Upgrading Headlight Bulbs.

[Parts-King]

Even the big companies will out source. They will give the spec required to a company in China or wherever and get them made, its the way the supply chain works these days.

Kingo

[152bobby]

I want to upgrade my headlights, but like all forums, EVERYONE has a different opinion. I'm going to make my decision on all your feedback and customers feedbacks combined on the various suppliers websites !! But reviews which I have come across rules out Halfords.

[Parts-King]

Just like tyres or wipers or oil, EVERYONE has a favourite as you say. From my own point of view, Osram Nightbreakers have always done the job, and they are what I have supplied to many a customer, but the choice is huge and depends on what you want in a light (cool warm or whatever)

Kingo

[152bobby]

All I want is good clean clear white lights with good coverage and no hint of blue. I think the Osram Night breakers are my choice !! All that's left to do is see who has the best deal.

[Tech01]

All I want is good clean clear white lights with good coverage and no hint of blue. I think the Osram Night breakers are my choice !! All that's left to do is see who has the best deal.

You won't be disappointed with these. Sold everywhere (almost) - and don't forget to look at Amazon, too.

Chris

[152bobby]

Osram Night Breakers Unlimited order for all front lights and have already swapped the yellow sidelights for LED so they will all match.

Cheers

[anchorman]

All I want is good clean clear white lights with good coverage and no hint of blue. I think the Osram Night breakers are my choice !! All that's left to do is see who has the best deal.

I use those in my SR. Very good.

[firemac]

All I want is good clean clear white lights with good coverage and no hint of blue. I think the Osram Night breakers are my choice !! All that's left to do is see who has the best deal.

I had Nightbreakers on our previous 4.2 & they were excellent.

I notice that there is now a Nightbreaker Unlimited available (new for Winter 2013, they say).

[FROSTYBALLS]

I've noticed the advertising for the Osram Nightbreaker Unlimited is a bit misleading though.

They're advertised as having 40m more visibility (longer light beam), but it is only the H7 fitting that has this - the other fitments (H1, H3, H4, H11, HB3 and HB4) retain the 35m longer beam of the Nightbreaker Plus 90%.

[firemac]

I've noticed the advertising for the Osram Nightbreaker Unlimited is a bit misleading though.

They're advertised as having 40m more visibility (longer light beam), but it is only the H7 fitting that has this - the other fitments (H1, H3, H4, H11, HB3 and HB4) retain the 35m longer beam of the Nightbreaker Plus 90%.

Hang on. Only 35M extra and not 40? Well that's definitely a deal breaker ! :laughing:

[voyager t180]

Mike,apparentely the Unlimiteds are actually the H7s?

At least that's according to my order description from Amazon.

[anchorman]

For 4.4 owners, I fitted two pairs of Nightbreakers to Guys and he reports a vast improvement. You need two pairs of HB3s and they are very easy to fit. It takes two or three minutes per headlight. I did unclip the washer filler pipe for easier access to the drivers side.

[FROSTYBALLS]

Mike,apparentely the Unlimiteds are actually the H7s.or am I missing something?I've just ordered some.

Don't know what fitment the Rav4 has, but the Nightbreaker Unlimited are available in the range of fitments I mentioned - think they have superceded the Nightbreaker Plus 90% bulbs. So if you've ordered the H7's you're getting the longer beam - five metres longer.

[voyager t180]

Hope these are the right ones then

Nightbreaker unlimited H7 64210NBP?

[FROSTYBALLS]

Those are the Nightbreaker Plus +90% - on the Amazon page your link goes to, there's a box beneath and to the right of the bulb image, titled 'There is a newer model of this item'. The newer model is the Nightbreaker Unlimited +110%.

The +90%'s are still good bulbs - got those in the Auris and the i20.

[voyager t180]

Thanks Mike.

[Uncle_P]

My bulbs arrived this morning.. Just got to fit them now. The blurb on the box seems to suggests that although they are a lot brighter, the life expectancy is half that of a regular bulb. I'll probably fit them at the weekend, so I'll keep you all posted about how they work out.

[Tech01]

My bulbs arrived this morning.. Just got to fit them now. The blurb on the box seems to suggests that although they are a lot brighter, the life expectancy is half that of a regular bulb. I'll probably fit them at the weekend, so I'll keep you all posted about how they work out.

There is always a trade-off between lamp output and service life. The whiter (brighter, hotter) the filament burns, the shorter its life. Original (factory-fitted) lamps will be long-life - so they don't expire during the warranty period, thereby impressing customers - rather than high-performance.

"Long life" lamps, including the old domestic tungsten ones, were usually designed to operate at 250-260v, and at 240v would "under run", and last yonks, and burn slightly yellow. On a tungsten lamp, if you reduce the voltage by 10%, the service life goes up by around 400%. Increase it by 10%, and it goes down to around half, IIRC.

Plus 90, +110, 35m, 40m ? Mainly advertising hype. They're all good, and probably from the same factory (or not)!

Chris

[Big Kev]

If they last one long dark Scottish winter at a time, and let me see wee Tam going to school in his black anorak and trousers with nae high viz., consider them worth it.........

[glorydad]

Stupid question and I can probably guess the answer.... Is the life determined by hours the bulb is burning, number of power-cycles (i.e. switch ons and offs) or days since manufacture or even a combination of the preceding? Does vibration cause any life shortening and is this more critical with the brighter options? Pulled the trigger on 2 pair of Osram HB3 Nightbreaker Unlimited +110%. I usually use the Halford ones but as the Osrams seem popular in this forum I'd give 'em a punt.

Forum Power!!

[Davrav]

Not particularly relevant but the distortion of lamp filaments after a crash is one of the pieces of evidence crash investigators can use to help determine speed and angle of impact. They can also tell if the lamp was on or off at time of impact. With the development of LED lights, that is something that will be lost........

[Tech01]

" Is the life determined by hours the bulb is burning, number of power-cycles (i.e. switch ons and offs) or days since manufacture or even a combination of the preceding? Does vibration cause any life shortening and is this more critical with the brighter options? "

Main cause of a filament lamp failing is the filament slowly evaporating, and therefore thinning, to the point where it is so thin somewhere along its length that it snaps. This will be aggravated by vibration. As the tungsten filament evaporates into the vacuum around it, it condenses back to metallic tungsten on the coolest part of the lamp: the glass envelope. That's why old lamps often look blackened - tungsten is deposited on the inside of the glass.

One of the advantages of halogen lamps (glass 'envelope' filled with iodine, or another halogen gas) is that when the tungsten filament evaporates, it combines with the iodine around it to form tungsten iodide. This has the unusual property of depositing itself not on a cooler surface, but on a hot one - the filament itself - where it promptly splits up again into iodine and tungsten. This deposits tungsten back on the filament again! Eventually the lamp fails simply because the tungsten is not dumped back on the filament uniformly, and somewhere eventually goes thin. End of lamp.

A second advantage of tungsten halogen lamps is that the filament can be operated at a much higher temperature than standard tungsten lamps. This gives a whiter light and more output for a given power. If a standard filament lamp was pushed to this kind of temperature, its filament would evaporate in a very short timespan and the lamp would "blow".

Brighter headlamp bulbs simply run at a higher temperature (whiter light), and therefore have a shorter service life (more filament evaporation), but, as others have said, the life of reputable makes (Philips, Osram...) is still very respectable, usually years.

Switching filament lamps on and off frequently doesn't affect their life much (provided they are not driven by abnormally high voltage) - but see below.

If you go shopping for domestic lamps these days, you seem to have the choice between all sorts of lamp: old 230v mains filament bulbs (disappearing), 230v CFLs (compact fluorescent lamps), LED lighting, and two types of halogen lamp - 12v and 230v. Why two types? Which to choose?

A 50W halogen lamp produces a certain light output (more or less), irrespective of whether it's driven by 12v or 230v. But there is a difference. The 230v lamp doesn't need a transformer (it runs direct off the mains), but it does have a long and very thin filament (to cope with the 230v across it), and this leaves it prone to filament failure, by both evaporation and vibration. 230v lamps just shouldn't be bounced around!

Low-voltage (12v) lamps do need a transformer, but have the great advantage of having a short, stubby filament. Which, you've guessed, is both rugged and able to survive evaporation better. For "rough service" (eg on a vehicle), they're ideal. In a domestic setting, 12v (reflector and bi-pin) halogen lamps will often soldier on for years and years, whereas their 230v cousins just won't. Lamp manufacturers and retailers don't publicise this over-much.

The life of a filament lamp (halogen or otherwise) can be extended by using "soft start" technology. Modern electronic transformers (for 12v lamps) usually have this built in as standard. When switched on, the bulb comes on gently over the first couple of seconds (soft start), and not with the sudden surge of current that a cold, standard filament would otherwise receive, particularly from 230v. The best of these "electronic" transformers are also dimmable (by standard dimmers), and run almost cold. They also can cost less than a tenner.

For vehicles, the normal 12v supply set-up has its own (unintended) "soft start" characteristic. When headlamps are suddenly switched on (or flashed) the voltage being output by the battery/alternator very temporarily drops (you may notice some other lamps dim slightly) for less than a second, until the alternator senses this and increases its output. This voltage drop is enough to give the headlights a "soft start", and extend their life. Doesn't happen with HIDs, I guess, which need all the start-up surge they can get...

Physics lesson over.

Chris

[152bobby]

Fitted my new Osram Nightbreakers Unlimited today, will have to wait until I drive it tonight to see if they are any good.

[voyager t180]

That's a lot to digest in one go Chris.

Like the recent glow plugs thread,nothing's as simple as it first appears.

Are you a science teacher ;-)

My night breakers should be arriving tmrw Bob,and according to the manual look quite easy to fit,but were they?

[glorydad]

" Is the life determined by hours the bulb is burning, number of power-cycles (i.e. switch ons and offs) or days since manufacture or even a combination of the preceding? Does vibration cause any life shortening and is this more critical with the brighter options? "

Main cause of a filament lamp failing is the filament slowly evaporating, and therefore thinning, to the point where it is so thin somewhere along its length that it snaps. This will be aggravated by vibration. As the tungsten filament evaporates into the vacuum around it, it condenses back to metallic tungsten on the coolest part of the lamp: the glass envelope. That's why old lamps often look blackened - tungsten is deposited on the inside of the glass.

One of the advantages of halogen lamps (glass 'envelope' filled with iodine, or another halogen gas) is that when the tungsten filament evaporates, it combines with the iodine around it to form tungsten iodide. This has the unusual property of depositing itself not on a cooler surface, but on a hot one - the filament itself - where it promptly splits up again into iodine and tungsten. This deposits tungsten back on the filament again! Eventually the lamp fails simply because the tungsten is not dumped back on the filament uniformly, and somewhere eventually goes thin. End of lamp.

A second advantage of tungsten halogen lamps is that the filament can be operated at a much higher temperature than standard tungsten lamps. This gives a whiter light and more output for a given power. If a standard filament lamp was pushed to this kind of temperature, its filament would evaporate in a very short timespan and the lamp would "blow".

Brighter headlamp bulbs simply run at a higher temperature (whiter light), and therefore have a shorter service life (more filament evaporation), but, as others have said, the life of reputable makes (Philips, Osram...) is still very respectable, usually years.

Switching filament lamps on and off frequently doesn't affect their life much (provided they are not driven by abnormally high voltage) - but see below.

If you go shopping for domestic lamps these days, you seem to have the choice between all sorts of lamp: old 230v mains filament bulbs (disappearing), 230v CFLs (compact fluorescent lamps), LED lighting, and two types of halogen lamp - 12v and 230v. Why two types? Which to choose?

A 50W halogen lamp produces a certain light output (more or less), irrespective of whether it's driven by 12v or 230v. But there is a difference. The 230v lamp doesn't need a transformer (it runs direct off the mains), but it does have a long and very thin filament (to cope with the 230v across it), and this leaves it prone to filament failure, by both evaporation and vibration. 230v lamps just shouldn't be bounced around!

Low-voltage (12v) lamps do need a transformer, but have the great advantage of having a short, stubby filament. Which, you've guessed, is both rugged and able to survive evaporation better. For "rough service" (eg on a vehicle), they're ideal. In a domestic setting, 12v (reflector and bi-pin) halogen lamps will often soldier on for years and years, whereas their 230v cousins just won't. Lamp manufacturers and retailers don't publicise this over-much.

The life of a filament lamp (halogen or otherwise) can be extended by using "soft start" technology. Modern electronic transformers (for 12v lamps) usually have this built in as standard. When switched on, the bulb comes on gently over the first couple of seconds (soft start), and not with the sudden surge of current that a cold, standard filament would otherwise receive, particularly from 230v. The best of these "electronic" transformers are also dimmable (by standard dimmers), and run almost cold. They also can cost less than a tenner.

For vehicles, the normal 12v supply set-up has its own (unintended) "soft start" characteristic. When headlamps are suddenly switched on (or flashed) the voltage being output by the battery/alternator very temporarily drops (you may notice some other lamps dim slightly) for less than a second, until the alternator senses this and increases its output. This voltage drop is enough to give the headlights a "soft start", and extend their life. Doesn't happen with HIDs, I guess, which need all the start-up surge they can get...

Physics lesson over.

Chris

A fantastic answer!!! :) thanks very much, I now have a much better appreciation of filament bulbs domestic and auto. Hopefully the Osrams will give a year and I can change them for next winter on a preventative maintenance basis. I hate seeing the one eyed monsters who can't / won't keep their cars legal, you see them every journey and I prefer not to join them inadvertently when a bulb pops. :(

Andy