Prius Hybrid battery costs

[Andy1111]

Hi all, this is my first post.  I am considering buying a Prius hybrid for about £4k - £5k. 

At this price we're talking 2008/9. Probably 80k on the clock. 

I'm very impressed by the mpg, but the Battery replacement costs worry me.  

I've read things like they guarantee the Battery up to 100k, and a replacement could be around  £2500 + the inverter or whatever. eBay prices vary. 

Is this right? Can anyone tell me what the real situation is, or some idea? Are there any reliable online resources I can check? If I need a replacement is Toyota the best place to go or are there companies who specialise in this? 

Thanks. 

Andy

[Heidfirst]

Hi Andy, welcome to TOC 

if you continue to get Hybrid Health Checks at a dealer (free with a service or £45 standalone) the warranty for the Hybrid Battery will be valid for upto 11 years/unlimited mileage. https://www.toyota.co.uk/owners/warranty/toyota-warranty.json

& as the car would be over 5 years old it qualifies for the cheaper Toyota Essential Care dealer servicing https://www.toyota.co.uk/owners/service-mot-maintenance/servicing.json#servicing-widget-anchor

[Cyker]

The Battery system has been pretty reliable; I think literally every HSD owner on this forum is still on the original Battery, even the Mk1 and Mk2 owners!

I did think when they first came out that they'd only last a year or two but even the Mk2s are still running around with most of the charge available.

Unless you are supremely unlucky, I suspect you will change cars long before you ever need to worry about changing the Battery.

From memory, I can't actually recall a single person on this forum ever having to replace the battery...
 

[Andy1111]

13 minutes ago, Heidfirst said:

Hi Andy, welcome to TOC 

if you continue to get Hybrid Health Checks at a dealer (free with a service or £45 standalone) the warranty for the Hybrid battery will be valid for upto 11 years/unlimited mileage. https://www.toyota.co.uk/owners/warranty/toyota-warranty.json

& as the car would be over 5 years old it qualifies for the cheaper Toyota Essential Care dealer servicing https://www.toyota.co.uk/owners/service-mot-maintenance/servicing.json#servicing-widget-anchor

Thanks very much Heidfirst. But if I'm buying a 10 year old car, that 11 year Battery warranty will only  have 1 year left?

And as I understand it, I'd be paying £185 per year just for a CHECK, but this doesn't reduce the repair bill which would potentially be at least £2k if the checks reveal a problem with the Battery. 

Or have I misunderstood?  

[Andy1111]

2 minutes ago, Cyker said:

The battery system has been pretty reliable; I think literally every HSD owner on this forum is still on the original battery, even the Mk1 and Mk2 owners!

I did think when they first came out that they'd only last a year or two but even the Mk2s are still running around with most of the charge available.

Unless you are supremely unlucky, I suspect you will change cars long before you ever need to worry about changing the battery.

From memory, I can't actually recall a single person on this forum ever having to replace the battery...
 

Cyker, that's really reassuring thanks. How old are the mark 1 and 2's? I'm still mugging up. 

I'd be very interested in any bad experiences. I'm trying to look at the probability on the worse case scenario. 

What can I do to avoid problems when buying  at a second hand garage? 

[Heidfirst]

34 minutes ago, Andy1111 said:

Thanks very much Heidfirst. But if I'm buying a 10 year old car, that 11 year battery warranty will only  have 1 year left?

True, but how many 10 year old cars will have any warranty on their engine ...? The fact that Toyota will warranty it for 11 years/unlimited miles says that they are pretty confident that it will go even longer than that & they will not have to pay out ...

And as I understand it, I'd be paying £185 per year just for a CHECK, but this doesn't reduce the repair bill which would potentially be at least £2k if the checks reveal a problem with the battery.

No, depending upon mileages you would be paying £120 for a complete Silver Service or £200 for a complete Gold Service both of which include the Hybrid Health Check for free (or if you want to do your own servicing you can pay £45 to have the HHC done as a standalone item). The HHC is required to extend the warranty up to the 11 years but thereafter of course the HHC is no longer required because there would be no warranty extension. If a problem with the battery is found within the 11 years & it has had current HHC my understanding (& to be fair I don't run a hybrid) is that it will be fixed under warranty foc.

Another link for you https://www.toyota.co.uk/hybrid/hybrid-faq/batteries.json

 

[FROSTYBALLS]

Moved to the Prius club.

[danowat]

I'm a member of a Prius group on FaceBook, and there are a lot of members, particularly in the States, that have 200-300k miles on the original Battery pack, and it's still going strong, and reports of taxis with 400k on them on the original pack.

There seems to be a fallacy that the Battery pack is a consumable item, the reality (at least from what I've seen) is far from that, and the Battery packs generally outlive the vehicle.

That's not to say that the don't go wrong, but do you look into the price of replacing an engine when you consider buying a run of the mill ICE car?

There are a number of places that will repair packs now, it's usually a number of cells that go bad, rather than the pack as a whole, and there are people who DIY it, so even if the pack did go bad, you don't need to factor in a replacement from Toyota.

[Andy1111]

3 hours ago, danowat said:

I'm a member of a Prius group on FaceBook, and there are a lot of members, particularly in the States, that have 200-300k miles on the original battery pack, and it's still going strong, and reports of taxis with 400k on them on the original pack.

There seems to be a fallacy that the battery pack is a consumable item, the reality (at least from what I've seen) is far from that, and the battery packs generally outlive the vehicle.

That's not to say that the don't go wrong, but do you look into the price of replacing an engine when you consider buying a run of the mill ICE car?

There are a number of places that will repair packs now, it's usually a number of cells that go bad, rather than the pack as a whole, and there are people who DIY it, so even if the pack did go bad, you don't need to factor in a replacement from Toyota.

Danowat that is exactly what I needed to hear and very helpful thank you.  

 

[danowat]

As for "bad" experiences (not bad per say, but anyway!), this guy brought a Prius with a dead pack and repaired it.

 

[Cyker]

@danowat - When you said the Battery is not considered a consumable item, is that just your stance or is that actually Toyota's stance on the traction Battery? I know the 12v Battery *is* considered a consumable item, like brakes, clutch, bulbs etc.

 

[danowat]

9 minutes ago, Cyker said:

@danowat - When you said the battery is not considered a consumable item, is that just your stance or is that actually Toyota's stance on the traction battery? I know the 12v battery *is* considered a consumable item, like brakes, clutch, bulbs etc.

 

I don't know what Toyota's stance is, but the lifespan doesn't scream consumable to me.

[PeteB]

 

35 minutes ago, Cyker said:

... I know the 12v battery *is* considered a consumable item, like brakes, clutch, bulbs etc...

Although I have to say that I've had two 12V batteries replaced without question under warranty when they've failed unacceptable early.  Once in 2002 on my first Gen 1 Prius (I was actually expecting to pay for it), and once last year on my current Gen 4 Prius.

[Cyker]

Oh really? Nice; I remember when that problem with the 12V batteries being drained that a lot of people were experiencing on the newer HSDs happened most people had to fork out for replacements.

 

 

[Catlover]

When I was looking for a Toyota hybrid (Auris or Prius) I never once read any reviews that told me there were problems with the main Battery, and never saw (and still havnt) someone selling and include "new main Battery fitted", which is what you would do if you were selling after you spent couple of thousand. 

Now the wife has an Auris mk1 hybrid and I have a Prius Gen3. Both the same engine/battery units. Love them both - especially the Prius.

[kithmo]

51 minutes ago, Catlover said:

Now the wife has an Auris mk1 hybrid and I have a Prius Gen3. Both the same engine/battery units. Love them both - especially the Prius.

Is that the wife and your car, the wife and her car or just both cars Joe ?

 

[danowat]

17 hours ago, Cyker said:

@danowat - When you said the battery is not considered a consumable item, is that just your stance or is that actually Toyota's stance on the traction battery? I know the 12v battery *is* considered a consumable item, like brakes, clutch, bulbs etc.

 

I was thinking about this some more, and still think there is quite a bit of resistance in EV and hybrid vehicles due to the perceived notion that the hybrid traction Battery is a disposable consumable item, and will need replacing at some point.

It's obvious that the hybrid Battery has a finite life, but where do you draw the line between an item that is expected to be replaced, and one that "should" last the lifetime of the vehicle?, what frequency of replacement denotes consumable?

It seems to be a common question when people are looking for, or are presented with the fact that you own a hybrid (ooohhhhh, how much will a new Battery be), however, when people are looking to purchase a diesel car do they factor in the cost of expensive replacement items (turbos, injectors, I mean a high pressure fuel pump is £1500 a pop) when considering a purchase?, no, they generally don't, because there is an assumption that they will last the life of the vehicle (many don't).

I just wonder why there is this disconnect between expensive replacement items on ICE vehicles, and the battery pack on a hybrid / EV vehicle?

There are also a few items that don't wear as much as ICE cars, brakes is one, and things that are consumable on ICE cars (clutches is a big one) that don't even feature on a hybrid / EV, then you've got the transmission, the eCVT HSD is way less complex than people think it is (can be hard to get your head around how it works!), but it's extremely robust, and features way, way less parts than the transmission on an ICE vehicle.

Sorry for the ramble, but I just think that the notion of having to replace a pack as per for the course is mis information spread around by ill informed people!

[PeteB]

17 hours ago, PeteB said:

Although I have to say that I've had two 12V batteries replaced without question under warranty ...

and perhaps I should also mention that when I sold my 2nd Gen 1 Prius at 9 years old with 163,000 on the clock, it still had an original 12V Battery.  Also, the engine and HV Battery were performing perfectly, except it had started to need a little oil after 100,000 miles (by the time I sold it, it got close to MIN about 7,000 miles after a service, and 1L carried it through to the next.

The guy who bought it traded in used Hybrids and also maintained the HV systems.  It became his wife' car for a couple of years and he then sold it to a customer.  I got the odd update when he serviced it once a year and apparently at 180,000 miles and about 12 years old the HV Battery started giving problems.  He dismantled it, checked which sticks of cells had failed, matched them with spares from written off cars he'd bought and AFAIK the car is still in daily use.

He has reported a few other cases of HV battery failure on 2000-2003 Gen 1s and a few 2004-2006 pre-facelift Gen 2s, many of which he's been able to rescue.

My own dealer had a customer bring in a Gen 1 with a failed HV battery and he didn't want the cost of fixing it and asked the dealer to dispose of the car.  I put them in touch with the guy who bought my Gen 1, and he got the car to drive well enough to get it home and fixed it up.

I'm also aware of two cars that had the HV battery killed after the driver put diesel in it, and let the Hybrid system try to start the ICE so many times it flattened the battery enough to terminally damage it.  Once of those was a 2006 Gen 2 and in 2007 the cost of a new battery had fallen to about £2,200 (from around £5,000 in the very early days).

[Catlover]

12 hours ago, kithmo said:

Is that the wife and your car, the wife and her car or just both cars Joe ?

 

How do I get out of this?

I know........ its BOTH the wife and the two cars.   Phew!

[QuantumFireball]

On 15/02/2018 at 9:55 AM, PeteB said:

I'm also aware of two cars that had the HV battery killed after the driver put diesel in it, and let the Hybrid system try to start the ICE so many times it flattened the battery enough to terminally damage it.  Once of those was a 2006 Gen 2 and in 2007 the cost of a new battery had fallen to about £2,200 (from around £5,000 in the very early days).

But the ICE was OK?

[PeteB]

7 minutes ago, QuantumFireball said:

But the ICE was OK?

Yes, after a very serious and expensive clean of the fuel systems!