First Service- Garage Uses 5W 30- Should I Try To Get 0W 20?

[Chris Dance]

Ever since owning Gen3 Prius cars I have insisted that only OW20 is used at the servicing. The service chap informed me at our cars last service that they have instruction that only OW20 is to be used. It must be an instruction from their head office!!

[TomdeGuerre]

Wish I knew of these Toyota dealers who use 5W 30 oil, that's my preferred grade but when I asked for it they told me all they have is the 0W 20.

Has there ever been any credible study done to prove that the difference in fuel consumption is of any real significance? In real world conditions I doubt it very much. Also if dealers are insisting on using the 0W 20 then Toyota needs to alter the chart in the owners handbook to eliminate the "heavier" grade.

[RelaxedDrive]

> Has there ever been any credible study done to prove that the difference in fuel consumption is of any real significance?

All I can say is we noticed it pretty quickly, based on how often the car is filled up.

My gen 2 prius has got 60mpg(measured tank to tank) most of the summer; seems like the Yaris is not on a par with it frankly.

I did notice in the Yaris manual that it said if the dealer uses 5w30 they should then use 0w20 at the next service! Seems like a pretty clear directive to me that you should not keep 5w30 in it. Preferred or not!

We will ask for this oil in future services as suggested to hopefully prevent issues. (I had assumed that as the engine is basically the same as the gen 2(1.5l), the oil would be the same, so didn't question it at the time!)

> The dealer has used a suitable oil (5W-30), but not Toyota's preferred oil (0W-20).

Yes, I saw that after I posted, thanks. I think it's a bit criminal to sell a car based on an mpg sticker, then change the spec afterwards during servicing!

I wonder if Lexus owners have similar problems?

That 'cheap' Tesla can't come quickly enough frankly!

[FROSTYBALLS]

> The dealer has used a suitable oil (5W-30), but not Toyota's preferred oil (0W-20).

Yes, I saw that after I posted, thanks. I think it's a bit criminal to sell a car based on an mpg sticker, then change the spec afterwards during servicing!

No-one has changed the spec. Toyota's 'preference' for 0W-20 has been in place since the introduction of their Optimal Drive technology across a range of cars in late 2008. My 2009 Auris 1.33 had the same preference for 0W-20, and the same statement that 5W-30 could be used. Commonly dealers in my area used 5W-30, but before each service was undertaken, I stipulated I wanted 0W-20 used.

[RelaxedDrive]

Ok, but the number one attribute of the car has been temporarily impaired because:

1) The model will have had it's fuel efficiency officially rated with 0w20 and that was reflected on the spec sheet in the showroom.

2) The car would have been originally supplied with 0w20.

Whereas, our car no longer matches that specification.

Anyway, lesson learnt I guess!

[FROSTYBALLS]

.... and the official EU fuel consumption tests are undertaken in laboratory conditions and are difficult for owners to replicate in the 'real world'.

[YarisHybrid2016]

IMHO if the manufacturer sees fit to build a car and use certain lubricants, unless they are specifically for the purpose of "running in", then the car should be serviced with equivalent lubricants without any need to specifically request it.

If I go to a Toyota main dealer for service, I'd expect them to use the "preferred" lubricants, and not just anything because it is cheaper for them! i.e. I would expect them to use 0w20 engine oil without asking.

[johalareewi]

.... and the official EU fuel consumption tests are undertaken in laboratory conditions and are difficult for owners to replicate in the 'real world'.

Although it is possible replicate them in a Toyota hybrid.

Have a look on fuelly.com to see the real world hybrid mpgs and compare them with the official figures.

[Duffryn]

IMHO if the manufacturer sees fit to build a car and use certain lubricants, unless they are specifically for the purpose of "running in", then the car should be serviced with equivalent lubricants without any need to specifically request it.

If I go to a Toyota main dealer for service, I'd expect them to use the "preferred" lubricants, and not just anything because it is cheaper for them! i.e. I would expect them to use 0w20 engine oil without asking.

Just out of interest can one tell what oil has been used anyway, apart obviously from the paperwork supplied? Is there any visual or tactile difference readily apparent to the layman?

[johalareewi]

With regards to 0w20 vs 5w30 oil.

The gen1 and gen2 Prius use 5w30 as standard.

When the gen3 prius came along, it used 0w20 as standard (as do the later hybrids and some non hybrids AFAIK).

This caused a bit of confusion at the time...

After the 'wrong oil' saga, MrT confirmed that 5w30 was the oil for gen1 and gen2 Prius, and 0w20 for the gen3.

However MrT also said that using 5w30 oil at the service instead of 0w20 would not void the manufacturers warranty.

This meant fleet owners (and others) could still cut servicing costs by using the cheaper oil.

In the gen3 Prius owners manual it says the oil to use is 0w20.

If you need to top up between services, you can use 5w30 but it must be replaced with 0w20 at the next service.

At the end of the day, you pays your money and takes your choice.

Cheaper 5w30 oil, but buy more petrol and get lumpy performance, or more expensive 0w20 that the car likes.

[johalareewi]

Just out of interest can one tell what oil has been used anyway, apart obviously from the paperwork supplied? Is there any visual or tactile difference readily apparent to the layman?

0w20 is very runny when cold - almost like water.

5w30 is like oil when cold.

If you search the forum, this question gets asked a fair bit.

[Mooly]

Graphic demonstration of 0/20 vs 5/30 (appologies if this has been posted before),

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LDz36Cz36Kk

[TomdeGuerre]

I fail to see what that video proves. The metal ball starts to fall first in the 5W30 oil while the one in the 0W20 oil starts later then reaches the bottom first. One of the supposedly important points about the 0W20 oil is that it circulates more rapidly on a cold start - well that video certainly doesn't support that.

In any case comparisons of oil characteristics at ambient temperature are of little consequence. I'd need to see at least two sets of comparison - say one at -10 C and one at around +100 C.

[FROSTYBALLS]

Reminds me of the tests NHS Blood & Transplant do when I give blood .......

[TomdeGuerre]

Reminds me of the tests NHS Blood & Transplant do when I give blood .......

Never came up against that myself but I suppose they can't be too careful when they're dealing with ppl that have multiple tattoos and body piercings.

[Mooly]

The rate of decent in the main part of the tube supports the 0/20 as offering less resistance... yes its not a scientifically verified experiment and I can't explain why the balls seemingly start out at different times although I can make a guess. At the start of the video the tubes are inverted, and again the 0/20 'bubble' rises fastest. I would assume the starting conditions for each drop depend on the bubbles at the top and how they contact the balls on their way down.

[FROSTYBALLS]

Reminds me of the tests NHS Blood & Transplant do when I give blood .......

Never came up against that myself but I suppose they can't be too careful when they're dealing with ppl that have multiple tattoos and body piercings.

After donating a total of 38.5 litres, my arm is feeling a bit empty now .....

[cuius]

Some very unscientific figures, based on my mk.1 Auris. I think it was delivered with 0W20 ex-factory, but , as noted previously, local Spanish garages use 5W30 at services. The consumption for the first 15,000km (with 0W20) was 54.74mpg, for the remainder of the time (5W30) it was 53.95mpg. Obviously other factors come into play over a 3+ year period, general deterioration, tyre wear, etc., etc.; so the figures probably prove nothing!

[RelaxedDrive]

Just about to get my gen4 serviced and I see toyota recommend 0W-16 on their blog - I think I saw that in the manual too and it's what was originally used.

Is there any chance the dealer will use this or will I be lucky if I get 0W-20?!    I will ask for it!

[FROSTYBALLS]

In each of my Toyotas (petrols) since 2009, I always had the use of Toyota's preferred oil, 0W-20, written into my service plans, and reminded the dealer of this at each service.

I would stipulate that 0W-16 is used if I were you.

[RelaxedDrive]

I asked for 0w-16 and wrote it on the job sheet, but they still used 0w-20 according to the invoice. 😩

 

[TonyHSD]

35 minutes ago, RelaxedDrive said:

I asked for 0w-16 and wrote it on the job sheet, but they still used 0w-20 according to the invoice. 😩

 

Perhaps it’s cheaper for them to do so , similar to when some dealers we’re using 5w30 instead of 0w20, however there is an obvious difference between 0w20 and 5w30, but the difference between 0w16 and 0w20 is insignificant and most importantly for the hybrids engine lower temp factor is the same 0w...

[Eddiefh]

Hi , in a 2017 1.6 petrol would 5w30 cause damage over using 0w20 . Just noticed on dealer invoice they used 5w30 car handbook says 0w20 , do you think I should change it myself I’ve been and bought some 0w20 

I’ve noticed fuel mpg gone down but cars running fine 

[TonyHSD]

5 hours ago, Eddiefh said:

Hi , in a 2017 1.6 petrol would 5w30 cause damage over using 0w20 . Just noticed on dealer invoice they used 5w30 car handbook says 0w20 , do you think I should change it myself I’ve been and bought some 0w20 

I’ve noticed fuel mpg gone down but cars running fine 

Not gonna cause damage straight away but continues use of 5w30 and a combination with late oil changes may cause some issues afterwards.
No need to worry about it now but at your next oil change best to use 0w20, the oil that the car has come off the factory. Toyota dealers simply save on products to increase their profits plus there might be stock shortages too. 

[Roy124]

And give them you 0w/20.  I always used to source my own oil at a discount rather than pay for their more costly bulk supply.