Grinding Noise When I Brake To Stop At Very Low Speed

[hartsongs]

Hi

I drive a 2002 Avensis Estate Auto. CDX VVT 1998 cc.Petrol.

It's now done 115,000 miles.

Generally everything is fine but....one problem I've had for a while is this...

If I approach a junction and brake, everything is fine....but when I make the final braking at very low speed to stop I get this awful grinding sound, the brakes slip a little then recover and the car stops. It's not a pleasant experience but I've lived with it.

It has done this for a couple of years . I must admit I haven't had it checked out but I feel I need to now.

The members input on this forum can be invaluable so rather than just take it to the dealer blind I thought I'd ask if anyone had experienced this problem and what the cause, solution is.

Thanks

Paul

[alan333]

Could be as simple as pads and discs (or shoes and drums as applicable), especially if they're quite old or you've done a lot of miles on them. Have it checked out asap.

[Konrad C]

Had this before. Brake dust build up. The sound is like a bass speaker vibrating the whole car, at very low speed before coming to a complete halt, with gentle braking.

The quick fix is to dismantle and clean the disk and pads with brake cleaning fluid. Also clean the caliper and bracket. That should keep the low frequency vibration away for a while. I used to put the hose to wheels and the amount of dust that came off. It stopped the vibration for a while. Cleaning is the best way though.

If that does not work, then replace the disks and pads.

[hartsongs]

Alan and Konrad, thanks for your input here.

Yes, the sound is a low and gravelly and kicks in just as the car is coming to a stop.

Braking at normal speed is fine.

The worry I have is that the brakes feel like they're slipping just before the car comes to a halt.

I did have the pads done a couple of years ago.

It sounds like it's time to get the disks changed.

Thanks

Paul

[Druid Boy]

Rather than plump for an internet diagnosis it might be worth your while to have a local independant mechanic have a look at them. A thorough strip, clean and inspection should uncover the actual fault - if there is one. In the meantime if you want to reassure yourself that the brakes work well, find a nice quiet road and give them a good stomping at about 20 mph. If the ABS kicks in then your brakes are still strong, if a little strange just before stopping.

[hartsongs]

Yes I fully intend to do that. I'm not that hot at car mechanics but I know people who are. And I have a good local motor repair centre who will get to the core of the problem I'm sure. At speed, the brakes are fine, no noise...it's just that final few seconds before the car comes to a complete stop. Thanks

[hartsongs]

Hi everyone

The latest is that i still have the car and the brakes are still not right. A dealer/mechanic i know has said it's the ABS speed sensor.

Another look online says it could be the speed sensor 'locking up' so it thinks the car is travelling faster than it is. It says i should disable the ABS and see if the problem is still there. If it is then it's another brake problem.....if it's gone then it must be the ABS.

The car still passes MOT as the testing doesn't involve slow speeds like this. The issue i guess is how much it would cost to rectify the problem.

[Amande99]

Hi, this is much later than your post, but I'm wondering if you ever found out what the problem was? I am experiencing something similar with Toyota Avensis (08) and it's been to the garage for check 5 times, they can't find anything wrong with the brakes, but, like you put above, it did start after brake pads were replaced at the front, and after rear brake pipes. If you get this and can reply, I'd much appreciate. thanks so much, Amanda 

[avensis_2018]

Hi, ask them to check the part that holds the wheel, I forgot what it's called, sometimes from a bumpy road it takes a hit and twitches a little and then there are noises, you think it's from the brakes but it's not, you have to lift the car in the air and drive in the air, a mechanic will be directly underneath he will see it

[Amande99]

Hi, thanks so much Moshe, i will try asking that. Am having such difficulty getting to the root of the problem! Have narrowed it down to it only happening when I brake when driving slow.. like person above. I will find out and post here if your suggestion works.

 

[Seb_90]

I have the same issue (and I had it for a few years now). I am planning to take apart the brakes anf give them a good clean and apply new grease on brackets and support pins. Let's see if it works.

[avensis_2018]

Its not a brake parts issue ...

Fo what i told you and you will see it.

[Seb_90]

3 hours ago, avensis_2018 said:

Its not a brake parts issue ...

Fo what i told you and you will see it.

To be honest I didn't really understand which part are you talking about. Could you show it on a drawing?

 

Today I've cleaned the brakes. They were extremely dirty and covered in brake dust, it's all clean now it feels like the brake power has increased but the noise is stilll there.

I've noticed that on the RHS rear brakes there was one part missing, I've marked it red on the picture. Does anyone know what is this part for?

 

I might just order a repair kit and replace that particular pin:

[avensis_2018]

Its none of those parts sorry. You need the part that hold the wheel, this is out of balance and make the noise on the brakes, and make you think its comming from the brakes but its not, each turn of the wheel its touching the brakes parts because its not runing flat (this part get hit from the road bumpers and holes during driving).

Take the car up from the ground, drive it while it up the mechanic will see it right a way.

This is what you need:

https://www.autozone.com/suspension-steering-tire-and-wheel/wheel-bearing-hub-assembly-front/p/duralast-bearing-dl513155/95673_0_0

You will change all the brake parts and still it will stay the noise.

[TonyHSD]

18 hours ago, Seb_90 said:

To be honest I didn't really understand which part are you talking about. Could you show it on a drawing?

 

Today I've cleaned the brakes. They were extremely dirty and covered in brake dust, it's all clean now it feels like the brake power has increased but the noise is stilll there.

I've noticed that on the RHS rear brakes there was one part missing, I've marked it red on the picture. Does anyone know what is this part for?

 

I might just order a repair kit and replace that particular pin:

This is the pin rubber sleeve, it is there to prevent clicks when changing directions when slowing down from forward to reverse for example. Not a big deal of you haven’t got one, as long as you lube them correctly they will work  fine. 

[APS]

19 hours ago, Seb_90 said:

I might just order a repair kit and replace that particular pin:

That would certainly be worthwhile.

[avensis_2018]

Let us know ... enjoy.

[Seb_90]

On 5/5/2023 at 2:49 PM, avensis_2018 said:

Its none of those parts sorry. You need the part that hold the wheel, this is out of balance and make the noise on the brakes, and make you think its comming from the brakes but its not, each turn of the wheel its touching the brakes parts because its not runing flat (this part get hit from the road bumpers and holes during driving).

Take the car up from the ground, drive it while it up the mechanic will see it right a way.

This is what you need:

https://www.autozone.com/suspension-steering-tire-and-wheel/wheel-bearing-hub-assembly-front/p/duralast-bearing-dl513155/95673_0_0

You will change all the brake parts and still it will stay the noise.

In that case it won't be the hub assembly as such but or the ABS sensor or ABS ring. I will look into this.

[oldcodger]

Hi,

In the last couple of days just starting to get a very similar problem when coming to a stop during slow braking.

Initially did a web search and its suggested the problem is a weak / failing ABS sensor that when turning at a low speed cannot provide enough signal to the control unt.   

That made sense to us, though it does not result in an OBD error code being generated so no idea which sensor it may be, though we will be doing a resistance check on all 4 to see if that reveals anything.

One potential problem is that the rear sensors seem to be such a tight fit, many folk replace the whole hub which comes with a new sensor fitted.

Anyone know of a way to readily remove and fit just the rear sensor without stripping down the hub.

@avensis_2018 mentions a damaged front hub could also cause such a noise, but surely if there was such damage to the hub/bearing  wouldn't you hear a noise from the bearing when manually rotating the wheel  or when driving,  or some steering wheel vibration at speed when driving or braking , not to mention holding the wheel top and bottom and feeling for play etc ?

[avensis_2018]

No. No noise, just when you press the brake. Each turn of the wheel on the road, like it touch something. On/off.

Change this part that i told you and also the bearing because when you take it off, you need to replace the bearing also (must).

And then... will be quite.

Enjoy.

 

[Seb_90]

On 5/12/2023 at 12:39 AM, avensis_2018 said:

No. No noise, just when you press the brake. Each turn of the wheel on the road, like it touch something. On/off.

Change this part that i told you and also the bearing because when you take it off, you need to replace the bearing also (must).

And then... will be quite.

Enjoy.

 

Sorry but no. This is not a cheap part to replace just for the sake of it. If the wheel bearing is not making any noise when driving, why would it be noisy when braking, especially if it's not every time? If it is down to the part you've mentioned then it is the ABS ring or the ABS sensor. 

I've read on other forums it also can be worn out cylinder slider pins or the enlarged holes in cylinder mounting. 

I cleaned the brakes a few weeks ago and added new grease from LIQUI MOLY and the grinding got better but not fully gone.

 

[avensis_2018]

You will change everything and still this thing will stay, till you replace what i told you to, about the bearing, whan you take this part off the bearing will damage, this is the reason that you need to replace also to a new one.

But, do it on the hard way... gease,clean,change all brakes parts... in the end you will go back to the start, meantime enjoy the way 🙂

[oldcodger]

On 5/4/2023 at 10:03 PM, Seb_90 said:

To be honest I didn't really understand which part are you talking about. Could you show it on a drawing?

 

Today I've cleaned the brakes. They were extremely dirty and covered in brake dust, it's all clean now it feels like the brake power has increased but the noise is stilll there.

I've noticed that on the RHS rear brakes there was one part missing, I've marked it red on the picture. Does anyone know what is this part for?

 

 

 

 

Re your slider pins,  yes, you need the rubber on that pin as it helps absorb some vibration when braking.

What we have found is that its easy to get them mixed up with the solid  slider pin, the rubbered pin should be on the trailing edge of the caliper in respect to forwards motion, so we were told by a reliable source.  If the wrong way around they can cause some noise or uneven pad wear.

Mr. T used to sell slider pin kits.

Ideally you should use something rubber safe like Red grease or Silicone grease on those  pins.

 

[avensis_2018]

This is what will solve this problem. Change all this part with a new bearing.

Show it to your mechanic.

[oldcodger]

Well finally found the cause of our low speed braking problem similar to the OPs,  a slipping/broken Reluctor Ring on the front offside driveshaft, seems its a not too uncommon problem on many makes of car.