"plate" Mentions

[Sensha]

As a foreigner, I occasionally have trouble with the posted MPG figures before I remember that you operate on imperial gallons, then I feel alright again.

However, one thing that I have yet to figure out is all of this "My car is a 59 Plate" kind of talk. Could one amongst you take your eyes off of Pippa's bum for a minute or so and right out an explanation for us on this side of the pond.

Thanks in advance for any help you can give in this matter.

[FROSTYBALLS]

To enable a new car to be driven on UK roads, it first has to be registered with the Driver & Vehicle Licencing Agency (a Government Agency) and issued a registration number (also known as a registration plate or 'plate').

Without a registration number, a vehicle cannot be taxed (in the UK vehicles are subject to annual car tax ranging from £0 per annum up to £1065 per annum based on engine size, fuel type and CO2 emissions) or insured.

The latest car registration system began from 1st September 2001.

The EU country identifier is optional.

The Area Code identifies which local area the vehicle was first registered within. The first letter of the above registration identifies that it was first registered in Birmingham

The Age identifier - there are two changes per year - 1st September (beginning with 51 from Sept 2001) and 1st March (beginning with 02 from March 2002).

The final three letters are random.

So the Age Identifier runs as follows

Sept 2001 51 March 2002 02

Sept 2002 52 March 2003 03

Sept 2003 53 March 2004 04

Sept 2004 54 March 2005 05

Sept 2005 55 March 2006 06

Sept 2006 56 March 2007 07

Sept 2007 57 March 2008 08

Sept 2008 58 March 2009 09

Sept 2009 59 March 2010 10

Sept 2010 60 March 2011 11

Sept 2011 61 March 2012 12

Sept 2012 62 March 2013 13

Sept 2013 63 etc

So a '59 plate' was first registered between 1st September 2009 and 28th February 2010.

[ianlinux]

In addition to Mike's excellent explanation, I'd like to add this:

It's also a way of the British Establishment to get its subjects (we're not citizens apparently) competing against each other to prop up new car sales.

In France, registrations are, or at least were, solely based on region, whilst newness of vehicles didn't come into it - eminently more sensible if you ask me. (What's the Dutch system like Peter Sweet-Dentist? Just 6 random letters/numbers?)

This newness indicator just prays on people's insecurities about their social and financial status in the hope than John Doe will be annoyed that his neighbour Fred Bloggs has a slightly newer car than him so will hurry out and buy another consumer product he doesn't need when the time comes.

Yes there are placating alternatives like expensive private number plates and Q-plates for kit cars etc, but generally it's about getting us to part with our hard earned

That's my take on it :D

[Red Yaris 54]

In addition to Mike's excellent explanation, I'd like to add this:

It's also a way of the British Establishment to get its subjects (we're not citizens apparently) competing against each other to prop up new car sales.

In France, registrations are, or at least were, solely based on region, whilst newness of vehicles didn't come into it - eminently more sensible if you ask me. (What's the Dutch system like Peter Sweet-Dentist? Just 6 random letters/numbers?)

This newness indicator just prays on people's insecurities about their social and financial status in the hope than John Doe will be annoyed that his neighbour Fred Bloggs has a slightly newer car than him so will hurry out and buy another consumer product he doesn't need when the time comes.

Yes there are placating alternatives like expensive private number plates and Q-plates for kit cars etc, but generally it's about getting us to part with our hard earned

That's my take on it :D

I buy my new cars when I feel the need to replace them......not bothering to wait for the "new" registration numbers :-)

[sweet-dentist]

In Holland..the car gets the numberplate.

Mine is from 2010 and then it was 2numbers - 3 letters - 1 number... Thus my car is 12-ABC-3.

Black figures on a yellow reflecting field.

This has been changed in 2012 I guess, due to not enough numbers.

So the newest cars have 1 number - 3 letters - 2 numbers... Like 1-ABC-34 or so.

A lot of letter combinations are not allowed due to curse and unwanted words. And also the Royalty have there own..

The caravans have there own number-system... not shure what at this moment. But our caravan is like... the old 12-AB-34 type.

Also heavy trailers have there own numbers...like the caravans. Black on yellow field.

Bicycle carriers and light trailers use the same as the pulling car, but the figures are black on a white field.

The blue Euro is on the left of the plate.

The plates stay with the car...even / also when sold... The numberplate is also automatically linked with road tax and service obligations ... to the owner.

Numberplates do get stolen and used for ..."gas and drive" or "hit and run" ... The original owner gets the bill...

My Smart has the plate on the rear like 12-AB-34 , but there is a little number 2 on the side halfway up the plate... meaning this plat has been replaced after being stolen from the car.

Occasionaly the police have road traps... where they automatically scan the car's numberplate and link it to a database of personal things of the owner. Like not paid bills / fines / taxes and the lot... They catch a lot of money...that has to be paid at the spot....

[Parts-King]

In addition to Mike's excellent explanation, I'd like to add this:

It's also a way of the British Establishment to get its subjects (we're not citizens apparently) competing against each other to prop up new car sales.

In France, registrations are, or at least were, solely based on region, whilst newness of vehicles didn't come into it - eminently more sensible if you ask me. (What's the Dutch system like Peter Sweet-Dentist? Just 6 random letters/numbers?)

This newness indicator just prays on people's insecurities about their social and financial status in the hope than John Doe will be annoyed that his neighbour Fred Bloggs has a slightly newer car than him so will hurry out and buy another consumer product he doesn't need when the time comes.

Yes there are placating alternatives like expensive private number plates and Q-plates for kit cars etc, but generally it's about getting us to part with our hard earned

That's my take on it :D

Ive never known anybody spend 15K or more....just to get a newer plate and keep up with the Jones's, thats just silly, people buy new cars for all sorts of reasons, usually because they want to!!

Kingo

[craggle]

I have a personal plate on my car, bought it years ago for £250 and the iQ is now the third car it has been on. Okay, you do need to pay an additional transfer fee but not many people steal or clone personal plates and I can always remember what the registration is when someone asks! :)

Not sure many Q plates get issued these days. Very few kit cars end up with them now, mine is registered based on the age of the donor running gear so it has a 1979 plate.

Craig.

[FROSTYBALLS]

Wish I'd been able to afford a personalised plate that went to auction a while ago - 'FR05TYS'

[craggle]

Any idea what it sold for?

[Parts-King]

Mine name / number DEV11N was up for sale for 15K, it was 5K about 10 years ago

I notice PEN 15 is up for sale............£79,995 PLUS VAT

[FROSTYBALLS]

Can't remember - though I know it was several thousand.

As regards PEN 15, DVLA have been trying to reclaim that since just after it was issued.

[Parts-King]

The boss of Iceland has 1CE on his Bentley....im told he paid £25K at auction very many years ago, he was bidding with Chris Ewbank....Iceland had more cash I suppose

They wont get PEN 15 back without some sort of compo I suspect, I saw SH17 the other day.......another interesting number

[s44gtw]

YET 1,

was for sale for around £50,000, but a Yeti Owner with several Skodas and Fast Nissans made an offer and paid less for it i think.

He has many other interesting and relevant Personal Plates.

He also owns a couple of Citigo, including one almost finished & soon to be revealed, that has aTuned Audi TT engine fitted, AWD included.

george

[ianlinux]

Ive never known anybody spend 15K or more....just to get a newer plate and keep up with the Jones's, thats just silly, people buy new cars for all sorts of reasons, usually because they want to!!

Kingo

Plenty of evidence of a social mobility disease called "affluenza" and the problem of "Status Anxiety". It's the same desire that suggests we'd rather have certain brands of trainer/sneaker, or a house with one more bedroom (at least) than our peers, or the best eduction money can buy etc etc etc:

Here's a broadsheet view

Here's a tabloid view

Here's a psychologists point of view

Here's an economist's POV

Of course everyone is limited by their available funds, and there are various ways of supporting the car manufacturer's participation in the infinite growth model of today's bankrupt economic policies - like 3-year perpetually ongoing Personal Contract Purchases (PCPs) for instance. But why have one or two new car registration periods at all if it wasn't designed to artificially bolster the market somehow? Why not just register a car as and when they become available? And of course, it's not just something an individual can get suckered into, company bosses and fleet managers will all use the "image" a fleet of new cars creates in the minds of people perceivably responsible for the ultimate success of their company. It's all bo**ocks.

People envy their rivals' newer purchases in everything from homes to holidays to salaries, and of course, to cars. That's the way this money market goes round, and even if you don't participate in it directly, the chances are you do in some other form.

It's not rocket science and this guy states it quite eloquently

[Parts-King]

. But why have one or two new car registration periods at all if it wasn't designed to artificially bolster the market somehow?

People envy their rivals' newer purchases in everything from homes, to holidays, to salaries and of course, to cars. That's the way this money market goes round, and even if you don't participate in it directly, the chances are you do in some other form.

That was changed to accomodate the pressure put on factories to supply cars in one massive plates change (what was August) in those days everything was taxed at the local DVLA office, you could send your man to tax cars going out and not see him from morning til night such was the volume of people taxing new cars. Now it is all done in house via AFRL and all the local offices have closed down. It still puts huge pressures on manufacturers and dealers to have two plate change months

There will always be those "with" and "without" money, and those without will always want what they cannot afford, I don't need any Psyco bollards to know that

[craggle]

Psyco bollards, Like these...... :)

[ianlinux]

. But why have one or two new car registration periods at all if it wasn't designed to artificially bolster the market somehow?

People envy their rivals' newer purchases in everything from homes, to holidays, to salaries and of course, to cars. That's the way this money market goes round, and even if you don't participate in it directly, the chances are you do in some other form.

That was changed to accomodate the pressure put on factories to supply cars in one massive plates change (what was August) in those days everything was taxed at the local DVLA office, you could send your man to tax cars going out and not see him from morning til night such was the volume of people taxing new cars. Now it is all done in house via AFRL and all the local offices have closed down. It still puts huge pressures on manufacturers and dealers to have two plate change months

There will always be those "with" and "without" money, and those without will always want what they cannot afford, I don't need any Psyco bollards to know that

It wasn't a question of why the change was made from one to two new car registration periods - I've already alluded to that, or the superficial pressures on parts of the system, but instead why a date-driven market exists at all. The standard UK number plate preys on all the basic instincts of competition and one-upmanship for those susceptible to being played like pawns in the game. Thankfully, there is also an awakening to this institutionalised modus operandi. Hopefully,more and more people will cotton on - much to your advantage King-of-car-parts

Craig - those bollards are evil :D

[FROSTYBALLS]

The reason the age identifier was first introduced was because the previous system was running out of number combinations.

Before 1963 some councils (who were then responsible for issuing registration numbers) were running out of numbers to issue with the current system of three letters and three numbers. The age identifier was then introduced by these councils - ending up with a system using three letters, three numbers and one letter (the age identifier being the suffix).

In 1965 the age identifier was made compulsory for all new registrations - and this was from the suffix 'C'.

By 1982 the system was again running out of numbers to issue. So registrations were changed to the age identifier becoming a prefix, three numbers and three letters.

In 1999, the Government took the decision to have two changes in each year to the age identifier - to help the motor industry get rid of the single peak in new car sales in August of each year. So the prefix V ran from 1st September 1999 to 29th February 2000, W from 1st March 2000 to 31st August 2000, X from 1st September 2001 to 28th February 2001, and Y from 1st March 2001 to 31st August 2001.

In 2001, again the system was running out of numbers to issue, and the current system using two letters (Area Identifier) two numbers (Age Identifer), and three random letters was introduced from 1st September 2001. This system retained the two change points in each year (1st March and 1st September).

Conceivably when the current system needs to be changed, it could be reversed - and changed to three random letters, two numbers (Age Identifier) and two letters (Area Identifier)

[Sensha]

Good God! I had no idea that it was this big nest of worms. It's about as bad as our vanity plate scheme over here, where people try to spell out cuteness and obscure terms and various vulgarities.

I have ended up with disabled veteran plates, since they get you into municipal parking for free and on the toll roads for free. Other than that, I've only ever taken the luck of the draw.

The vanity plates here can run a thousand bucks for a three year span...no auctions, though.

[ianlinux]

Not only do they "play" people against each other here in the UK with material possessions, but they buy potential dissent by giving out medals (New Year Honours and Queen's "Birthday") and all done in the name of a fictitious "empire". And we Brits seem to perpetually buy into this joke. Bizarre!

It can get very shallow. :D

[Parts-King]

It can get very shallow. :D

Nuff said ;)

[ianlinux]

It can get very shallow. :D

Nuff said ;)

Oh woooooow. That clearly wins the argument.

I bow to your intellectual superiority

Yawn

[Parts-King]

It can get very shallow. :D

I bow to your intellectual superiority

I should think so too

[FROSTYBALLS]

At the end of the day the introduction of the year identifier had nothing to do with sales, etc - it was a simple and cheap method to modify the existing system of car registration to generate a fresh supply of numbers that Local Government, and later National Government, could use.

Each of the suffix and prefix systems lasted for 17 years.

A side benefit was that it provided an easy, though not infallible, way to judge a vehicle's age.

The fact that the system was, in time, used (and some would say abused) by both the motor industry and by individuals to generate sales and display a questionable degree of affluence is just a consequence.

Think we've gone far enough with this topic - needs to be locked.

[ianlinux]

At the end of the day the introduction of the year identifier had nothing to do with sales, etc - .

The fact that the system was, in time, used (and some would say abused) by both the motor industry and by individuals to generate sales and display a questionable degree of affluence is just a consequence.

Think we've gone far enough with this topic - needs to be locked.

So you sort of agree with me Mike. The point is, the UK govt had an opportunity to change the system in favour of a more responsible and mature approach all-round after the last X-plate. It's all very well insisting that the introduction of the age plate in the 60s was coincidental - and I completely agree it might have been, but that doesn't stop the notion of any subsequent abuse later as you appear to agree.

Here's a quote from the insurance industry last year sort of hoisting itself by its own petard:

"The motoring industry is hoping the introduction of new number plates [re new 12-plate] will boost car sales."

As I see it, and with a plethora of evidence to support me, the single registration period pre-2000/1 and the subsequent biannual registration periods have been used to exploit our vanity. Of course we can argue that there are some industry benefits, but pros and cons come with any argument pertaining to charges of manipulation, and I perceive that many of us - especially those on car forums like this, tend to think pragmatically and about the technology itself, rather than the superficial aspects, of car buying and ownership.

We also know for instance, about manipulation of the masses. The banking institutions have done it to us for years, and you only have to look at the clearing system where our salaries and transfers for x-amount of days are simply taken from us in order to manipulate the markets so it can be gambled on. None of this is rocket science!!!

And Mike, it's fine to issue edicts and suggest a thread should be closed if it REALLY gets out of hand, but if contributors issue snide side-swipes at other individuals who are only offering their opinion in trying to help others see the system for what it is, then they have a right to come back at them.

We should all respect each other's opinions and respectfully disagree with appropriately cited arguments, not go on a bullying spree.

Happy New Year one and all in the arbitrary "Year of our Lord" 2014 :D