Hybrid Tyre Wear

[Converted]

Apologies if this has already been posted, the search I did I could not see what I was looking for. Maybe that's a good thing and it's a non-question from me.

My question is to Hybrid owners and what the front tyre wear is like i.e. how often/quickly do you go through a front set of tyres. Do you rotate front to back to maximise tyre life. Any hints and tips really.

Coming from turbo diesels which can shred driven wheel tyres in short order with large amounts of torque what is the wear like on a Hybrid with maximum torque available from 0 revs ?

Thanks in advance.

[FROSTYBALLS]

Moved to the Hybrid/Toyota Prius club, with link left in the Auris club, so the topic can benefit from responses from both clubs.

[PeteB]

It depends how you drive it - I've done over 300,000 miles in Mk 1, 2 & 3 Prius, and generally get about 20,000 miles out of the front tyres.

I replace them at 3mm, then buy 2 new ones, which go on the back, the old back ones then going to the front. The rear tyres have usually only used about 1 or 2 mm in 20,000 miles.

Some people prefer to rotate their tyres so they buy 4 new ones at once. However, for dealing with heavy rain and deep puddles hit at speed, perceived wisdom is to have most tread on the rear wheels.

Obviously, once you put old rear tyres on the front, they will not last as long as the original new ones.

I drive quite moderately, hardly ever use full power, and pull away so that when possible I keep the ECO meter below the 'PWR' band. I did hear of a Gen 3 Prius driver whole wore out his front tyres in 10,000 miles by always driving in PWR mode (I use ECO), and generally flooring it when pulling away.

The Gen 1 Prius had 14" wheels, Gen 2 had 16", and Gen 3 has 15" wheels on the T3, plug in, and sometimes on the T-Spirit with the sunroof option. T4 and T-Spirit Prius have 17 inch wheels, tyres for which generally cost about 40% more but don't seem to last any longer. Other Hybrid models have a mixture of wheel sizes.

[Joseph D]

... My question is to Hybrid owners and what the front tyre wear is like i.e. how often/quickly do you go through a front set of tyres. Do you rotate front to back to maximise tyre life. Any hints and tips really.

I can't give any details for a whole tyre as I don't have records for my last set, but I wore down the last 2 mm of tread on my fronts in 15,310 mi, so extrapolating for a full tyre that gives ~46,000 mi.

I don't normally rotate per se, when my fronts wear out I put my rears on the front and the new tyres on the rear. I could rotate them so they all wear out together, but the way I do it I only have to replace 2 tyres at a time. When I put the rears on the front, they usually have about 4 or 5 mm on them.

Coming from turbo diesels which can shred driven wheel tyres in short order with large amounts of torque what is the wear like on a Hybrid with maximum torque available from 0 revs ? ...

If you drive your hybrid like this and maximise the available torque you will probably chew through tyres, but even worse you will get terrible fuel economy. So lose/lose all round.

Maybe a hybrid is not for you.

[cuius]

35,000 miles, with probably another 5,000+ to go, with original Michelin Energy on Auris HSD. 75% of mileage on motorways.

[Grumpy Cabbie]

Depends totally on your use patterns. I could get 17k/18k out of a set of fronts in hard town taxi use. Others who drive gently on A roads will get 30k/35k out of fronts. With a hybrid putting a lot of torque down when you floor the car at a junction you can, and will spin the wheels in a way a traditional car won't. They will literally spin like an electric motor would. Happens in the wet if you're heavy footed, even with traction control.

If you're getting a hybrid you might want to consider Low Rolling Resistance tyres that are economy rated. If you don't you will find your mpg's are no where as good as they could be. Also important is 0w20 oil in all Toyota hybrids above the gen2 Prius. Scrimp on this and again you'll lose noticeable mpg's.

Depends on your priorities.

[Converted]

Thanks all for your replies.

The turbo diesel is mine, I drive mainly motorway miles so Hybrid is definitely not for me.

The Hybrid is for my wife who does mainly town and short hops between villages.

She's not a quick driver and no traffic light grand prix racer so the Hybrid will probably work very well for her.

I'm not sure the combination of low rolling resistance tyres, damp roads and instant torque make for a good combination, I'll probably go for a set of all season tyres when the originals wear out as the car will only cover about 10,000miles/annum. Not sure I can be bothered with having two sets of wheels and tyres for this usage.

I doubt we will get anywhere near the claimed 76+MPG as long as beat the 37MPG of the 1.6HDi Grand C4 Picasso then we will be better off.

[Grumpy Cabbie]

The LRR tyres I have are A/A rated for wet grip and economy. They're grip like nothing else in the wet. Seriously impressed. They also allow the car to just roll along too.

But go for the all seasons if you prefer. Depends on your usage patterns I guess. If you get anything less than 45 mpg, then there's something wrong somewhere.

[Parts-King]

I averaged 55 MPG in an Auris Hybrid, without really trying

[Grumpy Cabbie]

I averaged 50 mph over 12 months and 35,000 miles of heavy taxi use. I think the average speed was 12 mph.

But if someone is using all season tyres, has a heavy right foot and uses their car for very short journeys in town they shouldn't get less than 45 mpg. If they do, there's something wrong for sure.

As you say, if you use your car for runs on A roads you should easily get 55 mpg without trying. Just keeping up with the flow should produce 60/65 mpg in summer too.

[MEP's Yaris GS]

My PiP was serviced the other week, I've owned since 12k, was at about 20800 miles, and all 4 tyres had around 5mm tread left which I was impressed with.

Mainly dual carriage way and motor way driving mind, and lots of roundabouts.

[kithmo]

I swapped fronts to back at 12k miles and now at nearly 20K miles still have a good 5-6mm tread all round.

[Dapple]

The turbo diesel is mine, I drive mainly motorway miles so Hybrid is definitely not for me.

I'm not sure the combination of low rolling resistance tyres, damp roads and instant torque make for a good combination.

I had yet another turbo-diesel when SWMBO bought a hybrid for "town" use. After using it a few times I stole it as it was far more economical on the motorway and everywhere else than mine. Then I got rid of the smelly oil burner and bought myself a hybrid. Now our joint fuel bills are laughably low.

Also do not assume, as i once did, that low rolling resistance tyres means low grip, it does not.

[Grumpy Cabbie]

It's an out dated assumption that hybrids are for town and are no use on the motorway. It's the same assumption that hybrids are slow. They're not fast, but 134 bhp and 0-60 in 10 is average for the fleet and happily keep up with a similar segment 1.8 diesel. I'm also sure a larger engine diesel will be more than happy whizzing along at 80 mph, a hybrid still excels. I remember driving 400 miles to central London and back at 80 mph and got about 55 mpg. If I hadn't driving into the madness of London it would have been higher.

[johalareewi]

I drive mainly motorway miles so Hybrid is definitely not for me.

It is interesting that you say that.

The Hybrid is for my wife who does mainly town and short hops between villages.

She's not a quick driver and no traffic light grand prix racer so the Hybrid will probably work very well for her.

And that.

It's an out dated assumption that hybrids are for town and are no use on the motorway. It's the same assumption that hybrids are slow. 134 bhp and 0-60 in 10 is average for the fleet and happily keep up with a similar segment 1.8 diesel.

What he said.

Are you able to get a loan hybrid for a week or so to try one out?

[sanzomat]

As a company car driver who has had turbo diesels for the previous 4 cars (about 90,000 miles in each over 2-3 year periods of possession) I have to agree with the majority of respondents to the OP. I often burn a whole tank on motorway runs and my Prius+ is definitley more economical on motorway runs than any of the diesels I've had and given the petrol is cheaper (and cleaner) it makes it even better still. Around town its even better but where it really excells is on A and B roads. E.g. on a 160 mile trip from Gloucestershire to Fordingbridge and back, all on A roads, I averaged 74mpg just going with the flow, even overtaking a few other cars. This is in automatic seven seater!

Sticking to the topic, my original fronts (Bridgstone) wore out at 24k so about the same as all the diesels I've had. These were worn on the edges despite running them about 2psi over recommended so I advise anyone with these tyres on this car to go even higher. They still had a good 4mm in the middle.

[Converted]

We had an Auris Touring Sports Hybrid to test drive.

We were suitably impressed and have ordered one.

A hybrid is a non-starter for me as I spend time on German autobahns. The Auris hybrid will not go with the flow there, I'm sure a Lexus 450 hybrid would work but my pockets aren't that deep :-(

[Joseph D]

... A hybrid is a non-starter for me as I spend time on German autobahns. The Auris hybrid will not go with the flow there, ...

You seem fond of making assumptions.

I can't speak for the Auris and see no reason why it should be different, but the Prius is quite at home on the Autobahns, I had no problem keeping up, nor taking a Prius up to top speed. Such fun. :D :D :D

[ToyotaAuris]

Ive done 50k miles on Prius (old shape 05) 100% city and never had problems. Sold the car on so dont know how long they would last, still had alot of tread on em

[ToyotaAuris]

We had an Auris Touring Sports Hybrid to test drive.

We were suitably impressed and have ordered one.

A hybrid is a non-starter for me as I spend time on German autobahns. The Auris hybrid will not go with the flow there, I'm sure a Lexus 450 hybrid would work but my pockets aren't that deep :-(

Haha, I agree with you. My 1.3 Auris sturggles at 90 MPH on a autonahn when I took it Germany but my old Golf was another story!!!

[PeteB]

... A hybrid is a non-starter for me as I spend time on German autobahns. The Auris hybrid will not go with the flow there, ...

You seem fond of making assumptions.

I can't speak for the Auris and see no reason why it should be different, but the Prius is quite at home on the Autobahns, I had no problem keeping up, nor taking a Prius up to top speed. Such fun. :D :D :D

A Gen 2 Prius was limited by the engine management computers to a top speed of 106 mph (although the speedo would display about 112 at this speed, and the Gen 3 Prius is limited to 112 mpg (120 on display).

I've never had the chance to explore these sorts of speeds but those who have tell me they still have plenty of power right up to those speeds.

The current Hybrid Auris also has a claimed top speed of 112 mph (109 Touring Sport), but I suspect they will feel slightly less sprightly at these speeds than a Prius as their poorer aerodynamics will be much more relevant at such speeds.

Having said that, of course, someone used to a car that can cruise at 130 mph or higher is likely to find the Toyota Hybrids less appealing, but my experience is the smoothness and quietness of the Hybrid system has made me more of a chilled driver. In any case, most of my driving has been in the UK and maybe 10 or 20 thousand miles in Spain, so a top speed much above 70 mph is not really of interest to me (although relaxed cruising at 70 definitely is).

We had an Auris Touring Sports Hybrid to test drive.

We were suitably impressed and have ordered one.

A hybrid is a non-starter for me as I spend time on German autobahns. The Auris hybrid will not go with the flow there, I'm sure a Lexus 450 hybrid would work but my pockets aren't that deep :-(

Haha, I agree with you. My 1.3 Auris sturggles at 90 MPH on a autonahn when I took it Germany but my old Golf was another story!!!

It's probably not a fair comparison between a 1.3 Auris and the Hybrid version

[Joseph D]

... Having said that, of course, someone used to a car that can cruise at 130 mph or higher is likely to find the Toyota Hybrids less appealing, but my experience is the smoothness and quietness of the Hybrid system has made me more of a chilled driver. In any case, most of my driving has been in the UK and maybe 10 or 20 thousand miles in Spain, so a top speed much above 70 mph is not really of interest to me (although relaxed cruising at 70 definitely is).

I have to agree and in all honesty, where can you legally do 130 mph apart from the autobahn?

I got the Prius up to 188 km/h (117 mph), which was plenty fast, but had to slow down as I was catching slower traffic and was running out of room. The opportunities for unlimited speed on the autobahns is soon going to be a thing of the past before too long. Traffic density and low (130 km/h) speed limits (lol) along the way will see to it.

Back on topic, I conservatively estimate my front tyres would last 46,000 mi. :D

[Converted]

... A hybrid is a non-starter for me as I spend time on German autobahns. The Auris hybrid will not go with the flow there, ...

You seem fond of making assumptions.

I can't speak for the Auris and see no reason why it should be different, but the Prius is quite at home on the Autobahns, I had no problem keeping up, nor taking a Prius up to top speed. Such fun. :D :D :D

What would that assumption be?

After taking a hybrid demonstrator car onto an autobahn and driving with real traffic I'm making assumptions?

... Having said that, of course, someone used to a car that can cruise at 130 mph or higher is likely to find the Toyota Hybrids less appealing, but my experience is the smoothness and quietness of the Hybrid system has made me more of a chilled driver. In any case, most of my driving has been in the UK and maybe 10 or 20 thousand miles in Spain, so a top speed much above 70 mph is not really of interest to me (although relaxed cruising at 70 definitely is).

I have to agree and in all honesty, where can you legally do 130 mph apart from the autobahn?

I got the Prius up to 188 km/h (117 mph), which was plenty fast, but had to slow down as I was catching slower traffic and was running out of room. The opportunities for unlimited speed on the autobahns is soon going to be a thing of the past before too long. Traffic density and low (130 km/h) speed limits (lol) along the way will see to it.

Back on topic, I conservatively estimate my front tyres would last 46,000 mi. :D

They've been talking about limiting the autobahn speed limit since the mid-70's that I can recall. As long as there are AMG, M Sport, Porsche and whatever VAG are putting out with a channel into Berlin I wouldn't go holding your breath. There are big distances between cities where traffic thins out.

117mph may be plenty fast enough for you and everyone will respect that. Will you respect other peoples wish to drive faster? Driving a car at its maximum is not what I would call relaxing. I'd rather drive a car with a something in reserve than driving the wheels off it every day. They don't last very long when you do that. It's the same with any piece of machinery.

[Joseph D]

... Will you respect other peoples wish to drive faster? Driving a car at its maximum is not what I would call relaxing. I'd rather drive a car with a something in reserve than driving the wheels off it every day. They don't last very long when you do that. It's the same with any piece of machinery.

Absolutely, as long as it is safe and legal. I like to drive fast, too.

I would agree that driving at maximum would not be relaxing, but would also say that driving any car at 130+ mph could never be relaxing. It would be a lot of other things, but I hope no one ever relaxes driving at high speed.

The assumption that hybrids cannot go or mix it up on the motorway or the autobahn was the assumption I was challenging, and I certainly agree that the Auris is a small car and it would not be ideal to go fast in. I'd also say it is not ideal going fast in any small car. In addition, the Auris is but one hybrid and I think you need to exercise caution about judging all hybrids by your experience of the Auris. I'm not trying to be confrontational, just trying to add a bit of balance to counter your assumptions.

At the end of the day, a person does not buy a hybrid to race it on an ongoing basis, so horses for courses and each to their own, and all that.

I wish you joy and pleasure driving the car of your choice in the manner you see fit. :)

[Dapple]

We had an Auris Touring Sports Hybrid to test drive.

We were suitably impressed and have ordered one.

A hybrid is a non-starter for me as I spend time on German autobahns. The Auris hybrid will not go with the flow there, I'm sure a Lexus 450 hybrid would work but my pockets aren't that deep :-(

It's true that the Lexus 450 is faster, by 12mph.