New Auris Excel Sport Tourer Hybrid Vs Prius

[cviclark]

I have just passed my 1000m with my Auris ts hsd Excel which replaced a Gen 3 Prius which replaced a Gen2 Prius. I love HSD and cannot understand why idiots like Chris Evans do not read the manual and try the Power Mode button. The Auris does not feel quite as fast as the Prius but it does feel more solid and drives better and in PWR mode is still quick. I did not want Low Profiles on 17" wheels but had I got the dealer to fit 16" wheels the insurance would have been prohibitive. They see it as a mod away from the standard spec. As a result my average is only 50.8 mpg where the average for the Prius over its life was 55.8 mpg. In the summer on 100 mile runs it manged low 60's but over a 3000 miles plus it was always 55.8. I will let you know how I get on when I put my 15" Prius winter wheels on. If the insurance company let me.

I like the layout and use of space in the Auriis TS better and the trim feels more hard wearing. It is a bit bigger than the Prius. The DAB gets me BBC 2&4 but like the Prius FM here in Wales is patchy. I love the folding mirrors, reversing camera, rear wiper parks properly out of the way. It is just as quiet, vision and access is better.

My only real complaint is the speedo. It is well out of eye line, small, and no markings at 30 or 50 mph. Even worse there is a very nice big digital trip information/driving monitor that tells me all sorts of superfluous information like average speed, average mpg and others that even the book can't explain. Toyota say this can not be re-programmed to show speed, but I think this is an over-site. It would be easy to loose your license as there is so little audible indication of speed. They should sort this out quickly as had I realized how difficult it was to know actual speed on the test drive I would not have bought it. I guess HUD and big digital speed readout of the Prius made life easy.

That said speedo and daft choice of tyres/wheels aside I like it more than the Prius ( there is even room for a spare wheel and the kit arrived a couple of days ago). Best Hsd yet but could be better.

[Cyker]

Yeah, I still don't understood why Toyota insist on putting massive rims on cars that are supposed to be aimed at the more eco-concious market; They give no benefit apart from maybe looks, and give worse mpg, worse ride quality and bigger risk of rim damage on our pot-hole strewn roads.

As for the speedo, yeah, this is one of the things I love about my Yaris - The speedo is just massive digital numbers that you can glance at out the corner of the eye! Don't know why they went back to boring old dials in the Mk3 and later Mk2s.

Same thing with the Prius HUD; I thought it was very cool and never understood why they took them off. :( As a workaround, you might be able to get some sort of HUD kit; I haven't seen them around so much now, but you used to be able to buy widgets that plugged into the ODB port and projected speed, RPM etc. onto the windscreen.

Also, most GPS units can be put into a 'status' mode when not navigating, although the speed it reports is often lower than what the speedo says and may increase risk of getting a speeding ticket!

[PeteB]

Yeah, I still don't understood why Toyota insist on putting massive rims on cars that are supposed to be aimed at the more eco-concious market...

As for the speedo, yeah, this is one of the things I love about my Yaris...

Also, most GPS units can be put into a 'status' mode when not navigating, although the speed it reports is often lower than what the speedo says and may increase risk of getting a speeding ticket!

Rims: a man after my own heart - I loved the 14" wheels on my Gen 1 Prius (and it had a FULL SIZE spare too!). My Toyota dealer charged around £40 a time for new tyres, whereas the silly (IMHO) 16" ones on the Gen 2 cost around £100. I spent just over £1000 on tyres in 160,000 miles, workout the cost if I'd had a Gen 2! Also, the Gen 1 had the smoothest ride of any Prius!

Speedo: with you again - I loved the speedo on my 2000 Yaris, 2000 Prius and 2002 Prius, hated the analogue speedo on my 2011 Yaris (sold it at a massive 50% loss after a year partly for this and mostly couldn't live with a non-hybrid) - I wanted a smaller car, but ended up with the 2012 Prius (T3 = 15" rims, but added cruise control switch) because: Auris had analogue instruments, Yaris Hybrid ditto, plus cramped rear (no headroom, seats no longer slide - terrible shame, virtually no oddments space - one tiny glove box, instead of previous model's 3, no under-seat drawer, no coin cubby - horrible). Love the HUD too - are you saying it's discontinued?

Tickets if using Satnav speed - unlikely - our friends in Brussels have decreed that Europeans cannot be trusted with accurate speedos; BY LAW they have to over-read - if you really want to know, I can probably dig out the EC Directive, which contains a formula (but only in the German version) for the minimum over-read! (from memory, it's something like 4 KPH + 2.5%).

The GPS on the other hand is probably quite accurate when travelling at a steady speed with good reception from several satellites. (BTW - if you buy a Prius in Japan or USA [amongst other places] you get an accurate speedo.

Regards, PeteB

[Cyker]

Yeah, what I mean is, normal car speedos are all over reading by between 2-3mph and 10% (!!) so when you're doing 35-indicated in a 30mph zone you're probably not *actually* speeding, whereas if you do a GPS-indicated 35mph, mr police man will tag you!

re. the HUD, I can't remember if the Prius Mk3 has it still (I don't think it does...), but the Auris HSD and Yaris HSD deffo don't!

I do wish they had made the Mk3 more... Yarissy. In its current form, it's more like a shrunken Auris than a Yaris and lacks any of the eccentricities that I love about my Mk 1. :(

It's not a bad car; The handling and body roll is a lot better for one thing, but it just doesn't inspire the slightly rabit I had for the Mk1 and early Mk2s for some reason

[Parts-King]

Here you go

The amended Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986 permits the use of speedometers that meet either the requirements of EC Council Directive 75/443 (as amended by Directive 97/39) or UNECE Regulation 39

As with the UNECE regulation and the EC Directives, the speedometer must never show an indicated speed less than the actual speed. However it differs slightly from them in specifying that for all actual speeds between 25 mph and 70 mph (or the vehicles' maximum speed if it is lower than this), the indicated speed must not exceed 110% of the actual speed, plus 6.25 mph.

For example, if the vehicle is actually travelling at 50 mph, the speedometer must not show more than 61.25 mph or less than 50 mph.

As you can see from the above formula, it is allowed to read hugely OVER but not under

Kingo

[Parts-King]

Yeah, what I mean is, normal car speedos are all over reading by between 2-3mph and 10% (!!) so when you're doing 35-indicated in a 30mph zone you're probably not *actually* speeding, whereas if you do a GPS-indicated 35mph, mr police man will tag you!

re. the HUD, I can't remember if the Prius Mk3 has it still (I don't think it does...), but the Auris HSD and Yaris HSD deffo don't!

Not sure if it currently has HUD, BUT it will be dropped in the near future (if not already)

Kingo

[Cyker]

Blimey, that was quick Kingo! I hadn't finished editing my post!

Do you have all these directives on your office wall???

I'll have to start calling you Lightning McKingo soon!

[cviclark]

Hi

Maybe I didn't make it clear. I have a new Auris Excel HSD Touring Sport (Estate). The motoring press have slated it, but they did'nt bother to read the manual or tested the Excel while writing about the ICON. Mine is still the only one I have seen outside of a show room. I only found out it existed when my Prius was in for the recall and I borrowed a demonstrator. After the Prius I wanted a small estate and looked at Merc C class BMW and VW. All had silly wheels, no spare, and no space for a spare. I do not do the miles for a diesel and like auto's. The Auris uses the space better than the Merc, has space for a spare and is quicker, quieter and for me better appointed. All the little spaces for hiding bits are well thought out and the Battery is hidden low in part of where the fuel tank is on the petrol. Many of my trips are less than 10 miles and hybrids are ideal for short trips.

This Auris is bigger than the Prius MK 3 and a better drive. My only complaints are down to Toyota Marketing valuing style over substance. The tyres are stupid, they do nothing for the ride and punish fuel consumption. I knew this before I bought it and while the dealer would have changed the wheels for 16" the insurance company viewed this as a mod to the standard spec so in UK the Excel is blighted. The Excel TS is not homologated for 16" wheels. Petrol and diesels can have them but not the Hybrid. I did not like the shiny dash or trim on the ICON, to many reflections.

The speedo is analogue well out of the eye-line, but between this and the Power dial ( like a rev counter) is a nice digital screen. This shows all sort of superfluous information. Average speed, Average MPG, a graphic of the engine charging the Battery, range to fill up and other things I don't need . If this could be programmed to show a digital read-out of the speed it would be perfect. I say this because the analogue speedo does not have a 30 or 50 marking and is hard to see. Toyota are not being very helpful as they do not see it as a problem. I think it would be an easy mod to implement as if it can show Average Speed it should be able to program it to show actual speed even if it is only as accurate as the speedo. Yes I have a Garmin sat nav but only use it when I need to find a new route or destination.

I love the car and it deserves to sell well but with such obvious faults I fear it will be a rarity. .

[PeteB]

Not sure if it currently has HUD, BUT it will be dropped in the near future (if not already)

That's a real shame - when I first drove the Gen 3 I thought it was a "nice-to-have", but since owning one for 14 months and covering some 16,000 miles, it's become one of those things I don't ever want to be without (like heated door mirrors since the mid 1980s!!).

I have the ECO meter selected to be in the display at the expense of slightly smaller speed digits, and hardy look inside the cockpit when driving now. I'm told you use more eye muscle in the last 20% of near refocusing than the other 80%, and I certainly believe it's one more thing that reduces fatigue on a long journey.

Also, I plan at some point to do some three month tours of Europe in my Prius. I've only ever driven abroad in hire cars before where the steering wheel is on the correct side for the country concerned, so having digital speed readout that can be switched to KPH and not having to look inside the car so much will be a real safety aid in keeping my mind on staying on the right side of the road!

To my horror, the spy shots I've seen of the Gen 4 Prius show old fashioned dials hidden behind the steering wheel, like the Yaris and Auris - I really hope they don't do this. Apart from being able to glance at the speedo and know I'm doing 47 instead of "somewhere between 40 and 55" makes a lot more sense than a layout that would have looked familiar to my father in the car he drove in the Army during the 1940s!

Regards, PeteB

[johalareewi]

Apart from being able to glance at the speedo and know I'm doing 47 instead of "somewhere between 40 and 55"...

Unfortunately, the speedo has got a built in fudge factor so at 47 you will be somewhere between 40 and 46.99999.

[PeteB]

Apart from being able to glance at the speedo and know I'm doing 47 instead of "somewhere between 40 and 55"...

Unfortunately, the speedo has got a built in fudge factor so at 47 you will be somewhere between 40 and 46.99999.

Yes, I'm fully aware of that, but I'm getting the same inaccuracy whichever way it's presented, and I make my decisions accordingly. It's just that I find it much easier to monitor a digital readout than a dial.

As an aside, on earlier versions of Prius it was possible to use a sequence of buttons and 'invisible buttons' on the MFD to bring up diagnostic screens which included the current speed (in KPH) - this was always very accurate, so the car knew the true speed and fudged it for the speedo!

I suspect it's possible on the Gen 3 but I've not heard of anyone doing it (or how to), but if you install the Drop of Water game it too displays a true speed.

I used to live near a stretch of road where the Traffic Police has placed markers exactly ¼ mile apart, and whenever I got a loan or hire car, or changed my own, I popped over there to check the speedo accuracy - the only car I ever tested with a dead accurate speedo was ... an Austin Allegro! A Morris Marina came close, accurate at 30, showing 61 at 60, and a Fiat Strada (the first car I came across with an electronic speedo (still a dial) as opposed to done with a rotating cable, springs and magnets was 3 mph over at all speeds - very accurate for a Fiat in the 1970s - a Fiat 132 2L was some 15% over-reading!

Regards, PeteB

[johalareewi]

Not sure if it currently has HUD, BUT it will be dropped in the near future (if not already)

You may have seen this app in the news recently

http://hudwayapp.com/

[johalareewi]

I suspect it's possible on the Gen 3 but I've not heard of anyone doing it (or how to), but if you install the Drop of Water game it too displays a true speed.

The average speed indicators on the gen3 are 'true speed' so the Prius knows how fast it is going.

I guess the correct speed is available via the diagnostic connector?

[Parts-King]

uuuurrrggghhhh, I could not think of anything worse

Any car with HUD gets switched OFF when I get in it, cant stand it, especially at night. Great for fighter pilots, not for me...........

Kingo

[barrycoll]

sorry Kingo, I can't do without my after market HUD, night or day...and as its info is OBD, it is 100% accurate, + a rev counter

http://hud-e.com/shop/page/1?sessid=7BCluy6kTnnicybOxfqGSOnYKpHWZ9JOh0qaKRddwHsQpsKzXJMNuep3xSRKT82m&shop_param=

[Cyker]

Ooooooooooh! :D

[PeteB]

sorry Kingo, I can't do without my after market HUD, night or day...and as its info is OBD, it is 100% accurate, + a rev counter

http://hud-e.com/shop/page/1?sessid=7BCluy6kTnnicybOxfqGSOnYKpHWZ9JOh0qaKRddwHsQpsKzXJMNuep3xSRKT82m&shop_param=

Hi barrycoll

Does your Prius not have HUD, or did you just want something different?

Regards, PeteB

[PeteB]

Hi

Maybe I didn't make it clear. I have a new Auris Excel HSD Touring Sport (Estate). ...

Mine is still the only one I have seen outside of a show room... .

I actually saw two or three today (third one may have been one of the first two, as this was later in the day) - they belonged to a local (Gt Yarmouth) taxi firm - looks like they're replacing some of their Gen 3 Prius with them.

There weren't any in the show room when I popped in recently, but I'll have a look around out of interest when I have my 20k service on the 16th.

Regards, PeteB

[johalareewi]

Ooooooooooh! :D

Ooooooooooh too.

[barrycoll]

the after market HUD is in the IQ, PeteB, and the T Spirit is, as we know, well provided for

...but all this talk of 15/16" rims, makes me think that an after market set of wheels/tyres might be worth a punt...

on the other hand (insurance considerations aside) is the T Spirit homologated for 15" rims, as my solar roof optioned T Spirit came with 17" unfortunately..

Mr T is missing a trick here, as all VAG cars have bigger rims as an optional extra, and so a nice little earner for the company

[PeteB]

I thought your T-Spirit would probably have it, but with all the talk of the HUD being withdrawn I did wonder if your more recent model was without it, seeing as the wheel spec had changed.

[PeteB]

the after market HUD is in the IQ, PeteB, and the T Spirit is, as we know, well provided for

...but all this talk of 15/16" rims, makes me think that an after market set of wheels/tyres might be worth a punt...

on the other hand (insurance considerations aside) is the T Spirit homologated for 15" rims, as my solar roof optioned T Spirit came with 17" unfortunately..

Mr T is missing a trick here, as all VAG cars have bigger rims as an optional extra, and so a nice little earner for the company

yes, I'm very happy with my ex-demo T3 with built-in SatNav, cruise control, HUD and DRLs, which had under 4,000 miles on it and was unmarked (once they took the Radio Norwich livery off!) for a very good price, and I was able to see (and drive) what I was getting so no unpleasant surprises

BUT, if I had a choice on wheel size and could have had a T Spirit with 15" wheels, I'd had bought a new one with the Technology pack to get the pre-crash safety and adaptive (radar) cruise control. I driven some Lexus Hybrids with the latter - it's brilliant!

[cviclark]

The new Auris Hsd ts Excel would be great if only I could tell when I was breaking the law. The speedo is hidden and the digital trip readout gives all sorts of information that I don't need most of which is duplicated on the main screen, I have no idea what Eco drive level tells me average speed? Average mpg but not speed, Toyota do not want to know and refer me to my Service Centre. The mod should be simple as the info is available at the ODB, but it seems no Technicians work at Toyota GB. This is my third HSD but it beats me how Toyota can keep shooting themselves in the foot with daft configurations. !7" wheels on a Hybrid means 50mpg rather than 55.8 on a gen 3 Prius. The space saver spare fits well but should be standard. but if I want to keep my licence I have to solve this speedo problem. Does anyone know of a way into Toyota technical?

[ToyotaAurisHybrid]

There are any number of free HUD apps for smartphones these days......worth a look. I've downloaded one and it works a treat at night - SpeedHUD I think it's called. Just place your phone right to the front of the dash where it meets the windscreen and Bob's your uncle

[WasMr2]

Like many other contributors to this forum I was a Gen 2 and Gen 3 Prius owner. I can only say that the HUD in the Gen 3 was the little bit of magic that made it better than Gen 2. I have just taken delivery of an Excel hybrid sport touring and have to date completed only 170 miles so have yet to find any problems as such, but I agree with others the analoge instruments are a retrograde step and although I was aware of the lack of HUD in this model I only now realise what a boon it is to a more relaxed form of driving. Toyota marketing please take note.