T27 disc and pad replacement

[dropvolley]

Not long found this great forum, hi to all.

It's time to replace the discs and pads on both axles. I have read some of the past threads here and found the great reference posted previously, here, showing that it is possible to reset the rear caliper/calibration without the oft touted epb diagnostic tool. So, with this in hand, I am fairly confident of getting it done ok. Got my Delphi pads/dics, wind back tool and dot 4 etc. I think I read the alloy wheel nuts are 135nm each (?). The only thing I don't have is torque settings for the caliper bolts/carrier bolts - any kind soul happen to have them to hand?

Any other pointers on the job gratefully received. Cheers.

[Greydog]

Morning

When I got the Avensis I downloaded a workshop manual it's for the T25 model but I wouldn't think the torque settings are that different. I have been struggling to upload the full page so have copied the relevant paragraph hope it helps.
  

Avensis Rear Brakes.pdf

[Greydog]

Dont know why but the drawings don't appear, hey ho aint technology great (when it works) and it will have nothing to do with my old blokes fat fingers!!

[Konrad C]

I had my rear disc replaced over a month ago:

So long as your car is manual, has early version of EPB where you have to activate when parking (no auto engage with switch off), you should have no issues.

You need a reverse thread calliper piston tool, and no torque wrenches were used. So long as the bolts are tightened you should be fine. 

In the link to my post, when first activating the EPB, it is best to pump the brake pedal a few times, then hold down during operation. You may get flashing symbols, but repeat.

I had my diagnostic tool on standby, but it was never needed.  

The fronts were even easier and they were done over a week before the rears:

No brake fluid was needed, as pushing the pistons forced the excess out of the reservoir. The brake only needed to be pumped as normal.

The brakes bed in well with gentle braking. After the bedding in time the bite comes back. It depends on the the brand of the brake pads.

[alan333]

7 hours ago, Konrad C said:

So long as your car is manual, has early version of EPB where you have to activate when parking (no auto engage with switch off), you should have no issues.

The auto EPB on the newer model can be switched off, IIRC the procedure is to hold the button ON or OFF for 10 secs or something.  It's in the owners manual.

[Konrad C]

I download the manual to compare some of the changes, and to cancel the auto apply, pull the EPB for more than 5 seconds whilst the key is in the ACC position. 

The following is the full instructions to turn the auto EPB on and off.

  Switching automatic apply mode Automatic apply mode is initially set to ON, but it can be switched between ON and OFF as the situation demands. Stop the vehicle in a horizontal condition and switch the “ENGINE START STOP” switch to IGNITION ON mode (vehicles with smart entry & start system), or switch the engine switch to the “ON” position (vehicles without smart entry and start system)  Temporary cancelation of the automatic apply function is available for specific circumstances (car wash, towing vehicle, etc.). To activate temporary cancelation, parking brake switch need to be pulled when “ENGINE START STOP” switch is switched to ACCESSORY mode (vehicles with smart entry & start system), or the engine switch is switched to the “ACC” position (vehicles without smart entry & start system). When switch is being pulled for 5 seconds or more, automatic apply mode changes from ON to OFF. STEP 1 When switching automatic apply mode from ON to OFF: Pull and hold the parking brake switch for 5 seconds or more The Auto P-off indicator light will illuminate. When switching automatic apply mode from OFF to ON: Push and hold the parking brake switch for 5 seconds or more The Auto P-off indicator light will go off.

[dropvolley]

Thanks to all for your contribution....very helpful. If anyone reads this on the bump and has the actual/verified torques of the carrier and caliper bolts for this model (or knows where I can get them), it'd be great if you could add them to the thread.

Cheers.

[TomdeGuerre]

It always disturbs me just a tad when I read someone asking about the torque figures when they’re working on their brakes. You should be able to judge how tight to put these things or else stay away from working on your brakes. You should have the confidence of ‘feel’ for tightening calliper bolts etc. 

I remember a guy along the street working on his Audi once replacing the steering bottom ball joints which were held on with three bolts that went into a nut plate at the bottom of the strut. He looked up his Haynes manual and got a torque of something like 30 in/lbs and was struggling to get a torque wrench on them so I advised him just to tighten by hand, even offered to do it for him if he wasn’t confident. But, no, he insisted they had to be torqued up. Next thing he stripped the threads because he set the Tq wrench at 30 ft/lbs so had to send away for a new nut plate. 
 

[Konrad C]

5 minutes ago, TomdeGuerre said:

It always disturbs me just a tad when I read someone asking about the torque figures when they’re working on their brakes. You should be able to judge how tight to put these things or else stay away from working on your brakes. You should have the confidence of ‘feel’ for tightening calliper bolts etc. 

I remember a guy along the street working on his Audi once replacing the steering bottom ball joints which were held on with three bolts that went into a nut plate at the bottom of the strut. He looked up his Haynes manual and got a torque of something like 30 in/lbs and was struggling to get a torque wrench on them so I advised him just to tighten by hand, even offered to do it for him if he wasn’t confident. But, no, he insisted they had to be torqued up. Next thing he stripped the threads because he set the Tq wrench at 30 ft/lbs so had to send away for a new nut plate. 
 

I love your posts Tom. Every thing you said here is very valid. 

Apart from doing things like engine head bolts, most times you only need to tighten a bolt just right, by feel. You won't feel old bolts about to shear when using a torque wrench. For brake, suspension and most other components, I never use a torque wrench. Well I did use it for leverage, before I obtained various power bars. These are what I now use. Treat the torque figures as a guide and use your own judgement.  

[TomdeGuerre]

Steady up there Konrad, you'll be giving me un cabeza grande if there's much more of that 

 

 

[dropvolley]

6 hours ago, TomdeGuerre said:

It always disturbs me just a tad when I read someone asking about the torque figures when they’re working on their brakes. You should be able to judge how tight to put these things or else stay away from working on your brakes. You should have the confidence of ‘feel’ for tightening calliper bolts etc. 

I can appreciate what you are saying Tom. And while I have done brake jobs on previous vehicles without them, I see no reason not to go by the manufacturers tested specifications if they are available. Also, I think that for those of us that are more than capable of doing the job - but who don't do as much spanner work as others - it gives a certain peace-of-mind.

To each their own!

[TomdeGuerre]

Yes, absolutely; I meant no offence but when you give advice on here you assume the OP has a certain level of competence. I’ve seen people cross thread brake pipe unions and banjo bolt connections and merrily screw them up trying to tighten them without any feel that something’s wrong; same with spark plugs, especially in alloy cylinder heads. So unfortunately there’s some people out there who are all thumbs and miss the toilet a lot but who don’t hesitate to “maintain” their vehicles.

Any garage will be able to tell you horror stories of cars that’s been brought in leaking, knocking, misfiring, juddering etc yet it’s the garages that get the bad rap in the public’s eye.

[stealthbyroot]

If I understood correctly....to be able to push rear piston back to change brake pads I will need to turn EPB OFF? Is it this correct or I need to do something else?

[Konrad C]

On 12/13/2020 at 8:55 PM, stealthbyroot said:

If I understood correctly....to be able to push rear piston back to change brake pads I will need to turn EPB OFF? Is it this correct or I need to do something else?

Yes. The EPB has to be off, just like ordinary parking(hand) brake, because you cannot work on the brakes with it on! The earlier EPB which has auto off and manual apply, just don't engage the EPB. The late version with both auto release and engage, there is a service mode to keep the EPB released. It is covered in the owners manual - 

I have change the rear brakes a couple of years ago, and you need the left and right handed piston wind back kit, as shown in the photo -     

Also when winding the piston back, make sure the cuts in the piston are in the correct position, to aid assembly and not cause wear and operating problems.

Piston in correct position in relation to the calliper -      

The next photo show incorrect position of the piston - 

I make this point because, I have replaced brakes on cars that wore uneven angle on the inner brake pad, down to the backing plate, while the outer pad had at least 70 -80% material left!