Don't Buy A Toyota Auris Excel Hybrid.

[Nozuka]

I hope this fixes the problem for you, good luck.

And keep us posted :)

[Ratho1]

Sorry to hear that George, it must be very frustrating. You will never have confidence in your car until it is changed.

Best of luck and please keep us up to date, for good or ill.

[Nicolai]

Yeah, best of luck George.

Untill now, mine has never had a problem with the Battery (as previously stated it does not have smart entry though- only smart start).

[Nicolai]

I may be stating the obvious here but every body seems to mention setting the temp at 22 deg C and saying it's not warm enough, have you tried turning it up to "HI" until the cabin is toasty then turning it back down to 22 when you're warm enough.

I may be thick, but the point of climate control is constant temperature for comfort, isn't it?

When I'm usually very comfortable at/with 22 degrees in my living-room, why should I accept anything else in my car?

No offense meant- just nit sure I get your point.

You should accept anything else in your car because… Well, you just should - it's a different paradigm.

In addition to what Kithmo has said, the perception of warmth (as opposed to temperature) is very subjective. We have all experienced standing by the window in a temperature controlled environment feeling very comfortable, then the sun breaks through the cloud and shines in the room and all of a sudden you perceive the room gets warmer. The reality is the room temperature has not changed, only your perception of the temperature has.

The other consideration is that the temperature setting for the cabin will always be relative to the current outside air temperature - when it is colder outside the cabin temperature will be set to a lower temp than if it is warm outside. There are many reasons for this, one being you tend to dress for the current temp. If you wanted to maintain a constant 22℃ (or whatever is the temp you think is the right temp) and it is cold out, you will need to remove a layer or two when getting into the car and put them on again when getting out. For long journeys this is ok, but short journeys is a pain. So, for short journeys keep rugged up, but turn the CC temp down. In warmer climates (read > 28℃) you might set the temp to 24-25 or even warmer. (Not generally a problem in UK. :) )

Long story short, I have given up focussing on the number at which my climate control is set (there are just too many variables) and just use the "how I feel" guide. :) If I feel cold I put it up (0.5 deg at a time) and if I feel hot I put it down. Life is so much more simple and stress free now One caveat: When travelling with passengers, my "how I feel" guide may not match the "how they feel" guide! Particularly SWMBO's "how I feel" guide. Say no more! FWIW, my temperature setting fluctuates between 18 and 24℃ over the course of a year and will fluctuate (although not to the same extent) in any give journey.

So what you are saying is: 22 degrees does not mean 22 degrees? That's weird....

[RunningInPleasePass]

Well! That's flat battery failure number 4.

Went straight to the DP this time, asked him nicely how he would like his car back...

Car picked up and returned with a new battery within the hour.

They were going to fit a Prius one, but of course it didn't.

So new Auris Hybrid one installed instead.

DP says to keep an eye on it, and complain vociferously to Toyota Customer Service.

If it happens again, then they will look at replacing the car.

Now why couldn't they have done this earlier?

Bit more like the usual service expected.

So, stopwatch on again, we'll see how how long this one lasts.

G...

I'm sure this will be sorted out soon, after mine was fitted with a new Battery it's been fine.

When the dealer is on form they can be very good, I think sometimes they are hampered by Toyota's way of doing things.

Good luck and keep us posted.

[cviclark]

You must have the patience of a Saint.

I called in to see my friendly Service guy today. He tells me Toyota are working on the Battery drain problem as their number one priority and warned me not to leave the key in my pocket when around the car. They have been running tests and think it is due to the "wake up" 20 mins when the key is detected. Lights, mirrors, action, could be smoke if it not well insulated and moisture gets in. Bet they promote the marketing idiot thought we (customers) wanted these features. Smaller batteries and more electrical toys mean this is bound to happen "simples".

Why the hell don't they just fit a higher capacity Battery? and reduce the wake up time. Batteries are cheap enough.

Also RHD Auris XL,s do not get rear heat vents but LHD do, I feel cheated. Its too late to find that out on a cold day, with two elderly ladies in the back complaining their feet are cold for 200 miles. If the sales brochure had told me that I would not have bought it but thats it. Like my request to have digital speed displayed in the centre panel of the speedo Toyota will not do anything about it. I should have found out these "features" on the test drive If I had relations like Toyota Customer Relations I would need a lot more friends. These are only "minor issues" and would not be considered grounds to reject. Maybe we can find a champion in the Press or BBC (Rip off Britain) to take up cudgels on our behalf?

It looks as if a number of "tech bulletins" will get sent out eventually. When I worked I had a picture of a Camel on the wall Underneath it said "This is a horse designed by a committee" If Toyota's committee waits any longer it will get a lot worse before it gets better.

[Joseph D]

So what you are saying is: 22 degrees does not mean 22 degrees? That's weird...

I didn't think I said that, 22 degrees means roundabout 22 degrees for sure. The point I was trying to make was, it is just your perception of the temperature may not agree that it is 22 degrees given, for example, the amount of glass around you that can radiate coolness or heat, for which in turn the climate control system then has to compensate.

You may or may not agree, but this is the last I will contribute on this subject in this thread as it is a bit off-topic.

[Ratho1]

Also RHD Auris XL,s do not get rear heat vents but LHD do, I feel cheated.

Is this yet another case of "rip off Britain?" It certainly is. That BBC programme with the 3 ladies on it would be a good place to start.

[cviclark]

The fact is if you have an RHD Auris HD Excel with dual climate and all the bells and whistles those in the back seat will be cold (in a British Winter) even with the heat set to high and the fan on full. The extraction vents are in the rear, enters via the front exits via the back. The last car I had as cold as this for passengers was a VW Beetle back in the 70s.

Like the Battery problem this should have been sorted before the vehicle was released to an unsuspecting public. I cannot remember the last car I had that did not have air vents under the seats for passenger comfort probably because I never needed to look. If it was cold I turned up the heat, warm I opened the window or even better a flap in front of windscreen that directed fresh air straight to your face. Yes I am old enough to have owned cars like that.

[Ratho1]

civiclark says

I cannot remember the last car I had that did not have air vents under the seats for passenger comfort probably because I never needed to look.

I totally agree Ian. This car seems to be a throwback to the 50s in many ways with Hybrid added on. Next time I buy a car I wont make any assumptions about it's attributes. I'll physically count the wheels, the steering wheel, the windscreen wipers etc. This car is beginning to resemble a trip by Ryanair- the "extras" cost more.

[RunningInPleasePass]

Well! That's flat battery failure number 4.

Went straight to the DP this time, asked him nicely how he would like his car back...

Car picked up and returned with a new battery within the hour.

They were going to fit a Prius one, but of course it didn't.

So new Auris Hybrid one installed instead.

DP says to keep an eye on it, and complain vociferously to Toyota Customer Service.

If it happens again, then they will look at replacing the car.

Now why couldn't they have done this earlier?

Bit more like the usual service expected.

So, stopwatch on again, we'll see how how long this one lasts.

G...

I'm sure this will be sorted out soon, after mine was fitted with a new Battery it's been fine.

When the dealer is on form they can be very good, I think sometimes they are hampered by Toyota's way of doing things.

Good luck and keep us posted.

Mine has 12 volt Battery has now failed for the second time, took it back to the dealer this morning, I will have to wait until Monday when they can contact Toyota Customer Service to see what to do, I'm starting to think this problem is more then just duff batteries.

I'm a high mileage driver, the car is kept in a garage overnight, well away from the key, I don't think they can blame me in all honesty for the Battery going flat, but we will have to wait and see.

By the way the dealer was very good this time, they were very helpful.

[lininjim]

Having waded through all these posts has got me a little worried. On Thu (16th Jan) we ordered an Auris Excel Hybrid.

Previously we have had a Gen 2 Prius T-Spirit 2004 (loved it) and a Gen 3 Prius T-Spirit 2010, liked it (not as much as the Gen 2 though).

The Gen 3 had a 12v Battery replaced quite early on but no real issues other than that.

My commute is only 4 miles so I'll post back on how mine goes (delivery expected on 28th).

My neighbour works in the Burnaston factory so will be letting me know when it shows (it's got the big sunroof so they stand out on the production line!)

Cheers

Lyn and Jim :)

[Nozuka]

How long was your car parked this time?

[RunningInPleasePass]

How long was your car parked this time?

44 hours

[cviclark]

For Lynne & Jim

I to went for the Auris Excel TS after both Gen 2 and Gen 3 Prius's (not T Spirit though) and while I like the car, I still think it is the best auto/petrol estate on the market, I am very frustrated with the number of stupid Toyota design errors. They are well covered in this blog, but to recap.

The Battery issue is of concern, but I understand Toyota are working on a fix. Why they don't just but a bigger Battery in it is beyond me

I have had to buy a hud-e to see what speed I am doing. While the petrol has a nice big,clear, speedo on the Hybrid does not and it is almost impossible to tell when its doing 70, 50 or 30. Aside from the inaccuracy the increments are too small and the speedo is low buried under your right hand. Toyota could make a simple firmware upgrade to fix this by showing digital speed on the trip display but despite many contacts with Customer Relations they do not see this as an issue. The Prius, had a clear digital speedo and hud. The hud-e now works but is not very elegant.

Even more frustrating is the heating, or lack of it, Left hand drive Auris Excels have heating vents under the front seats to the rear footwells. Ours do have holes but no ducts. Over Christmas it was very cold in the back for my grand children and elderly relatives.

Neither of my Prius's were on low profile tyres, both had space saver spares, Both gave very much better fuel consumption than the Auris. Over its life the Gen 3 gave 55.8mpg. On a run it regularly exceeded 60 mpg. The Auris is currently returning 47mpg.

Toyota and my insurance company refused to allow me to have an Excel on 16" wheels Eco Tyres as the Excel is not homologated for other than 17"wheels.

While these deficiencies are frustrating, and all could be overcome if someone in Toyota would admit it was an issue Toyota Customer relations are just not interested. I fear this will be my last Toyota.

I love the camera and DAB but the parking sensors are inaudible in reverse and could not even get my dealer to demonstrate park assist. With the camera parking is easy.

If I was buying again I would want written assurance that these issues are being addressed and wait.

Good Luck

[RunningInPleasePass]

cviclark (Ian) says :

You must have the patience of a Saint.

I called in to see my friendly Service guy today. He tells me Toyota are working on the Battery drain problem as their number one priority and warned me not to leave the key in my pocket when around the car. They have been running tests and think it is due to the "wake up" 20 mins when the key is detected. Lights, mirrors, action, could be smoke if it not well insulated and moisture gets in. Bet they promote the marketing idiot thought we (customers) wanted these features. Smaller batteries and more electrical toys mean this is bound to happen "simples".

Why the hell don't they just fit a higher capacity Battery? and reduce the wake up time. Batteries are cheap enough.

_____________________________________________________________________________________________________

I don't think I have the patience of a saint, it's just that it takes Toyota an age to do things and you just have to go along with it or drive yourself nuts.

As to being their number one priority, I would have thought they would have needed to contact owners who have had this problem, and in my case this has not happened.

The key being too close to the car is silly, in my case the car is kept in a garage when not in use, many items that operate when the key is near have been turned off, the outside mirrors are now set to operate manually, the interior lights are turned off, I even turn off parking sensors, auto wipers and lights, and the radio before I turn the ignition off.

I would have thought Toyota would want one of these faulty cars to test, I know that they test the Battery, the battery drain, and the battery charge in the dealers workshop, but that is not real world driving.

I would have thought some kind of logger could be connected, measuring battery charge and drain over time, it could be that it's only during prolonged use that a component breaks down causing, say, the charging to fail?

It could even be something like using ECO mode for a prolonged time, if ECO mode reduces battery charge to try and save fuel?

[cviclark]

My Service manager said he had one in being tested. Also it only affects the Excel with "bells & whistles". Regardless of the fault a larger capacity Battery is needed. I keep getting locking problems where my door half opens I have to push it closed and unlock then my door opens but the passengers door stays locked. This is normally after I have cleaned it when the doors go daft.

They tried to tell me the heating problem was due to ECO mode rather than no vents to the rear in RH drive cars. The snag is Toyota treat customers as "Punters" and it is our fault for buying Toyota.

The hud-e has now been installed and is working fine. All it does is read the mph info off the OBD port and reflect it off the screen. Why do Hybrids have a small unreadable speedo but the petrol/diesel get a nice big one. Toyota say I should have bought a petrol It reminds me of a Rover SD I once had. It was so bad they replaced it saying "green was unlucky" so they gave me a blue one. It was just as bad but as it was a company car I did not care. I said I would never buy British again. Where is this made Derby. I hope thats not an omen.

[FROSTYBALLS]

Of the 17 new cars we've had 6 have been built in Britain and have had no more faults or problems than the Japanese built ones. My last three Toyotas have been built at Burnaston, and were excellent.

[Ratho1]

Hi Frosty

I would agree with that. However, what puzzles me is why the build spec. for the Excel is different in the UK to the rest of Europe, and in what seems to be a detrimental way, e.g. lack of heater vents front to back, wheel size, Battery type/size, dials etc. ?

[FROSTYBALLS]

I think that the choice of wheel size is just a carry over from the first generation Auris Hybrid - where the T4 came with either 15 or 17 inch weheels (think the 15 inch were optional) and the higher spec T-Spirit came with 17 inch.

As regards rear heating ducts, not sure that LHD examples have these, as earlier in this topic Nicolai, who resides in Denmark, has posted that the rear seat passengers get cold.

[lininjim]

For CVICLARK - thank you for your reply.

I had a look at the HUD-E (I did like my Prius HUD) and I've got similar apps on my phone.

I've ordered this though http://www.dinodirect.com/ifound-universal-obd-car-hud-obd-vehicle-mounted-obd-head-up-display-system-obd-p41420502.html

I'll report back on how well (or not) it works!

Like you say it would be much better if we could put the speed on the central display! Have ordered the Touch and Go Plus!

Rear heating isn't a huge issue for us as there's just us, but I can see the problem for everyone else. Poor show Toyota.

Anyway excited to get back to a Toyota Hybrid anyway (currently running a Renault Scenic Xmod and hate it!)

Cheers all.

L & J

[PeteB]

... Why do Hybrids have a small unreadable speedo but the petrol/diesel get a nice big one...

Well they don't all - I tried out the Yaris Hybrid and Auris Hybrid before settling on the Gen 3 Prius, but didn't really want such a large car. The instruments were a key deciding factor for me - after 11 years with centrally mounted, clear digital instruments, I just didn't like the closeness and low angle of the new speedos. And I love the HUD.

I hope my Gen 3 lasts as well as my last Gen 1, so I don't have to worry about these things for the next 8 or 9 years.

[Nozuka]

Hi Frosty

I would agree with that. However, what puzzles me is why the build spec. for the Excel is different in the UK to the rest of Europe, and in what seems to be a detrimental way, e.g. lack of heater vents front to back, wheel size, battery type/size, dials etc. ?

It's the same crappy Battery in all of europe, sadly.

[Nicolai]

I have written to Toyota UK and asked about the heating problem. I have had no Battery problems so far and now day temperature in Denmark is around 0 degrees Celsius. Lots of short trips too.

[cviclark]

For L&J

The hud-e I have is made in UK fits into the ODB and does not need a film on the windscreen. When it first came it did not work properly as it only worked when the engine was running. Hud-e had it back for a month to reprogram it and test it for the hybrid. It also shuts down a couple minutes after switch off to conserve batteries. In the light of other experiences that is important as the ODB is always powered up. It has been tested on the Toyota hybrid. I found the programming impossible which is why it went back. I did look at the cheap eBay imports but could not get any assurances as to use on a hybrid and some need splicing into the speedo feed . Do not attempt that. Like I said Toyota could have saved customers all this hasle if they used a bit of common sense

The hud-e can be found on hud-e.com orAAA Security Services Ltd

Mr Ian Burnley
PO BOX 709
Wombwell Barnsley
S73 3BU

Phone number 0845 519 5748
E-mail address sales@hud-e.com

but I could never get through on the phone. If you email them they do phone you back

Regards

Ian