Sad Farewell To My Rav

[mudinuri]

It is with a heavy heart I have decided to sell the 1998 RAV, 3 Door Petrol in brilliant red which I bought in November 2013.

Having checked the figures over the past 4 months I am only getting 20-22 MPG and as an OAP I can ill afford to keep on running it.

It will be a sad farewell to this car because I really do enjoy driving it and love the look of it.

What I would appreciate is a ball park figure that I could advertise it for.

It has only 110000 miles on the clock, MOT/TAX end November 2014, immaculate inside and out with no major dents or scratches on the paint work. If I could improve the MPG I would probably keep it, but after reading threads on this site it looks like 25+ is the max I could reasonablty expect from this engine.

Any help or advice would really be appreciated.

thanks

[gjnorthall]

How many miles per annum do you cover? What's the minimum average MPG you could tolerate from a car?

[ferret51]

I'm in very much the same position as mudinuri with my 2003 auto,I love driving the car and being disabled it's so easy to get in and out of plus I've spent loads on it in extras and a left foot throttle but it is very thirsty,problem is what to have next that does what I want,looks ok,easy to get in and out of and is realiable and reasonable performance in the 2-3k price range ?.apart from the fuel the Rav ticks all boxes..

Les

[mudinuri]

Hi Gjnorthall,

I usually cover between 5 and 10 thousand miles per year.

My previous 3 cars were all LandRover Freelander TD4, 2 were Automatic and the other a Manual and all of them returned anything from 25 to 40 mpg which before I retired seemed acceptable. Now I"m retired and living on a very tight budget I need something which will give me a similar mpg, but preferably not a LandRover as I did have problems with all of them. I have driven 4x4 for the past 20 or so years as my Wife has a back problem and finds it difficult to get into and out of normal cars, so my next car will also have to be a 4x4.

I really like the RAV and have considered having LPG fitted, but the cost outstrips the benefits.

So unless there is a magic cure for the terrible mpg I am getting from my RAV, then it hurts to me say, it will have to go!

[gjnorthall]

I might look at things in a different way. You say your Rav is a nice one and it suits your purposes - yet it's worth only around £1000 if you sell it. It's rate of depreciation is now pretty insignificant compared to a recent RAV which is probably depreciating at around £2000 per annum. At 5 k miles per year, you're spending say £300 per annum more on petrol than a car averaging 35MPG (assuming 25MPG for your Rav). To me - this is a modest cost compared to the costs of changing your car etc etc. You should be able to do a bit better than your 20 - 22MPG - I had a 1998 5 door which averaged around 27MPG provided you didn't hammer it.

If your wife has difficulty with normal cars then there are a whole range of options - do you really need a 4 wheel drive? What abut something like an older Nissan Quashqai - this is quite elevated and the 1.6 petrol will average around 38MPG.

If it's a 4x4 with decent MPG you want, then there are several options including a Rav 4.2 diesel but it will take some time to recover the additional outlay. The pre 2006 Suzuki Vitara are a decent car in 3 and 5 door versions. The diesel is woeful but the 1.6 petrol is OK and will return mid 30's MPG. Again it would take quite a while to recover the outlay.

[mudinuri]

Hi again,

I agree with everything you say, but I still need more MPG which I would hope I could get from the RAV. If I could get 27 average that would probably suit me. But!!! I am no mechanic and when other members suggest cleaning the "Air Flow Meter" the Haynes manual doesn"t even mention an Airflow meter, so I have no idea where it is, or what it looks like. I have tried looking it up on the Forums, but the photos I have seen show no resemblance to my engine.

Again, any help or advice would be appreciated.

Thanks

David

[gjnorthall]

There's nothing really complex about ensuring that an engine is in efficient fettle. Firstly, assuming the engine is in a reasonable mechanical state, you need to ensure that the basics are correct - ie condition of plugs, air and fuel filters, correct level and grade of oil, absence of displayed fault codes, correct engine running temperature and a check on external factors eg binding brakes, wrong tyre pressures. A dose of fuel injector cleaner may well improve atomisation of fuel.

Once you get past the basics, the MAFF airflow meter and the Lambda sensor can affect fuel consumption - the latter especially at steady throttle cruising. An exhaust gas analysis will give an indication of scope for improvement and is a worthwhile modest investment. The modulation and response of the Lambda is easily checked at the same time. The MAFF simply pokes into the induction pipework (electrical connector on it's head) and it's a case of removing the unit and checking the hotwire filament - it's often possible to see that it's encrusted. It can be cleaned with MAFF or electrical cleaner and in bad cases, it's best replaced. A dirty MAFF weakens the fuel mixture which reduces power output and increases fuel consumption.

[mudinuri]

Hi once again.

Sorry to be such a pain, but could somebody try to point me in the right direction regarding the "Air Flow Meter".

I have enclosed a photo of the engine. Is it the smallish connector near the bulk head which is attached with 2 fairly inaccessable screws or is the much larger black plastic box attached to the inlet pipe next to the air filter box?

Didn"t I tell you I know nothing.

thanks

[crofter]

PM sent.

I also have considered this problem of the low mpg returns and after much thought decided that taking into account the extra outlay that will be incurred changing motors and if buying used will I be paying out more on it?

Add to that my motor definitely ticks all my boxes now so I think using that extra outlay gradually in the future in the fuel tank is the way forward for me now.

Maybe a little bit of the saying "we oldies don't like change" has crept in here but I don't think so. The old grey matter still has a daily workout and no-one has said yet they can hear the gears going around.

Del

[mudinuri]

Hi again,

after much deliberations, I have also decided to keep the RAV and put up with the MPG until I can find the bl##dy Air Flow Meter.

We"ve decided to spend the money I would have spent on changing the car on a holiday. I"ll rephrase that. My Wife has decided to spend the money on a holiday and she has kindly invited me along.

But seriously chaps, I still can"t fathom out which is the elusive Airflow meter! It"s not as I have been advised on any Hose that comes from the Air Filter housing, so where else could it be?

Any help very much appreciated.

Cheers

[Raistlin]

Excellent idea about the holiday,

why not pop along to Mr T and ask one of his minions for a bit of help.

I'm sure they would be only too happy to assist.

[gjnorthall]

As soon as I looked at your picture - I knew it was pointless trying to identify the MAF since it doesn't have one! Apologies for misleading - I was thinking 4.2 rather than 4.1! The fuelling on your model Rav is controlled by a MAP sensor (manifold absolute pressure sensor) not a MAF. The manifold pressure is a measure of engine load and the ECU uses the value to set the fuelling and ignition timing. With age these MAP sensors go adrift and affect economy and performance and in some cases cause hesitation etc. Only in extreme failure mode will the MAP cause the engine warning lamp to illuminate. It's easy to spot a duff MAP with exhaust gas analysis but given the cost of the unit, it's probably just worth replacing. Last time I bought one, which was a while back - an Intermotor equivalent was about £30.

Looking at your photo again reminds me that there are numerous small bore vacuum type hoses on this engine - associated with emission control systems. These are notorious, after a few years use, of failing resulting in air ingress which upsets mixture control. They often fail by splitting at the ends where they're pushed over ferrules. It's worth spending a bit of time checking the integrity of these hoses. If any ends are suspect, you can usually snip off the minimum amount and refit the hose. Otherwise buy a meter or so of the correct bore vacuum hose and cut to the required length.

[mudinuri]

Hi.

Thanks once again everyone for your advice.

But could you tell me where the MAP should be and does it have the same wire system as the MAF?

Cheers

[crofter]

Is there a unit bolted on to the bulkhead with an electrical connector and two small hoses running to it.That could be it

Del

[gjnorthall]

It's mounted on a bracket on the bulkhead - it has one vacuum pipe connection and an electrical connector. Unfortunately on the 4.1 theres a plethora of other equipment in this area which relates to the EGR system. It's a sealed unit - not much you can do to it hence my suggestion to replace. A MAF measures airflow by measuring the change in resistance of a heated wire. A MAP measure pressure / vacuum - a diaphragm moves a finger over a resistance coil giving a voltage output which is a function of pressure.

[mudinuri]

Hi all,

Special thanks to everyone who has given me useful advice.

You"ll be glad to hear I now know where the MAP is located, the only problem now, is, What do I do with it!

I understand that you cannot clean them, so do I replace it with a new one and hope that improves the MPG figure, and if so where do I get one from? or do I get the whole system checked out.? I would prefer if I could, not to have to fork out my cash for a garage to check it out.

What do you think?

Where would a useless individual like me be without the advice of helpful member of TOC.

Thanks all.

David

[gjnorthall]

This particular MAP is a sealed unit and there's little more that can be done other than checking the security of the integrity of the inlet hose and plug in connector. There are some simple tests that can be done but you'd need some equipment and specifications to check the calibration. You'll find methods of basic checking a 3 pin MAP if you Google. The part number is 89420-42010 but I suspect it will be mega money from Toyota. Check with an auto electrical factor for an aftermarket equivalent - last one I bought was Intermotor.