabin ambiance

( apart from ££££!). When ( or if ) Toyota revamp the car there is very little to change. A nice big glass retractable Moonroof
would be great, although the iQ’s unique design may not allow this. A proper storage bin between the seats would be useful – I have put a perfectly sized black “leather” storage box there, secured with Velcro and it looks for all the world like original fitment – cost £3.99.

[sweet-dentist]

A proper storage bin between the seats would be useful – I have put a perfectly sized black “leather” storage box there, secured

with Velcro and it looks for all the world like original fitment – cost £3.99.

Photo's please... And if possible...brand and where to get it... I think we all would like to know, cause it would be very handy indeed... :-)

[Dark Matter]

A proper storage bin between the seats would be useful – I have put a perfectly sized black “leather” storage box there, secured

with Velcro and it looks for all the world like original fitment – cost £3.99.

Photo's please... And if possible...brand and where to get it... I think we all would like to know, cause it would be very handy indeed... :-)

Sure - I'll take a picture tonight. I think it is basically a CD box from Poundstrecher - but works remarkably well.

<<< edit>>> I tell a lie .... its one of these.

http://www.ikea.com/gb/en/catalog/products/20129969/

picture 'in situ' later!

[Dark Matter]

http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r501/nickkr/IMAG0772_zps7e6b55a0.jpg

Picture as promised

[sweet-dentist]

its one of these. http://www.ikea.com/gb/en/catalog/products/20129969/ picture 'in situ' later!

Wow...that's perfect.. Ikea must have it here in Holland... Thanks....

[sweet-dentist]

Yes! They have it...

Here: KNÖS ... Bak, zwart

€ 7.99 / st.

[sweet-dentist]

Umm.. Turns out that the "knös" is actually a bit small... I was just now at Ikea.

It is of a very good material though... Knös is 15 x 26 x 15 and the Kvarnvik is 16 x 29 x 15 .....

I took with me a "kvarnvik" .. It's cheaper and a little bigger and should fit better between the seats... Also the big cluncky iQ book fits in this... It's made of cardboard wrapped in linen/look/finish... :-)

Have not unwrapped it though... Cause they have in dark blue and in off white.. The white is what they only had here...dispite that the computer says they have a large stock in blue?

When in place I'l take a phote...

[Sensha]

I have received and completed both the original "new car" questionnaire and a second, followup questionnaire that looked for additional detail on my complaints about the vehicle. I aired the lack of cruise control, the interior lighting, the lack of a center console, and two or three other issues. (This was on the Scion iQ, not the Toyota version, of course.)

The second questionnaire was very detailed, with room for extensive comments.