Blue Smoke 2011 Avensis 2.0 Diesel

[mo]

Hi Mel

I have re programmed the ecu but it still smoke. I don't know what to do with 5th injector because it is very expensive part to replace. I have already fitted egr valve and re programmed ecu. Any help please.

[Heidfirst]

3 hours ago, yossarian247 said:

Hi,

I had been under the impression that the 2.0 D4D engine doesn't have a fifth injector anyway. I thought it was just the 2.2 that had it, or is that not the case on later models?

there was a D-CAT version of the 2.0 available even on the T25 although I don't think that too many came to the UK. The D-CAT I believe differs though from the more conventional ly DPF-equipped later version. & of course not all 2.2s had DPFs.

 

10 hours ago, Mel Tinys Taxis said:

 

Sorry I can’t help any more and can only hope Toyota put a bit more effort into solving this fault or maybe it’s time we looked to changing Manufacturers though if you want to stick with the Avensis you wont be able to much longer as they have announced that they will not be replacing the current Avensis when production run ends.

 

 the current (mid-2015>) 2.0 diesel is a different engine entirely - it's BMW-derived.

2 hours ago, Mel Tinys Taxis said:

Hi Yossarian,

I believe some early 2.0Ltr  D4D T27 to around late 2010 (60 Reg) did not have a 5th injector but I also believe most from early 2010 have the 5th injector anyway certainly all but one of mine have them fitted, sorry cannot comment on the 2.2 as I have none with this engine because I deliberately avoided them as I knew they had DPFs fitted so would not buy them, unfortunately at the time I was not aware that Toyota had started to fit DPFs to the 2010 on cars but would have still bought them as there was no Diesel alternative a fancied buying at that time.

Best regards,

Mel.

afaik all T27s made after September 2009 have DPFs fitted irrespective of 2.0 or 2.2 - they needed to in order to comply with Euro V as did every other manufacturer. Not sure about before then.

[Mel Tinys Taxis]

5 hours ago, mo said:

Hi Mel

I have re programmed the ecu but it still smoke. I don't know what to do with 5th injector because it is very expensive part to replace. I have already fitted egr valve and re programmed ecu. Any help please.

Hi Mo,

I posted  on the 15th of April AND today the latest answers I have to date, I assume you have not tried blocking off the fuel feed to the 5th injector if not why not as it is really very simple to do and cost virtually nothing, SORRY I have nothing to add that I have not already posted on this Forum and it will be the very first place I will shout it from if I have any more help to give or if I ever find a proper cure.

Best Regards,

Mel. 

[Mel Tinys Taxis]

5 hours ago, Heidfirst said:

there was a D-CAT version of the 2.0 available even on the T25 although I don't think that too many came to the UK. The D-CAT I believe differs though from the more conventional ly DPF-equipped later version. & of course not all 2.2s had DPFs.

 

 the current (mid-2015>) 2.0 diesel is a different engine entirely - it's BMW-derived.

afaik all T27s made after September 2009 have DPFs fitted irrespective of 2.0 or 2.2 - they needed to in order to comply with Euro V as did every other manufacturer. Not sure about before then.

Thanks for info  Heidfirst I suspected it was around 2010 they started fitting them to the 2.0 Litres though I have one registered April 2010 without 5th injector but assume it was built in September 2009 or even earlier and just not registered until April 2010.

Cheers Mel.

Edited April 18, 2016 by Mel Tinys Taxis
spelling misstake

[mo]

I have updated ECU but no cure for smoke problem. if you have any cure please let me know.

 

[frankie406]

Blow by from crankcase? Is it definitely blue smoke?

[Mel Tinys Taxis]

11 hours ago, mo said:

I have updated ECU but no cure for smoke problem. if you have any cure please let me know.

 

Mo, I take it you still have not done the other things already suggested !! Do the 5th Injector Bypass its a simple cheap job and has not harmed any of the four cars we have bypassed to date plus if that does not work simply convert it back, Then I think you may then be looking at a duff injector.

 Assuming of course that you are not burning Oil which is a totally different ball game and to date none of our cars have suffered oil burning.

 Best Regards,  Mel.

[Mel Tinys Taxis]

 

PLEASE, PLEASE DO READ ALL PAGES OF THIS FORUM SUBJECT BEFORE CONTACTING ME

 

Because I have already posted Everything on this Forum including the Word Document though I have just added a footnote and  re attached  but it ONLY CONFIRMS what I have already posted sorry this will be the VERY LAST email I will respond to that asks the same questions that have already been answered as I have not got the time to keep repeating what is posted SORRY but to date I have nothing more to add BUT if or when I get to know of a better or better still a permanent cure then I will post it on this Forum.

 

1a Smoking Avensis 02 Sep 2015 -26 Jan 2016.docx 

 

Wynns Professional DPF Diesel Particulate Filter Regenerator Cleaner Fluid 28392 £9.00 Sep 2015.pdf 

 

Best Regards,

 

Mel.

[Jawal]

I'm not adding much here, but mine has exactly the same symptoms they have eased off now it's hotter though. When I took it to Toyota for a service though they looked at the engine bay and said that they thought the head gasket was going so I left and went to a local mechanic who said it looked fine. Interestingly there's a company who will do a complete engine strip and rebuild for £1500... I have to say I'm tempted it seems like all of the problems with the engine are related to it getting clogged with soot and a good clean surely has to help. 

[Mel Tinys Taxis]

Hi jack, DO READ my last attachment and at LEAST TRY blocking the fuel feed to the fifth Injector it's a simple cheap job and must be worth a try because if it does not cure it just convert it back I have only had one car start to smoke again after this mod and that even stopped on it's own accord so I suspect an intermittent Injector.

As for getting a complete rebuild for £1,500 I would say TAKE EXTREEM CARE as there are a lot of con artist in the Engine Rebuild market and you will have to pay a fair bit more than that to get a really good quality guaranteed rebuilt engine fitted, personally I would prefer a second hand engine with good documented history.

AS for a rebuilt one do research the company you choose to use via Google and Trust Pilot etcetera looking especially for unhappy customers if they have masses of good feedback and just a few bad ones then they maybe ok especially if the bad feedbacks do seem unreasonable.

Best of luck,  Mel.

[Jawal]

The company is called remanufactured engines. Co. Uk. The work has a 12 month warranty apparently... I'll look into them before I go ahead. Cheers for the advice. 

[Mel Tinys Taxis]

That's one I personally would not use but you do your own research you may like to start with attached link, if you go down the second hand engine route make sure you research the Breaker you choose too as I have had experiences with Excellent Very Good and  outright rogues too. 

http://www.rac.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?11016-reconditioned-engines-co-uk-aka-brentsouth-trading-aka-heathrow-engines-DO-NOT-USE      

For second hand Engines I suggest you use the Part Finder Sites listed below, this way you should get LOTS to choose from then you makes your choice and pays Yer money,

But make sure you pay by credit card also whatever you go for  as it gives you extra protection.

https://www.1stchoice.co.uk       https://www.breakerlink.com       http://www.breakeryard.com      http://www.find-a-part.com/       http://www.partsgateway.co.uk 

Wishing you the very best of luck and do please let us all know how you get on do try the 5th injector bypass first as you have nothing to loose and an absolute fortune to save !!!

jack I Just Noticed Looks like your Car is a 2007 T180 and I don't believe they even have the 5th Injector or suffer the same Smoke problem  as the T27 but will leave my post as the other advice is still relevant though may be more useful copied elsewhere on the Forum where members are considering having engines rebuilt   (Mr Administrator please can you help here)

Mel.

Edited July 13, 2016 by Mel Tinys Taxis
Needed changing as Jacks car is not a T27

[Jawal]

That's interesting. It is indeed the t25. The symptoms described are identical though.

And you're right, I did a bit of investigation and realised that the engine place are the very same company... I'll steer clear. Cheers! 

[Heidfirst]

1 hour ago, Mel Tinys Taxis said:

 

Jack I Just Noticed Looks like your Car is a 2007 T180 and I don't believe they even have the 5th Injector or suffer the same Smoke problem  as the T27 but will leave my post as the other advice is still relevant though may be more useful copied elsewhere on the Forum where members are considering having engines rebuilt   (Mr Administrator please can you help here)

Mel.

T180s/D-CATs have a DPNR which has a 5th injector but afaik it's a more complex system & fitted nearer the manifold than the more conventional DPF fitted to the 2.0 2010>.

Hopefully Devon Aygo can confirm or elucidate.

[Mel Tinys Taxis]

The Final Chapter or IS IT !!!

 

Hello Mel

I have been following thread on toyota avensis forum and with your experience I have updated ECU but no cure for smoke and like to know where to buy 5th injector.

Thanks.  Mo

 

Hi Mo

You can buy from eBay but replacing it probably won't cure it, we don't bother replacing 5th injectors anymore and just bypass them if that does notwork then I expect you will be looking at replacing one of the main injectors.

I doubt you have followed all the Forum advice because had you blocked off or bypassed the 5th injector you would be telling me you know that is the problem but it appears to me it's just the next thing you want to try.

I have cured all mine eventually if none of the earlier fixes cure excess smoking or cures it and problem returns then after following ALL the steps given on the Forums replacing a faulty main Injector has always worked for us, don't ask me how to go about finding the faulty Injector as it often comes down to trial and error, try buying a good used one or a O.E.M new one from one of the aftermarket specialist then swap it with the suspect one and repeat until you win !! I'm sure there are tricks of the Trade to assist finding the faulty one but you will have entrust to a professional as I do not feel able to give adequate guidance here.

As for changing them they can be real B#@$tards to get out and best done when engine is hot, we had to invest in a special tool part of which is a 8 Kilo Slide Hammer for which you have to remove the bonnet to get the clearance requred to use it, so not a job for D.I.Y unless you are lucky as sometimes they just pop straight out.

Best of luck,

Mel.

-----Original Message-----
From: Mohammed Latif
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2016 9:07 PM
To: mel@tinystaxis.co.uk
Cc: Mohammed Latif
Subject: Avensis Smoke problem

 

Edited February 24, 2017 by Mel Tinys Taxis
To put mistake right

[Mr.D]

Hi guys,

   I can't comment on the problem itself, but finding bad injector is easier if you have toyota TIS on hands and cable. It can be Chinese version, that works too. You just need to connect your engine while it is runing, scan it for errors, if nothing, go to engine live data sheet, search for Injector compensation ratio, there has to be 4 lines ( 1 per injector) and look for values higher than +2, or lower than -2. Then you can go to live engine managment and there is a function to cut off the injector one by one (stop injecting fuel). This way is good, because in theory, if injector is working well, then by cutting it of you will notice shaky engine, this is because balance of the power in pairs of cylinders are not equal. But the thing you are looking for is if after cutting injector off it makes engine shake, but if it shakes less than cutting off the other injectors, then this one is most probably bad one and you can start with the one that has most negative or most possitive compensation ratio. This is because it doesn't do a good job already hence engine is shaky already or blue smoke appears, after cutting it off it get's worse, but not as bad as cutting off a good injector. Although this might not be 100% accurate, but in comparison this is around 15min play with computer versus hours to get at least 1 injector out.

[Mel Tinys Taxis]

Cheers Mr D,

I assume our local Toyota main Dealer must have this Kit but they could not locate a faulty injector and said everything was working to spec and sugested trying a 5th injector which we already had so we fixed with the trial and error method I will ask my Son about the " Toyota TIS on hands and cable. It can be Chinese version" we already have a Smart Evolution MaxiSys that cost us around  £2,500 don't know if that can be adapted but suspect not and will look into what you have said, can you advise where I can buy a Chinese version as I suspect the Toyota one will be either cost prohibitive or dealer only.

Many thanks,

Mel.

[Mr.D]

Hi Mel,

   Well local Dealer has the real thing, while this chinese version can be found here.IT is cable with CD ( with TIS on it) included in this link or similar:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/MINI-VCI-FOR-TOYOTA-TIS-Techstream-V10-00-028-Single-Cable-J2534-OBD2-MINIVCI-/301762873337?hash=item46427807f9:g:gu0AAOSwOyJX-0es&item=301762873337&vxp=mtr

  However if you have Smart Evolution diagnostics tool, i think it should be able to do the job even better, because this chinese version is slower to respond in comunication with car ( due to cheap chip in it) and has restricted access to cars control modules. Also if problem is 5th injector, then what i suggested before with injector cut-off will not work, as you can't disconnect 5th injector and moreover it does not influence ignition quality and how smooth engine is working.

[Mel Tinys Taxis]

Cheers D,

Discussed with my Son and he said he has the kit, but as is often the case with “intermittent faults” this time excess smoke the fault does not show up on test though it can still give a little guidance hence the trial and error approach though He normally gets it right first attempt after his checks but sometimes it's second attempt.

Again many thanks for your guidance.

Best regards, Mel

 

[Alan1234]

Hi can I ask what sort of miles you have on these taxi's and are they run mainly round town . Taxi drivers do tend to short shift just above tickover and sit there idling a lot never wanting to switch off ?.

[Mel Tinys Taxis]

Cheers D,

Discussed with my Son and he said he has the kit, but as is often the case with “intermittent faults” this time excess smoke the fault does not show up on test though it can still give a little guidance hence the trial and error approach though He normally gets it right first attempt after his checks but sometimes it's second attempt.

Again many thanks for your guidance.

Best regards, Mel

 

[Mel Tinys Taxis]

 UPDATE 18 Jan 2018

I now recommend fitting one of these cost £69.00

 

FAP DPF Emulator for TOYOTA D4D, DCAT *** CAN BUS version        

eBay item number 122289701127

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FAP-DPF-Emulator-for-TOYOTA-D4D-DCAT-CAN-BUS-version/122289701127?hash=item1c7908c107:g:Th0AAOSwRLZUEVaf

 

II have listed their claims below note units do take around two weeks to arrive, I confirm that we have fitted five to date and not had one issue plus I’m delighted to say that NONE of our fourteen Avensis currently smoke therefore I have no hesitation in recommending these units though I have not actually noticed any better fuel consumption but to be honest I not have I done any before and after checks of consumptions.

 

Their notes copied from eBay

 

GUARANTEE:

• no more dpf diesel particulate filter problems
• better fuel consumption
• no white smoke
• no warning light (regarding DPF FAP filter)
• no more regeneration
• Lifetime warranty

Technical support and installation instructions sent by email.

 

This device have a waterproof design - can be mounted under the engine bonnet.

We recommend to make installation of this device for qualified specialist only.

 

 

Back to Me

 

Fitting his unit cured smoking problem including the ones that were fixed using the other methods I have listed on the forums that had started smoking again.

 

Point to note is that THREE lots of wiring diagrams are included with kit make sure whoever fits kit picks the right one for the age / model of your Avensis.

 

If you go down this route NOTE you do not have to block or Blank off the fifth injector in fact the supplier recommends that you leave it in place some wires to the ECU and fifth injector have to be cut bypassing various measurements making this a job not for the none confident so I would suggest fitting is best left to a competent auto electrician.

 

NOTE THIS WILL NOT fix faulty injectors so if that’s your issue you will still need to sort that.

 

 

If you try this PLEASE Re Post and let us all know how you get on as I have not had one fail to cure problem yet.

 

Best regards,

 

Mel.

 

 

Hope this helps anyone still having problems.

 

BUT PLEASE DO NOT contact me if the advice on the Forums or this document do not fix your problem as to date I have nothing more I can add

 

Best Regards,

 

Mel.

 

17 Jan 2018

 

 

z99Smoking Avensis 02 Sep 2015 -17 Jan 2018.docx

[Husbandofstinky]

Mel

You are a legend. Top  posting and a sticky well deserved.

Going to add a Wynns as part of the regular routine now (once a year). Don't worry not wasting it on the old Avensis - just the Superb.

I saw your review of the product on eBay and would mention that this is what forums are all about. 

 

[Mel Tinys Taxis]

Darren Hi mel like yourself have toyota avensis as taxis..car runs great until dpf packed in garage fitted genuine toyota dpf got car back running chattery and blue/grey smoke every now again when car getting to temperature..had a new injector in..car still run same ..toyota checked all injectors ..all software update cant find fault no codes..where is this 5th injector on avensis? do you no please? Darren.

Darren seems to have started a another post / Link on this so I have copied it here as I am not going to contribute to both !  https://www.toyotaownersclub.com/messenger/108634/

 

Hi Darren,

All my experience on the 5th injector located on the nearside of the engine  at the rear 

has been posted in Blue Smoke 2011 Avensis 2.0 Diesel By Richard Mapperley, June 30, 2014 in Avensis Club 

I reccomend you go to this link Last page posted on the 17th of Jan 2018 and fit the £69  FAP DPF Emulator this has the best sucess rate in my experience

Best of luck.  Mel. 

 

Darren Thanks Mel going to try the 5th injector route first has car seems to be overfuelling then give this a go if replacing 5th injector doesnt work..i need to get a part number for this 5th injector and find out where exactly it is on car to remove and get number along the side of it,,,Thank you so much for your time.  Darren.

 

 

Hi Darren,

NOT the route I would go as changing it very rarely works and they are buggers to get at, you cannot even see it without removing parts.

After you have removed the air filter you will see the thin rubber hose the Injector you are looking for is STILL OUT OF SIGHT at the bottom end of that hose and very expensive from Toyota

Fit the £69.00   FAP DPF Emulator  it's a cheaper, easier AND quicker option has worked for the five we have fitted

All the Best,  Mel.

 

Fifth Injector feeds extra fuel to clean the DPF, the latest one has violet Plug (These Injectors  are used on petrol vehicles)

           Cost £874 plus vat in 2014     part number 23710-26012  

 Ebay £38.00 to £199.99  http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-GENUINE-LEXUS-IS-220-250-350-AVENSIS-AURIS-RAV4-5TH-INJECTOR-23710-26012/222682907488?epid=648190439&hash=item33d8ef8360:g:hugAAOSw4PxZ52r-

Thanks Mel..ordered that Emulator now..nothing to lose..thank you so much for your help on this matter

 

Darren Thanks Mel..ordered that Emulator now..nothing to lose..thank you so much for your help on this matter.

Hi Mel

emulator delivered just had it fitted today hasnt smoked yet just wondering has the guy that fitted it for me asked if i was getting the DPF insides cut out? Does this have to happen with these emulators and is this whaat youve had done? Just curious has never thought about this,, Darren

HI Darren,

Thank you for letting us know it worked for you too as no one else other than myself has posted a success with these units, take and not give EH !

NO DO NOT modify the DPF but I do strongly recomend that you add the Wynn’s Diesel Particulate Filter Regenerator detailed earlier in my posts every four months PLUS make sure the E.G.R Valve is thoroughly cleaned every 40k as this also turned out to the cure on one of our vehicles that I thought my son had fitted the elimintor to but had not.

Please do keep the Forum updated if you have anymore to add.

Best regards,

Mel.       The links above to my Word Document no longer work so I have re attached here and hope it will work this time.  

z99 Smoking Avensis 02 Sep 2015 -12 Mar 2018.docxz99 Smoking Avensis 02 Sep 2015 -12 Mar 2018.docx   

If these links do not work either then for a while I will email copies but not inefinately.

1a Smoking Avensis 02 Sep 2015 -26 Jan 2016.docxz99 Smoking Avensis 02 Sep 2015 -12 Mar 2018.docx 

[BigGavensisd4d]

Am glad have seen this topic raised here as having the same probs with my 2012 d4d TR and to date nobody has the fix?!?

Been down the cataclean fuel cleaner, cleaned EGR, replaced fuel filter, Terraclean carbon cleaned the engine too but still excessive white smoke after a few hours of continous driving in town.

Mr T had it in for diagnostic check other day too, def and egr not blocked and got latest ECU software too, couldn’t find any faults.

So now thinking its 5th injector or head gasket problem as white grey smoke intermittent still happening after few hours driving.

Have these Emulators worked ok??

Any update would be great!?