New Winter Rubber

[mhc]

After fitting winter tyres (Nokian WR D3) to our van last year and being very happy with them, we decided to fit a set of winters to the IQ.

So an order to Oponeo for a set of Nokian WR D4 (the newer model) and £180 spent, then a trip to the local tyre fitter (another £40) and we have a nice new set of four.

I had a good chat with the fitter, who's a big advocate of winter tyres, telling me that he had a lot of customers who were a bit skeptical but had returned in the spring totally converted. He also explained about them not only being about snow and ice, and that it was the softer compound in temperatures below 7 degrees which made them so much better.

I know the temperatures at the moment are a bit above that, but fitting them now gives them time to scrub up and lose any oil or protective coating they have, so they should be good and ready for when the temperature drops.

Well so far after about ten miles they feel exactly the same as the previous Ecopias, no more noise and grip exactly the same. Time will tell if MPG is affected but they are supposed to be good for rolling resistance.

I'll post updates as the weather changes and if i notice any differences.

But here are some pics:

[Guest]

New tyres always look good on a car. Good choice. We left our Yokohama's on from last winter, as they apparently were heading for the legal tread limit. Amazingly, we still have them on and local dealer reckons replacement in January 2016. My wife prefers the grip levels to the standard -summer- tyre. As for economy, we are doing well considering the summer tyres are supposed to be much better. It's always a gamble what the winter is going to be like, but even if it doesn't snow, you still have those close to and below freezing temps. The winter tyre has been proven by a number of magazines and other's 'concerned' with our safety, to be worth the money. If you can also afford two sets of wheels, it makes it more simple changing them around. We swap tyres and store the others.

[Wayne2015]

I have Michelin CrossClimates All-Season already fitted on my Auris

Temp here already dipped to 5 degrees a few mornings .....

[craggle]

Was thinking this morning when I saw the temp gauge at 7°c, maybe it's time to change the wheels again.

Should get another year out my winter tyres I hope.

Craig.

[mhc]

UK winters can go either way can't they?!

But we live up a hill which is about 3/4 mile long, and when we moved in we were told by a neighbor that it always got bad in winter up by us, he said it can be fine half a mile down the road, raining and cold, but at the top where we are it can be six inches deep! we were a bit dubious but sure enough this past year it did exactly that! So any extra grip is welcomed!

I have friends from Czech Rep and Slovakia and they were always on about winter tyres, but I watched a load of videos on winter tyre tests and what did it for me was the difference in breaking distance, even at town speeds the difference was surprising and that's in the wet at above freezing!

It was this one:

It's a fair difference, and could easily be the difference between stopping and going into someone.

How were the Yoko's Bob? you used them much on snow/ice?

[Wiz201]

Yep my winters will be going on, I got a new set last year so I think they'll stay with the Aygo until its PCP ends in two years. Going to get them fitted next month and they stay on until service in April. Toyota store them for free so no lugging them into the car to take them to a garage.

I first got them 5 years ago with my Jazz and I remember the garage manager there being very sceptical about them. Oh I was so pleased when we got that horrible cold winter 2010/2011 and I managed to get to work every day.

[TomdeGuerre]

UK winters can go either way can't they?!

But we live up a hill which is about 3/4 mile long, and when we moved in we were told by a neighbor that it always got bad in winter up by us, he said it can be fine half a mile down the road, raining and cold, but at the top where we are it can be six inches deep! we were a bit dubious but sure enough this past year it did exactly that! So any extra grip is welcomed!

I have friends from Czech Rep and Slovakia and they were always on about winter tyres, but I watched a load of videos on winter tyre tests and what did it for me was the difference in breaking distance, even at town speeds the difference was surprising and that's in the wet at above freezing!

It was this one:

It's a fair difference, and could easily be the difference between stopping and going into someone.

How were the Yoko's Bob? you used them much on snow/ice?

I don't like to contradict you Konrad but I don't believe this video and in saying that I usually like Mat Watson's stuff. I think the differences are greatly exaggerated and biased towards the winter tyres. Look at the section where they try a standing start for example. The guy in the car with standard tyres drops the clutch and sits there with wheels spinniing - well, what else would you expect? Meanwhile the guy inthe winter tyres lets his clutch out normally and drives away. Aye, right!

I was sitting at traffic lights on a dual carriageway in a Vectra SRi one night after a very heavy shower of rain when a guy drew up alongside me in a 3 series BMW. I wasn't looking for a race but he was. When the lights went to green he gave his car an almighty burst of revs and dropped the clutch. I heard the noise in the lane next to me and at first couldn't understand what it was then realised it was his wheels spinning because his tyres couldn't get a grip on the wet surface. He wouldn't lift his foot off the accelerator either so i let the clutch out on mine and pulled away. He did eventually get his going and caught up then passed me but it certainly wasn't the way to drive. I doubt if changing tyres was going to make this guy a safe driver.

When i look at the wet braking distances frankly i don't believe the difference in how long it takes the car with standard tyres to come to a stop. I'd love to know what the standard tyres were and compare them to what the manufacturers claims re for wet weather grip and braking distances.

[mhc]

I agree that putting winter tyres on doesn't stop someone driving too fast or like an idiot, and you should always drive to the conditions, so no, winter tyres on their own won't make every person a safe driver, but it does give you better tools for the job.

For me, the difference in driving our van on normal all seasons in wet snowy weather and switching to winters was massive, i could get up hills without spinning, could feel the difference in braking and there was a lot less understeer too.

I'm not saying the video is the best, most accurate one ever, but there are plenty of others demonstrating time and time again that winter tyres are safer and better in lower temperatures.

Granted some of them might be a bit biased, and maybe some of them might try harder to make winters look better, but to be objective; if you told me to do ten fast starts, some would wheel spin, others wouldn't, they certainly wouldn't all be the same!

IMHO The videos do give an overall good view of what difference tyres make. But like most things, it's up to each person to decide for themselves.

I'm happy to add honest updates as mine get used though :D

[Guest]

UK winters can go either way can't they?! But we live up a hill which is about 3/4 mile long, and when we moved in we were told by a neighbor that it always got bad in winter up by us, he said it can be fine half a mile down the road, raining and cold, but at the top where we are it can be six inches deep! we were a bit dubious but sure enough this past year it did exactly that! So any extra grip is welcomed! I have friends from Czech Rep and Slovakia and they were always on about winter tyres, but I watched a load of videos on winter tyre tests and what did it for me was the difference in breaking distance, even at town speeds the difference was surprising and that's in the wet at above freezing! It's a fair difference, and could easily be the difference between stopping and going into someone.

How were the Yoko's Bob? you used them much on snow/ice?

I don't know how they are on snow, as so far -which is typical- no snow. On ice you still need to be careful, obviously. It's in the colder periods, those bone chilling days when you notice the difference. Also, a confidence boost that when you want to stop, you can pretty much still pick where, instead of sailing off into something if you're unlucky. Not far from us, almost 3 miles, there is a water feature -a leaking water board grid that is in three pieces, it's a big one. In winter, when it's cold enough, it freezes. This is on a short downhill, bending around to the left. Knowing it's there helps, but the first time I went over it back in early 2011, I nearly lost the car -a Mondeo with summer -normal- tyres on it. I don't worry about it any more, and no, they still haven't fixed it. We also have one entering the village from Welshpool direction. Have seen the water board people there three times this year, and that is still leaking too.

The most frightening -as in butt clenching- moment I have had on ice was in the Falklands in September 1982. The road down to the jetty is very steep, and it was covered in ice. I was driving a Bedford MK 4 ton HIAB (4x4) truck and it had those useless cross country tyres on -useless for ice. I recall wondering if I would stop at the bottom or go off into the harbour. Luckily for me, I stopped it. I went back a different way to the airfield after delivering stuff to all and sundry. The only ice I like is in a drink, or a nice refreshing ice lolly.

Thanks to the knowledge gained about this Oponeo site, I shall be buying four more of the Winter Yoko's .

A few pics of what I mean.

[TomdeGuerre]

UK winters can go either way can't they?! But we live up a hill which is about 3/4 mile long, and when we moved in we were told by a neighbor that it always got bad in winter up by us, he said it can be fine half a mile down the road, raining and cold, but at the top where we are it can be six inches deep! we were a bit dubious but sure enough this past year it did exactly that! So any extra grip is welcomed! I have friends from Czech Rep and Slovakia and they were always on about winter tyres, but I watched a load of videos on winter tyre tests and what did it for me was the difference in breaking distance, even at town speeds the difference was surprising and that's in the wet at above freezing! It's a fair difference, and could easily be the difference between stopping and going into someone.

How were the Yoko's Bob? you used them much on snow/ice?

I don't know how they are on snow, as so far -which is typical- no snow. On ice you still need to be careful, obviously. It's in the colder periods, those bone chilling days when you notice the difference. Also, a confidence boost that when you want to stop, you can pretty much still pick where, instead of sailing off into something if you're unlucky. Not far from us, almost 3 miles, there is a water feature -a leaking water board grid that is in three pieces, it's a big one. In winter, when it's cold enough, it freezes. This is on a short downhill, bending around to the left. Knowing it's there helps, but the first time I went over it back in early 2011, I nearly lost the car -a Mondeo with summer -normal- tyres on it. I don't worry about it any more, and no, they still haven't fixed it. We also have one entering the village from Welshpool direction. Have seen the water board people there three times this year, and that is still leaking too.

The most frightening -as in butt clenching- moment I have had on ice was in the Falklands in September 1982. The road down to the jetty is very steep, and it was covered in ice. I was driving a Bedford MK 4 ton HIAB (4x4) truck and it had those useless cross country tyres on -useless for ice. I recall wondering if I would stop at the bottom or go off into the harbour. Luckily for me, I stopped it. I went back a different way to the airfield after delivering stuff to all and sundry. The only ice I like is in a drink, or a nice refreshing ice lolly. Thanks to the knowledge gained about this Oponeo site, I shall be buying four more of the Winter Yoko's .

A few pics of what I mean.

I like your stories Bob, you sound like a man I could listen to. I don’t have any doubt that tyres can make a big difference but I’m an old dinosaur that belonged to a generation that said it was sissy to blame your tyres if you went through the hedge. Some of the things I drove… I remember buying one out of the market that had a town and country knobbly on one side at the front and a baldy radial on the other side while there were two cross-plys on the back. Another one (a Cortina) had three 13 inch wheels and one 17 inch wheel on it (don’t know what that came off but it fitted the studs) and I had to drive it down the road with the steering wheel at 45 degrees just to keep it straight. Still I made it back before the pubs shut.

What I’m talking about though is the idea that these videos are pitched at us as though we were about 9 years old. Remember that film The Scent of a Woman where Al Pacino, playing a blind man, asks his young compadre if he wants to dance the tango with the young lady he’s chatting up. The young one says he doesn’t know how to do the tango and Pacino says Of course not, you’ve been watching MTV all your life and he dances with her himself. Only these days it’s Facebook, talk about infantilising the human mind.

[Guest]

UK winters can go either way can't they?! But we live up a hill which is about 3/4 mile long, and when we moved in we were told by a neighbor that it always got bad in winter up by us, he said it can be fine half a mile down the road, raining and cold, but at the top where we are it can be six inches deep! we were a bit dubious but sure enough this past year it did exactly that! So any extra grip is welcomed! I have friends from Czech Rep and Slovakia and they were always on about winter tyres, but I watched a load of videos on winter tyre tests and what did it for me was the difference in breaking distance, even at town speeds the difference was surprising and that's in the wet at above freezing! It's a fair difference, and could easily be the difference between stopping and going into someone.

How were the Yoko's Bob? you used them much on snow/ice?

I don't know how they are on snow, as so far -which is typical- no snow. On ice you still need to be careful, obviously. It's in the colder periods, those bone chilling days when you notice the difference. Also, a confidence boost that when you want to stop, you can pretty much still pick where, instead of sailing off into something if you're unlucky. Not far from us, almost 3 miles, there is a water feature -a leaking water board grid that is in three pieces, it's a big one. In winter, when it's cold enough, it freezes. This is on a short downhill, bending around to the left. Knowing it's there helps, but the first time I went over it back in early 2011, I nearly lost the car -a Mondeo with summer -normal- tyres on it. I don't worry about it any more, and no, they still haven't fixed it. We also have one entering the village from Welshpool direction. Have seen the water board people there three times this year, and that is still leaking too.

The most frightening -as in butt clenching- moment I have had on ice was in the Falklands in September 1982. The road down to the jetty is very steep, and it was covered in ice. I was driving a Bedford MK 4 ton HIAB (4x4) truck and it had those useless cross country tyres on -useless for ice. I recall wondering if I would stop at the bottom or go off into the harbour. Luckily for me, I stopped it. I went back a different way to the airfield after delivering stuff to all and sundry. The only ice I like is in a drink, or a nice refreshing ice lolly. Thanks to the knowledge gained about this Oponeo site, I shall be buying four more of the Winter Yoko's .

A few pics of what I mean.

I like your stories Bob, you sound like a man I could listen to. I don’t have any doubt that tyres can make a big difference but I’m an old dinosaur that belonged to a generation that said it was sissy to blame your tyres if you went through the hedge. Some of the things I drove… I remember buying one out of the market that had a town and country knobbly on one side at the front and a baldy radial on the other side while there were two cross-plys on the back. Another one (a Cortina) had three 13 inch wheels and one 17 inch wheel on it (don’t know what that came off but it fitted the studs) and I had to drive it down the road with the steering wheel at 45 degrees just to keep it straight. Still I made it back before the pubs shut.

What I’m talking about though is the idea that these videos are pitched at us as though we were about 9 years old. Remember that film The Scent of a Woman where Al Pacino, playing a blind man, asks his young compadre if he wants to dance the tango with the young lady he’s chatting up. The young one says he doesn’t know how to do the tango and Pacino says Of course not, you’ve been watching MTV all your life and he dances with her himself. Only these days it’s Facebook, talk about infantilising the human mind.

I agree, FaceAche and all these other 'Media' sites, what's the point? Has e-mail had its day already? I don't like the idea of people seeing what would normally be private between friends- real as opposed to those on FaceAche. Some of the stuff my wife shows me of what people have put on there is ridiculous. But as you say, that is the way of things these days, good and bad together. Funny you mention the various tyre sizes. I once had a red Cavalier -from a local scrap yard- that had three different tyre patterns and a wheel I thought was not meant for the cavalier. Sorted it eventually. That Cortina must have looked funny with 13 inch wheels.

I think the problem with these videos is the target audience. Like you said, people like yourself don't see the point, or that it's sissy to change, just be more careful. I used to think like that too, and then one day when I was lucky enough to have some extra cash, I bought a set after thinking about how much longer I might be around. I figured this should only extend my chances of reaching pension age and further -I can only hope.

I like that comment, 'Infantilising the Human Mind. That is so true. The Nanny State, a version of what they do in America. Another story, just for you Tom. When in Riyadh during the build up to the first Gulf War, we often had the Patriot Missile guys and gals in for radio batteries in Avionics. I once heard the bloke who ran the Battery Shop discussing their TV and Radio system, that we could sometimes pick up and hear/watch. On it, we often heard safety instructions given out to their people, that reminds me today of what our lot -government- are doing now. "Before you drive off, Buckle Up, It's the Law!" So many more that I felt demeaned what they were doing there in the first place. If they couldn't be trusted to 'Buckle Up,' then why were they there to kick Saddam's you. Read that last one backwards.

[mhc]

First update after a 80 mile round trip on national speed limit A roads;

Temperature was 10-13 degrees, tyres performed very well, actually seemed a bit more grippy that the Ecopias - not surprising if the rubber is softer.

Cornering and braking were both very good, i did a hard stop (in a safe area) from about 50 and there was no slippage or skidding.

Comfort over bumps is good, maybe due to softer rubber, maybe due to more tread, but they do seem to iron the bumps a bit more.

All in all i'm very happy with them, if they perform like this when it gets cold and snowy i'll be a very happy bunny!

Will update as the weather gets worse :)

[mhc]

Short update after some snow and colder weather:

The tyres are great, Nokian WRD4's are well recommended! We've had a paltry 2-3 inches of snow, some ice, temperatures hovering around freezing and lots of rain, so lots of standing water.

Grip levels have been like driving on summer tyres, no noticeable slipping, even on hills, breaking distance is great, with no sliding, and even in the ice, there were only a few times the ABS kicked in.

Best of all, driving through the standing water and slush has been a complete difference from normal 'all season' tyres, lots more grip, no aquaplaning and a nice 'planted to the ground' feeling whenever i'm driving.

Only time i've had any slipping or understeer was deliberate provocation in (an empty) B&Q car park, new tarmac and very wet, it did slide and understeer but to be fair it was caught very quickly, and it felt a lot more controlled than on other tyres.

So would i buy them again? for £200 plus fitting (£20-40) oh yes.

I'm actually looking forward to some decent snow now!

[Soeley]

That is good to know thanks.

[Guest]

On 20/10/2015 at 4:29 PM, mhc said:

't's a fair difference, and could easily be the difference between stopping and going into someone. How were the Yoko's Bob? you used them much on snow/ice?

Sorry for delay in replying Marc. The Yoko's are very good, and as you said, better ride quality over bumps. No snow yet around here to speak of, we had some on the hills, not much on the roads. Well, by the time we went out when it did snow it was all gone. I know some people think they are a waste of money, but my wife and I feel better, and feel that the car drives better on them. It costs us £20 a pop -probably not the right word to use with tyres- to have the winters taken off the wheels and summers put on, and vice versa. Also, the evidence points to them being far better in winter than those summer tyres, even when it isn't snowing. By the way, I am quite happy not seeing any snow.