Avensis 2.2 D4D T25 Replacement Vehicle

[jonnyboy95]

Hi All,

I am thinking about  replacing my Avensis T25 2.2 D4D manual T Spirit estate with a T27 Excel 2.2 D4D estate or the latest BMW N47 Excel 2.0 D  estate, or possibly dare I say this, on this forum, a Mercedes E220 CDI Avantgarde estate :).

My current car has been very reliable and I have been very impressed with it. I purchased my T spirit nearly 5 years ago with 43K miles now at 149K miles but still going strong, I work as a Service Engineer and this vehicle has been a great motorway car that has and still is (touch wood) proving to be very reliable, with mostly only routine servicing required. I've had it regularly serviced at my local dealer during my ownership and they have proved so far to be very good.

I am getting a bit bored with my vehicle and I'd just like to upgrade to the some of the newer features that are available now.

I very nearly brought a T27 Excel estate about 2/3 months ago but  the expected vehicle failed to materialize.

But now I am also considering an E class diesel estate mostly due to the load carrying capacity.

I just wondered what people's thoughts were on the T27 2.2 D4D estate or the new N47 (BMW engine'd) 2.0 D estate. I accept that the T25 is probably going to more reliable than the later generations of Avensis, but then there is less to go wrong than the later generations.

I've seen various threads on here about the EPB but they appear to be an issue for every manufacturer that fits them now, so I'm not that concerned about this cost cutting short coming.  I am interested though in people's  general perception of the later generations of Avensis compared to my version (T25 D4D 2.2) in other areas:-

1. Door hinges cracking on T27 ?

2. Servicing costs for later generations of Avensis compared to my T25 ?

3. Ease of servicing, repairs costs ect. of later generations compared to the T25. I've cleaned my EGR valve myself and replaced discs and pads when I've felt sufficiently motivated, (which is occasionally), however the local dealer has carried out all servicing.

4.Any other reliability trends being observed ?

4. Does anyone have the estate's boot dimensions with the rear seats up for the later generation Avensis please ? I believe my estate's boot capacity is 520 litres ? and the later generation estate is 543 litres ? but I would like the dimensions as well to compare. I know I can go down to my local dealer and measure up but I have this new fangled internet thingy so I just thought I'd ask :)

Hopefully you've not all lost the will to live having read my long and rambling post.... if anyone is still awake after reading this :) your feedback would be very much appreciated by this fully fledged anorak wearing geek :)

Many Thanks in advance,

Jon

 

 

 

[Heidfirst]

8 hours ago, jonnyboy95 said:

 

I've seen various threads on here about the EPB but they appear to be an issue for every manufacturer that fits them now, so I'm not that concerned about this cost cutting short coming.  I am interested though in people's  general perception of the later generations of Avensis compared to my version (T25 D4D 2.2) in other areas:-

Satnav has prettier display, but imo less usable. Tbh better off with Google Maps.

Still miss the handy cup holder on the dash  Generally seems less  usable oddments storage.

Lights better.  Brakes better. Tonneau cover better (lugs don't break the same as on the T25).

Imo if you only drive solo or with 1 passenger in front  panoramic roof on Excel not worth having. On an Excel you'll probably get 18" alloys & 45 series tyres - imo you are better with 17" alloys & 55 series. You can't put rear fog light on only without fronts (iirc you could on the T25).

On an Excel you'll probably get a puncture repair kit rather than a spare (the panoramic roof adds weight) - whilst you can buy a spare easily enough sourcing the different foam tray is harder (at least at a reasonable price).

Limited choice of replacement wiper blades - I don't really consider it a problem but some might. You can buy a Bosch rear blade for £~6 & the 2 Bosch fronts for ~£21/pr if you keep your eye out for deals (I actually just this week bought the fronts for £18 delivered).

1. Door hinges cracking on T27 ?

Not the hinges themselves but the door skin near the restrictor stay/hinges. They do exist but as with head/headgasket issues on AD series diesels (up until 2009) they appear to affect only a very small % of cars. Within warranty Toyota appears to have been very good at remedying. Supposed to have been addressed in the 2012 MY facelift but there have been reports even on those.

2. Servicing costs for later generations of Avensis compared to my T25 ?

Toyota's listed service/fixed price repair prices are the same for T25 & T27. Mine is on a service plan as it worked out markedly cheaper for me but may be different for you as you are doing more miles p.a..

3. Ease of servicing, repairs costs ect. of later generations compared to the T25. I've cleaned my EGR valve myself and replaced discs and pads when I've felt sufficiently motivated, (which is occasionally), however the local dealer has carried out all servicing.

Dealer does all my work but I believe changing rear brakes is a bit more complicated due to EPB.

4.Any other reliability trends being observed ? 

Really the only 2 seem to be door cracks & EPB actuator (again very few & apparently usually from water ingress). Other than that the 2AD is a modern-ish common rail turbodiesel so can be affected by issues common to any of those (EGR, DPF, DMF etc. etc.) but you know that as that is what you currently have (possibly without DPF though). Can't speak for the N47 derived engines.

4. Does anyone have the estate's boot dimensions with the rear seats up for the later generation Avensis please ? I believe my estate's boot capacity is 520 litres ? and the later generation estate is 543 litres ? but I would like the dimensions as well to compare. I know I can go down to my local dealer and measure up but I have this new fangled internet thingy so I just thought I'd ask :)

I have a very nicely marked photo but not instantly to hand. However, length 1105, width 1550 height 765 & capacity rear seat up is 543l (1609 seat down)

 

 

 

 

 

[jonnyboy95]

Hi Heidfirst,

thank you very much for very informative reply, sorry as you say its the door skins that appear to fracture near the door restraint, not the hinges as I stated.

This does give me some real world feedback to think about in terms of pros and cons for the T27 compared to the T25.

I think overall the T27 is a very good car. I never understand the motoring press's apparent bias against the Avensis, basically the Avensis is set up to provide a reliable, high quality, comfortable means of getting you from A to B. I'm not that bothered that a Mondeo or a Passat is a 'more engaging drive' (whatever that means) when compared to the Avensis. I am bothered by the quality of the engineering that goes on underneath. I work for a Japanese manufacturer and I can appreciate the way that Japanese companies approach their design, development, engineering and manufacturing of any item.

Let's just say the balance of power between the engineers and the accountants is biased slightly more towards the individuals that use a spanner and a slide rule rather than the individuals that use a spreadsheet and a calculator in my humble opinion.

Thanks again for your observations.

[estate]

I've had 6 Toyota's since 1985, 5 were built in Japan and were totally reliable, one was built in UK and you can't compare it against its Japanese counterpart for built quality. Saying that non Japanese built Toyota's are still reliable cars, they are just slipping down league each year and other manufacturers are producing more reliable cars. 

[Konrad C]

The door strap cracks are present on my car, and it is the paint cracking due to the metal flexing. It has not bothered me and I have used large washers to spread the load. 

The EPB is not an issue so long as you don't go through a flooded road or ford. I am careful when washing the car, but overall no problems. Changed the rear disc and pads with no issues. Make sure you have a reverse thread brake piston tool for the left side brake. Later models have a service mode, as stated in the handbook IIRC.

If I was to install a large item say a wardrobe, the maximum size would be 185 cm length, 95 cm width, and 65 cm height. This is taking into the tailgate aperture, the slant of the rear window and the wheel arches. Items below the window line can be longer, to 190 cm or 195 cm to centre console, depending on front seat position.

Toyota brochures quote load measurements slightly differently, and I can't make heads or tail, because they mixed the width and length figures - 1105 mm and 1550 mm plus 765 mm with deck board removed. I wonder if the deck board is the cover for the under floor storage trays. The floor is flat from the rear door to the edge of the rear seats when they are down, so I leave them in place. I use the under floor storage anyway.    

[jonnyboy95]

Sorry for my late reply, thanks for all the replies, very much appreciated.

Best Regards