Steering Problems?

[ZPM]

Has anyone else got a 2003 Avensis 4-door saloon? We had all the brakes renewed (discs and pads) by main dealer, and when we got the car back, it didn't want to steer straight consistently at higher speeds and seemed to have a lot of "play", and a mechanic said it felt "floaty". We took it back to the main dealer to have the wheels/tyres returned to their normal positions, and they put it on the tracking machine and readjusted that because they said the steering wheel was not on straight.

Now, it's been delivered back, and the central portion of the steering wheel is virtually vertical towards the right corresponding to the front wheels being about 20-30 degrees pointing towards the right as you look at the car on the driveway from the side.

Can anyone tell me, how far around to the right do you have to put the wheel to get a full lock on your vehicle's steering? I don't think what I am seeing is right for the vehicle. I would normally associate that position of the wheel to correspond to a full right turn, and it had never gone that far round before.

Any constructive thoughts, please? I have yet to test drive it again because of pressing work deadlines. I hate to think I will have to take it back to the dealer again. I am not used to having to do that with our vehicle!

[Mike169]

Hi

Your wheels/tyres, are you 100% certain each wheel is back on the exactly same corner of the vehicle? Usually the N/S/F one wears the most, then the O/S/F and the 2 rears about the same, perhaps you can double check.

Are all 4 tyre pressures correct?

What is the tread depth of each of the tyres, if they are getting low, just fitting a new set may straighten it up once it has been retracted again as it was aadjusted with them worn, in theory it should make no difference but in reality it does.

Do you know if a trolley jack was used to raise your car at all, just wondering if something has been bent underneath.

Regards Mike.

[gazza1286]

If the tracking has been adjusted the starting point with any procedure is to set the steering wheel in the 'dead ahead' neutral position. The steering wheel is then locked in place using a spring loaded device. The wheels are then aligned using either lasers, wireless probes or mirrors. This adjustment is carried out by lengthening or shortening the tie rods connected to the hubs which corrects the toe-in as per manufacturer's specifications.

IF the steering wheel was not correctly lined up at the outset the wheel will always be offset when driving straight ahead.

If this is the case take it back and get them to do it properly. It's got nothing to do with steering lock range and nothing to do with the steering wheel 'not being on the column correctly'. This is a operator error and the Service Manager won't be pleased.

[alan333]

I've had two Toyota's with strange happenings with the steering:

A 55 plate Avensis with two new cheap tyres on the front when I bought it, and the steering wheel off about 1/8 of a turn. I adjusted the tracking which cured the problem. A while later I changed the tyres due to road noise, and found the steering to be out the opposite way the same 1/8 turn. ie if I'd left it alone and changed the tyres it would've been fine.

An 11 plate Auris pulling to one side. Again this was bought with two new cheap tyres fitted. Swapping them onto the back pretty much cured it.

[revpermin]

I took my 2003 avensis d4d into an independent garage chain to get the tracking done, it pulled to the left more than I thought was normal.

When I got it back the st wheel was off line by about 10 mins on a clock face right hand down, I didn't get it corrected as it doesn't really matter.

My tyres lasted longer but not long enough for my liking but I thought the garage must know what they're doing so I left it for a few years.

I bought some cooper winter tyres last year & was very annoyed when they wore out in 5 months! so I decided to do the tracking my self.

I made 2 100x100x10mm steel plates with an m32 nut welded in the centre. I put the car on my ramps jacked it up & placed a plate under each front tyre, I then adjusted the tracking by lining up the front edges of the front wheels so they were in line with the rears.

When I'd finished the st wheel was back where it should be, the car stopped pulling to the right, the handling is much improved & my mpg's went from 58 to 62!

So sometimes it's better to DIY :D

[alan333]

I then adjusted the tracking by lining up the front edges of the front wheels so they were in line with the rears.

Beware that only works if the distance between the rear wheels is the same as between the fronts. The Auris isn't, not sure about the Avensis. What you need is both the front wheels running parallel to each other, then set the toe in (or out) to the recommended spec.

[TomdeGuerre]

There's something I don't get about Phil's post #6. You made 2 steel plates and welded an M32 nut in the middle then you put the car on a ramp and lowered it onto the plates, right? Was the nut on the upper side so that the tyres rested on it or was it on the lower side? and what was the purpose?

I've used angle plates before (or weaver plates or slip plates, call them what you will) which have roller bearings for lateral movement and ball bearings for rotational movement between the upper and lower surfaces, they also have locking pins which you can engage. But I always locked them before pushing the car onto them, never jacked it up and lowered it onto them because that unsettles the suspension and you'll get varying results each time you do that and you also need to get rid of any hysteresis in the steering system before adjusting anything. It was also standard practice to put ballast in the car ie at least 2 off 56lb weights at each of the drivers and front passengers foot wells. OK maybe the ballast doesn't affect the tracking so much but it's important for doing the rest of the steering checks.

[revpermin]

alen333 & TomdeGuerre.

You are a great example of why I joined this site, your knowledge is invaluable!!

[TomdeGuerre]

Aye, Phil, you need a lang spoon tae sup wi' a Fifer right enough. BTW if you ever get a hold of an old Ford Popular up in that Royal and Ancient Kingdom - one with the solid king pins and semi-elliptic springs then I might have some notes that would help you with the settings.

[alan333]

Cheers revpermin :)

BTW if I need to set tracking I use a Heath Robinson home method of measurement, but it works every time. Take a hollow pole and slide a smaller pole inside it (both about 4 feet long - something like curtain rails). Get under the car, ideally with it on level ground, and use the sliding poles to "measure" the distance between the wheels (not between the tyres) at the front of the wheel, then compare that to the distance at the rear of the same wheels. If the measurements are different then the wheels aren't running parallel. To figure out which side needs adjusted look along the line of the wheels (front to back) and see which one points too much one way.

[revpermin]

Have checked the wheel track dimensions, the avensis is only 2/10ths of an inch wider at the front plus I like ayrshire bacon & the stirling village outlet stores :)

[fastbob72]

Did anyone get to the bottom of these steering problems at all because mines been like that for a few weeks now.We've had snow,ice,freezing conditions and torrential rain for the first half of December with my front wheels,particularly the offside spinning as I'm driving to work.You know that lovely way the wheel loses all traction with a feather of throttle but you can't put in a higher gear and if you come off the throttle for anything more than a second you end up having to drop into 3rd or 2nd and then both front wheels are imitating Fast n Loud at their best lol.

The front tyres where past their best so a week or so of this treatment seemed to explain perfectly why my steering felt light and drifty at some points,heavier at others,sometimes it seemed to turn easier n quicker to the left than the right...basically a bit erratic,not at all like her usual self.

Had new tyres put on the front at the start of the week.Also the weathers been pretty typical but a lot milder than the start of the month yet the problem is just the same.It's only been like it maybe a month and I'm trying to think if I've hit a pothole hard or something but nothing springs to mind and nothing looks out of place or damaged,

I might have mentioned before I'm right into trying out all the OBD2 apps for my android phone because I have the ELM327 bluetooth adapter.Also I bought a laptop and got a proper USB ELM327 plus that TOAD software for windows.....personally,if anyone is tempted I would say think hard about that one,there's an awful lot cheaper software that appears as good but I've not had a chance to fully test it out.I'm thinking of writing a review of it though when I do and a number of the android ones too.Think I have around 7 apps on my phone at the moment :)

Ok,where's this going you may be thinking but bear with me I'm rambling my way towards a point somewhere around here.lol.Anyway,all these apps do the same basic thing about aswell as each other give or take but they've all got a handy feature or two that's unique to that app.Torque Pro is the all rounder that does probably more than the others when you take in all the plug ins but it doesn't recognise some things like VVTi Cam Phaser or OCV valves.ELMscanToyota does all that and graphs but no data logging,Car Gauge Pro does all of it and data logs to a degree and OBD Diag Toyota Pro has output test to test certain systems which is handy.

Anyway,I spent last week trying to get Gauge Pro to properly record a complete data log so I can get a better understanding of when my cam is advancing/retarding and so on and it was while driving later at night on an empty road that i noticed the reading - Power Steering Switch was at OFF.So I began to watch it as I was turning into junctions and coming in and out of the COOP and funny enough it would come ON for a few seconds then OFF again where it would become heavy again.

Clearly there is a connection,or possibly not a very good one in fact but what I've read from this thread and an earlier one you have a similar problem to mine or my steering is acting exactly as several of you described your as behaving.I didn't realise there were any electrics involved with a 2002s power steering but apparently according to Haynes there's a power steering pressure switch but that is the sum total of all it has to say on the matter.It tells you to disconnect it in the part about replacing the steering rack but that's the only mention of it.

It's only earlier this week maybe Tuesday evening I discovered this and haven't been able to investigate it yet but I feel that later today if the rain holds off I may have a little christmas day time with my car.....only have today and tomorrow off then back into work so i'll keep you posted and with luck have some results to share :)