Extortionate main dealer service cost increases

[Mictor Veldrew]

Hi,

I wasn't entirely sure where to place this topic as I'm just getting used to the forum software and sub-forum titles so if it's not the right place I would be grateful if a moderator could locate it to its rightful home.

The truth is I'm a bit put out with Toyota and after budgeting to buy a new car last year, one of the main concerns was future servicing costs for my Auris Icon 1.4D.

The leaflet I was showed, and which was with my documents upon purchase, clearly states the cost of a full service to be £205 and whilst we're all reasonable people who would expect some movement on cost I think a hike of 61% from £205 to £330 is pretty indefensible...

I have contacted Toyota Servicing who have informed me that this is because the service now includes brake fluid and a pollen filter!

Erm...

I don't think that quite accounts for it somehow.

This is my third Toyota which I have purchased from new but it will be my last as I feel that I have been misled on the purchase and abandoned as an existing Toyota customer.

I'm awaiting a response from Toyota UK.

Am I being unreasonable?

If so then I cannot afford to be reasonable.

Does anyone have any tips or recommendations for non-main dealer servicing as I would be very grateful to hear them? 

Many thanks in advance.

[MSHasan]

I have to say I am in total agreement, the price hike is quite ridiculous in my opinion. I was thankfully lucky enough to have bought a service plan this year, just prior to the hike, which incluides three services as well as MOTs. All in, this amounts to £175 a year for the next three years. It works out cheaper overall and with the added benefit of spreading the cost.

You should call around to different dealers (prefereably from different operators - Jemca, Hills etc.) and ask for a quote for a service plan. Enquire as to what is included as well, some include brake fluid and AC service etc.

[FROSTYBALLS]

Prior to the changes in April 2016, the bi-annual/20,000 mile brake fluid change and the cabin air filter replacement were maintenance options at £40 and £39 respectively, and weren't included within the Full service which is due at 2 years/20,000 miles (whichever occurs first). If one were to have both included with the full service, that would have increased the cost from £205 to £284. Whilst not trying to justify the cost increase in April 2016, comparing this higher cost (£284) with the April 2016 increase to £330 - this equates to a 16% increase in costs.

From memory the costs had been held for approx 2 years. As with any manufacturer, Toyota will increase prices from time to time, and what may have been the costs last year, may be different to costs this year, and possibly next year, etc.

The new costs are - https://www.toyota.co.uk/caring-for-your-toyota/service-and-maintenance/car-servicing.json

and one can also download a comparison table which informs what is included at each level of service (intermediate, full, full+).

Most dealers now offer Toyota's fixed price servicing scheme, so there may be little variation in costs between Toyota dealers.

Of course, one way one could have fixed the servicing costs to those on offer last year, would have been the taking out of a service plan.  With the 2012 Auris I have just changed, I had a three year service plan based on Toyota's Fixed Price Servicing costs, and the cost of each service under that plan was actually less than the costs in your leaflet.

Having had a fair number of new cars over the years (19 new cars), we found that the service costs of the Auris were cheaper than the service costs of our 2007 Mazda 2, and our 2012 Hyundai i20. As an example of current costs, three years servicing on a Honda diesel equates to £765, and on an Auris diesel £690. This is based on the servicing being done on the time basis rather than the mileage basis - I presume your car is on the mileage basis.

One can of course have servicing carried out by any VAT registered garage and still maintain one's new car warranty. However, should a warranty claim be needed where the service record had a bearing on the claim, one would have to have proof that the servicing had been carried out in accordance with Toyota's service requirements. This same requirements apply to other manufacturers.

[eygo]

the prices are moving more inline with lexus,the Ct i used to have cost £195 for the intermediate and £345 for the full service

and the CT is basically an Auris in designer clothes so why the difference, these are the price i have been charged in the past

for my IS the service prices are £245 & £445 ,you cant tell me there is more service on mine than on any other car so why do they

charge more....... BECAUSE they can.

[Mictor Veldrew]

23 hours ago, FROSTYBALLS said:

Prior to the changes in April 2016, the bi-annual/20,000 mile brake fluid change and the cabin air filter replacement were maintenance options at £40 and £39 respectively, and weren't included within the Full service which is due at 2 years/20,000 miles (whichever occurs first). If one were to have both included with the full service, that would have increased the cost from £205 to £284. Whilst not trying to justify the cost increase in April 2016, comparing this higher cost (£284) with the April 2016 increase to £330 - this equates to a 16% increase in costs.

From memory the costs had been held for approx 2 years. As with any manufacturer, Toyota will increase prices from time to time, and what may have been the costs last year, may be different to costs this year, and possibly next year, etc.

The new costs are - https://www.toyota.co.uk/caring-for-your-toyota/service-and-maintenance/car-servicing.json

and one can also download a comparison table which informs what is included at each level of service (intermediate, full, full+).

Most dealers now offer Toyota's fixed price servicing scheme, so there may be little variation in costs between Toyota dealers.

Of course, one way one could have fixed the servicing costs to those on offer last year, would have been the taking out of a service plan.  With the 2012 Auris I have just changed, I had a three year service plan based on Toyota's Fixed Price Servicing costs, and the cost of each service under that plan was actually less than the costs in your leaflet.

Having had a fair number of new cars over the years (19 new cars), we found that the service costs of the Auris were cheaper than the service costs of our 2007 Mazda 2, and our 2012 Hyundai i20. As an example of current costs, three years servicing on a Honda diesel equates to £765, and on an Auris diesel £690. This is based on the servicing being done on the time basis rather than the mileage basis - I presume your car is on the mileage basis.

One can of course have servicing carried out by any VAT registered garage and still maintain one's new car warranty. However, should a warranty claim be needed where the service record had a bearing on the claim, one would have to have proof that the servicing had been carried out in accordance with Toyota's service requirements. This same requirements apply to other manufacturers.

Many thanks for your replies.

Frosty...

Were those additional maintenance options which are now compulsory as part of the full/20k service and which you refer to in your first paragraph previously known as something along the lines of "Full Service +"?

If so then it appears that a new "Full Service +" has taken its place at an even higher cost.

I completely accept your point about the percentage increase reducing from 61% to 16% once these now compulsory "options" have been added in but that's just the thing... Toyota have removed that flexibility which will throw into disarray any prudent financial planning by the customer and will charge the customer this higher price regardless.

For representation purposes I think that Toyota have completely missed the point in that a reasonably accurate estimate of compulsory future servicing costs, to ensure the validity of the warranty, makes up a significant part of the purchasing decision.

If Toyota had anything other than their own profits ahead of customer interests at heart then I really can't see how they would mislead customers in this way, usually a balanced mix of self and customer interest makes for a successful company/customer relationship.

Ok, if Toyota suddenly recommend additional work on the full service then simply leave it as an option instead of ramping up ever increasing schedules and charges which will over burden customers who have based a purchasing decision on data supplied and actively promoted by Toyota themselves.

Toyota are the ones who actively push these figures over the sales desk in order to gain advantage.

And let's not forget that each of these additional component parts of a service represents profit for Toyota, not a concept which I am in any way against but very much one which I think is misleading to the consumer to say the least.

A downright misrepresentation with forethought of strategic and systematic pocket picking would be my preferred definition.

The bottom line is that whatever is or isn't included in the Full Service, Toyota demonstrated to me and gave me literature to the effect that it would cost me £205 for a full/20k service and my purchasing decision was made based on this and other significant factors but I am now left high and dry by a ridiculously inflated figure of £330 without the option of doing anything about it, if I want to keep within main dealer servicing.

That to me is straightforward misrepresentation and, for the practical purpose of budgeting, becomes a complete farce.

At the end of the day we all know what's going on, as an easy example: A profit margin of 10% of £205 is £20.50 and 10% of £330 is £33 so Toyota are quids in, just attempt to justify the additional servicing inclusions at the same margin and we're all off to Barbados courtesy of you know who.

Ok rant over, that was not directed at you Frosty as I know you said you weren't trying to justify the additional cost and I appreciate the replies.

[Heidfirst]

3 hours ago, Mictor Veldrew said:

At the end of the day we all know what's going on, as an easy example: A profit margin of 10% of £205 is £20.50 and 10% of £330 is £33 so Toyota are quids in,

You need to differentiate between Toyota, who won't make anything extra out of servicing (other than perhaps supplying the dealers an extra bit of brake fluid & an odd air filter - most people will already have had these done as they were recommended) & the dealers. Also, bear in mind that dealers are free to offer lower prices for these services than Toyota suggest.

[FROSTYBALLS]

The Full+ service now includes a coolant change - which will be required at 10 years/100,000 miles and after that every 6 years/60,000 miles (5 years/50,000 miles for BMW sourced diesels).

Toyota's Fixed Price Servicing scheme has only been in place for approx 4-5 years. Prior to this dealers set their own service prices, so there was more variance in costs between dealers - and less consistency for Toyota customers.

As regards the maintenance options, the brake fluid change has been due at every 2 years/20,000 miles for a number of years - certainly at least since 2006 when I returned to Toyota after buying a new Corolla. Since the introduction of Fixed Price Servicing, it has been common practice for dealers to include this maintenance option on top of the 2 year/20,000 mile service - so, at the pre-April prices, one would have paid £245 for this level of service, rather than the £205 in your leaflet.

[mickburkesnr]

9 hours ago, Mictor Veldrew said:

At the end of the day we all know what's going on, as an easy example: A profit margin of 10% of £205 is £20.50 and 10% of £330 is £33 so Toyota are quids in, just attempt to justify the additional servicing inclusions at the same margin and we're all off to Barbados courtesy of you know who.

Thats not how it works.

You have a workforce who, like yourself and many others, wouldn't be happy if their hourly rate didn't change. So the hourly rate almost always goes up, even by a few pence per hour. But it's a few pence per hour across their entire work force - a few thousand? The increase in pay for the receptionist is taken in to account along with the cleaners, mechanics, sales staff etc, and the price is reflected across the offering of the company.

You then also have to take in to account the pension rules, where "If you pay in, your boss pays in too". So a few pence an hour rise is doubled more or less by this scheme.

You then take in to account rising costs of energy to the dealership, rates etc. And that's before you consider the cost of the manufacturing and production of the service items. They will, inevitably, go up as well - because they too have a work force.

Finally, you take the shareholders. Which, in my opinion, is the worst reason for a price increase. They have put in £100 for their own money in to Toyota for example, what they want to see happen is that £100 turn in to £200. If Toyota, continously, said "We haven't made any money from servicing this year" for 5 years, it means their profits are flat or decreasing. This makes them less of an attractive investment. The people who invested their £100 on the hopes it'll go up get annoyed, sell their shares, price of the shares go down, the value of Toyota goes down too.

It's easy to look at the cost and think "Well a pollen filter costs £10, what the hell is £100 increase doing on this bill?" but there are lots of things that are incorporated in to the cost. Some of which you can't avoid. Personally I don't go to dealerships to service cars, I do it myself. But there is easily an hour or two's work involved in doing one car even for a basic service. It might be expensive yes, but if you consider why they raised you can see why. But we're in a wonderful position of choosing what we do or where we go with our cars, so if it's expensive there will be an alternative.

[fordulike]

12 hours ago, FROSTYBALLS said:

The Full+ service now includes a coolant change - which will be required at 10 years/100,000 miles and after that every 6 years/60,000 miles (5 years/50,000 miles for BMW sourced diesels).

Toyota's Fixed Price Servicing scheme has only been in place for approx 4-5 years. Prior to this dealers set their own service prices, so there was more variance in costs between dealers - and less consistency for Toyota customers.

As regards the maintenance options, the brake fluid change has been due at every 2 years/20,000 miles for a number of years - certainly at least since 2006 when I returned to Toyota after buying a new Corolla. Since the introduction of Fixed Price Servicing, it has been common practice for dealers to include this maintenance option on top of the 2 year/20,000 mile service - so, at the pre-April prices, one would have paid £245 for this level of service, rather than the £205 in your leaflet.

So, does my Aygo which has done 25k, require the Full or Full+ at the 4 year service?

Surely if coolant doesn't get replaced until 100k, then I would be paying for something that won't get done. The reason why I think I require the Full+ is the spark plugs.

[FROSTYBALLS]

Toyota appear to have re-jigged the Full and Full+ services, and made it less clear to the customer when the Full+ service should occur. With the coolant replacement being included in the Full+ service, I would guess this level of service isn't required till 10 years/100,000 miles

For example, the Full and Full+ services now include a 4 wheel alignment check, I don't think was in the old schedule, and spark plugs are inspected, not replaced. There is no maintenance option for replacing spark plugs. Missed the maintenance option for spark plug replacement - it is £60 depending on model.

I'm going to raise a query with Toyota GB and ask for clarification that can be posted on Toyota Owners Club.

 

[fordulike]

13 minutes ago, FROSTYBALLS said:

Toyota appear to have re-jigged the Full and Full+ services, and made it less clear to the customer when the Full+ service should occur. With the coolant replacement being included in the Full+ service, I would guess this level of service isn't required till 10 years/100,000 miles

For example, the Full and Full+ services now include a 4 wheel alignment check, which I don't think was in the old schedule, and spark plugs are inspected, not replaced. There is no maintenance option for replacing spark plugs.

I'm going to raise a query with Toyota GB and ask for clarification that can be posted on Toyota Owners Club.

 

I did e-mail Toyota GB, but got the generic, see your local dealer crap. You might have some extra pulling power Frosty, to get some decent info out of them.

I just wish they would do a basic fixed priced service, with the option to throw in extras like brake fluid change. I only had my brake fluid changed a few months ago, so now I'll have to negotiate a reduction in the 4 year service price, as it won't need doing.

Transparency is what car owners want.

[Mictor Veldrew]

Going back to the basic principle of the matter and asking the same question in a slightly different way...

Is it right for main dealers to use promotional literature which is a marketing tool and is specifically designed to give indicative figures for future servicing costs when they then go and alter the servicing schedules with the consequence that they no longer even resemble the initial figures?

Clearly I'm of a mind that it's misrepresentation with escape by loophole, the loophole being that the schedule is different.

The Toyota marketing literature is designed to do two things:

!) Assist Toyota sales staff to demonstrate low service costs

2) Inform the prospective customer of service costs in order that they can budget accordingly and choose a vehicle within the range of their affordability

In this case the literature did an excellent job for Toyota and a awful one for me which I feel is wholly irresponsible considering affordability and finances are involved.

Irrespective of what's now included that wasn't, what the next level now includes and so on, there was nothing to stop Toyota simply leaving them as optional extras which would have allowed me at least to stay within main dealer servicing and those that required the extras to simply choose them.

I don't disagree with what mickburkesnr wrote about additional costs having to be covered but Toyota will need to be putting their prices up again as they've just lost a customer on both the servicing and future new purchases and I'm well aware of business strategy that factors in the consequence of loss of business due to unpopular policy, for an overall gain across the board.

Having previously pre-ordered and owned two RAV4's this was my third new Toyota, it will be my last as I feel that I can no longer trust them especially where budgeting figures are concerned. 

[FROSTYBALLS]

47 minutes ago, Mictor Veldrew said:

Is it right for main dealers to use promotional literature which is a marketing tool and is specifically designed to give indicative figures for future servicing costs when they then go and alter the servicing schedules with the consequence that they no longer even resemble the initial figures?

At the end of the day, dealers can only use leaflets, etc which are current at the time - this is the same regardless of manufacturer or product. The same scenario also applies to model brochures. Usually there is some disclaimer on the leaflet, brochure or whatever is being used, to say the manufacturer reserves the right to make changes without notice.

Things do change.

A service plan provides a way an owner can fix their servicing costs at whatever level is current at the time, and spread the cost over a period, if that is what they wish, Of course it is the owner's choice whether or not they take out a service plan, but, if they don't, they do face the risk of increased cost further down the line. Personal choice.

[FROSTYBALLS]

I've contacted Toyota GB and asked for clarification around the service schedules that may be posted on Toyota Owners Club. I've also suggested that something is posted on the Toyota UK Blog that explains to Toyota owners what changes have been made to the Fixed Price Service, which hopefully, should make non-members aware of the changes.

We'll have to wait to see what response we get.

[Mictor Veldrew]

Ok, thanks again for your help fellas.

I am battling it out directly with some poor soul at Toyota UK as I still believe it's misrepresentation (even where the holder of the terms & conditions states a right to caveats such as price movements those caveats still need to be deemed as fair to both parties in order to be upheld but we're getting into heavy legal stuff there).

I'm off fishing in all that lovely rain tomorrow, whatever you're doing I hope you all have a great weekend

[Heidfirst]

6 hours ago, FROSTYBALLS said:

Toyota appear to have re-jigged the Full and Full+ services,

Yes, I thought that too.

& of course they also introduced the cheaper Essential Care services for older (5+) vehicles earlier this year.

[Mictor Veldrew]

In a cynical attempt to regain out of warranty business that would otherwise be going elsewhere on price issues?

Apologies for my own cynicism there, purely born out of personal experience of course

[Heidfirst]

Given that Toyota GB themselves don't seem likely to gain much from increased servicing costs I think that you are perhaps being overly cynical.

I would investigate the cost of a service plan/I would negotiate with your dealer on individual services (yes, it can be done certainly with some dealers) or you can investigate local independents. As long as the servicing is done to Toyota's regime with parts of equal or better specification it will keep your warranty intact. What using an independent will not do is build "goodwill" for any out of warranty issues plus there may be certain things that require access to brand-specific equipment that an independent may not consider cost effective to own.

[FROSTYBALLS]

On 19/08/2016 at 8:33 PM, Heidfirst said:

Yes, I thought that too.

& of course they also introduced the cheaper Essential Care services for older (5+) vehicles earlier this year.

 

23 minutes ago, Mictor Veldrew said:

In a cynical attempt to regain out of warranty business that would otherwise be going elsewhere on price issues?

Apologies for my own cynicism there, purely born out of personal experience of course

No different to manufacturers such as Volkswagen (3 year plus), Ford (Motorcraft 4+), and Hyundai (5 year+ servicing) offering cheaper schemes for out of warranty servicing

[Heidfirst]

for everyone's info: my car had it's last service under it's old service plan today so I enquired of my dealer what they could offer.

Reply: 2 services (1 Full, 1 Intermediate) & 2 MOTs for £339. Bear in mind that the current suggested list price for a Full service for my car is £330 on it's own ...

Needless to say that I have taken them up on the offer. OK, they have my money up front but at current interest rates it is earning nothing in the bank anyway & the price can't go up on me. Potential saving £280 or 45% (yes, I know that you can get an MOT for £20 rather than the DVLA max. of £55, allowing for that it's still £210 saved.)  

Moral - ask your dealer about a service plan!

 

[Mictor Veldrew]

With regards to service plans, I took out a three year plan when I bought my BMW and this represented two oil changes for £650, hence electing not to with the Toyota Auris.

As far as I am concerned the Toyota "Fixed Price Servicing" leaflet which heavily influenced my decision to purchase this vehicle, should mean just that and not an increase of 61% when I come to book the vehicle in.

To take a quote from their marketing literature...

"The price is the price, Toyota fixed price service means what it means. No surprises.".

Not so, it appears... Although Toyota could get away with validating the "No surprises" part on the basis that it was actually a shock, not a surprise.

There are no disclaimers or caveats to the effect of alteration to the schedules within this demonstration of costs, just the figure that it will cost me £205, not £330.

I've given Toyota UK  a bit of a prod today as they hadn't replied to my last email from the 19th, as a result I have now started proceedings against them and whilst it would be unsuitable to comment whilst these are on going I will come back to let everyone know the eventual outcome and on what basis the decision was reached, regardless of who's favour it is in.

All the best.

[FROSTYBALLS]

As you say you've started proceedings against Toyota, and fell it unwise to comment until the outcome is known, the thread has been locked.

[FROSTYBALLS]

See the following thread for information on the revised Toyota Fixed Price Servicing Intermediate, Full and Full+ services -