How often do you change oil - prius 2011

[forge]

Hi,

I've got a Prius 2011, and wondering how often you need to change the oil. I cant see where is says it in the manual so i done a quick google search where it says every 10k miles. Can anyone confirm if this is true? seems a lot to me but then again I no nothing about cars so I came here for help.

Thanks :)

[FROSTYBALLS]

Toyota service intervals are 12 months or 10,000 miles, whichever occurs first.

[forge]

wow, great news for me then. thanks for your help frosty :)

[Catlover]

The preferred oil (say Toyota) is 0W-20.  It is expensive - I got 5 litre of Toyota oil off eBay for just over £38 - a god price.

When you say 10k miles seems a lot between changes - dont forget the engine wont be running at all those 10k miles, or on a lighter load then "normal".

If you car is due a service and MOT, my Toyota garage is doing a deal of service and mot for £99. The service only includes oil and filter, but still a good deal.

[FROSTYBALLS]

The service and MOT offer is a national one and runs until 31st August - 

One can get 0W-20 as low as £28-29 for five litres if one shops around -

https://www.amazon.co.uk/XF-Longlife-Millers-Synthetic-Engine/dp/B07C78RBXW/ref=sr_1_23?ie=UTF8&qid=1525687922&sr=8-23&keywords=0W-20+oil

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Petronas-Syntium-Litres-Engine-Synthetic/dp/B01MZ8EAS7/ref=sr_1_14?ie=UTF8&qid=1525688257&sr=8-14&keywords=0W-20+oil

[Catlover]

I am sure Miller and Petronas oil is ok, I was specifically referring to Toyota branded oil, like I assuming you get from a Toyota dealer.

[PeteB]

I remember reading a series of posts many years ago on one of the forums (forget which one now) from a US Prius owner (Gen 2, I think) who periodically sent a sample of his oil to a laboratory and received what seemed to me (admittedly not technical) to be very comprehensive analysis data.  The owner appeared to be more technically savvy than I am, and he claimed to understand what the figures were telling him, and used the info to keep the same oil for something like 100,000 miles (maybe a bit more).

Clearly he wasn't concerned about warranty (I don't think they got more than 3 years in the US, maybe even less?) and he reported no issues with the car either.  He also economised on spark plugs (Iridium tipped, whatever that means), which in the UK are meant to be changed every 60,000 miles.

When my 2002 Gen 1 Prius (we called them the "Classic" model when the Gen 2 came out) reached 60k in 2005, these plugs were still expensive and cost £62.15 for all 4 (total 60k service was £269.45 - all including vat).  This was at my preferred dealer in Norwich (a local dealer nearer to where I lived at the time quoted £25 each for the plugs and almost £400 for the service!).

As I'd mentioned my surprise at the cost of the plugs, my service manager brought one out to show me.  I thought it was a brand new one, and was amazed when he said it was one they'd taken out of my car!

3½ years later at the 120,000 mile service, the plugs cost a more reasonable £25.25.

[kithmo]

That goes to show that synthetic oils are far more robust than we give them credit for. Although 100,000 miles is probably taking it a bit far, I reckon 20-30,000 miles on the same oil could be achieved without harm on a fully synthetic oil, maybe change the filter every 10,000 though.

Iridium plugs should last 90-100,000 according to Fords service schedule on the Mk3 Mondeo I used to have, probably even longer in the Prius where the ICE isn't running as much.

[Gerg]

Whilst I agree with all the above, early VVTi (so the predecessor of the hybrid) engines suffered gummed-up oil control rings and/or blocked drain holes behind the oil control ring, causing oil burning problems.

Would the engine oils inability to keep this part of the engine clean (detergent additive worn out???) show up on an oil analysis, perhaps it would.  Part of Toyota's fix for this problem was an increased sump capacity on later models.  This would keep the oil cooler, but also give more oil/additive capacity to support the engine, wouldn't it?  So perhaps the oil is stressed in that part of the engine in the Toyota design.

Our 120,000 mile VVTi Corolla is at nearly 1 litre/1000 miles oil usage.  It has always been run on synthetic oil, and for its first 9 years it was changed every 6 months regardless of mileage (i.e. it was changed early).  But the oil burning happened in spite of this.  It would be interesting to know what, if anything, could have been done to prevent this.

FWIW,  a can of Wynns engine flush at the last change seems to have improved the oil usage situation; it is measurably better.

Over on PriusChat forum, it would seem that high oil consumption is not unusual on 150,000 plus mileage Prius, so something has worn on those cars.  A few owners have fitted new piston rings to good effect.  The latest engines (not just Toyota) are using more lightly-sprung piston rings to give lower friction/better fuel economy, I read.  Perhaps this gives the rings a shorter service life?  The endless stop/start of the hybrid engine can't give the piston rings an easy life, although the gen 2 doesn't suffer from oil usage AFAIK. 

In their early years weren't the gen 2s running on 5w/30 oil?, which may give more protection than the modern 0w/20 SN oils that the gen 3s run on.

As i understand it, the latest oil standards are determined by emission levels and catalyst protection rather than engine longevity; I happened to spot a 'race' oil (on Opie Oils website?) that was 5w/30 and an SJ classification, for ultimate protection SN grade oils don't appear offer anything over some apparently lower, older grades.

This is not what the OP was really asking, excuse the ramble!

[PeteB]

I certainly wasn't suggesting anyone follow this method, just info for interest and to demonstrate that the 10,000 service interval is by no means risky.

Only one of my 7 Prius passed 100,000 miles (a 2002 Gen 1) and up to about 100,000 it consumed no measurable oil, as have all the others.  After 100k, it gradually started to use a little, and by the time I sold it at 163k I was putting 1 litre in after about 7,000 miles which carried it to the next service.  It always impressed me how clean the oil looked when it was replaced.

Some people switched to a slightly higher viscosity when the consumption started and reported that the consumption was reduced.

I wouldn't regard that as 'high' consumption, especially when compared to some cars I owned in the 1970s and 80s where a litre (maybe it was a pint?) didn't last 1,000 miles.

Even brand new cars seemed to consume a little between services in those days.  My first encounter with a car that didn't was my ex-partner's Nissan Micra which she bought new in 1998 - the salesman made a point of saying that they used no oil at all, and the slightest drop on the dipstick should be reported immediately as it indicated a problem.

 

 

 

[kithmo]

10 hours ago, Gerg said:

 

Our 120,000 mile VVTi Corolla is at nearly 1 litre/1000 miles oil usage.  It has always been run on synthetic oil, and for its first 9 years it was changed every 6 months regardless of mileage (i.e. it was changed early).  But the oil burning happened in spite of this.  It would be interesting to know what, if anything, could have been done to prevent this.

 

I know this sounds counter intuitive to what many people think, but what you should have done is change the oil less frequently at the early part of it's life to let the engine bed in properly, I'd guess the bores got glazed.  I'm a firm believer in oil changes, but these modern oils are far superior to the oils of days gone by in terms of detergent and suspension of solids, you be hard pushed to find any sludge in any modern engine these days unless the oil had never been changed. Leave them in and let them do their job. 

[FROSTYBALLS]

1 hour ago, kithmo said:

I know this sounds counter intuitive to what many people think, but what you should have done is change the oil less frequently at the early part of it's life to let the engine bed in properly

That maybe, but to keep the new car warranty valid (depending on age probably 3 years/60,000 miles), servicing/oil changes would have been required to be in line with Toyota's service schedules (12 months or 10,000 miles, whichever occurred first).

[Joseph D]

4 hours ago, FROSTYBALLS said:

...   servicing/oil changes would have been required to be in line with Toyota's service schedules (12 months or 10,000 miles (16093.4km), whichever occurred first).

Agreed, but the OP did say they changed the oil every 6 months, so less than 5000 mi, to which I think Kithmo was responding. I took Kithmo's comment to mean the OP may have been better off sticking the the Toyota schedule of 1 year OCI.

[PeteB]

Now that I think about it, I seem to recall at one time the recommended service/oil change interval in the US was 5,000 miles.

[QuantumFireball]

It's typical for US service intervals to be half of what we're used to here. I think it's traditionally 3k miles/3 months or something crazy like that over there.

[kithmo]

9 hours ago, Joseph D said:

Agreed, but the OP did say they changed the oil every 6 months, so less than 5000 mi, to which I think Kithmo was responding. I took Kithmo's comment to mean the OP may have been better off sticking the the Toyota schedule of 1 year OCI.

Exactly, if it wasn't for the warranty requirements of every 12 months, I wouldn't have had my oil changed for the first 3 years, as I only do 3,000 miles a year. I guess by the time mine reaches 100,000  miles (not in my lifetime at 3,000 miles a year) it will start using oil due to the 2 oil changes it's had already at just over 6,000 miles in just over 2 years. 

[barrycoll]

Once upon a time, when it was a DIY job, I used to change engine oil/filter every 6 months, as It just seemed a sympatico thing to do....I even used engine flush, which was probably daft, as some must have been retained.

Nowadays, like Kithmo, with only 3k Gen 4 miles pa, changing oil, other than for the problem of water condensing in the crank case, seems a bit daft. Especially as the Gen 4 ICE does not even do all the suggested mileage.

Apropos of bore glazing, It was always the received wisdom, that if you wanted a fast car, drive it extra fast straight out of the show room

But conforming to the the service intervals is very important as with my wife’s IQ has revealed.

The car is an 09 and 10 years old, but just 20k miles, and now the paint on the roof has started peeling. I thought of having the roof vinyl covered for about £200, but using Frosty’s advice I wrote to Toyota Customer Services

Flying a kite, you could say.

Expected the reply to be my sandwiches wrapped in a road map, I was surprised (to say the least), to get  reply suggesting I take the car to Jemca body shop for inspection.

Just 3 years warranty in 09, and 2 years for paint, this was unexpected, but the car had a full Mr Toy service history, as had my 2 Prius, both bought new.

The body shop car measured paint depth on all panels, mentioned that this car was a Japanese import, said it was one of the better paint jobs, but that the roof undercoating had become contaminated, and said he would submit a report to Toyota head office.

Ah well, I thought, thats the end of it, move on, nothing to see here.

But......last week I had a phone call from the Body Shop saying that a COMPLETE RESPRAY of the whole had been approved, at a Toy cost of (wait for it)  .....£3000!

And not only that, but I would get a loan Yaris auto for the 2/3 weeks of stripping the car down completely!

All I can say is that current a Toyota is the ONLY car to buy, and that letting the main agent service the car is the most intelligent thing a person can do

It seems that I just had to tell this story, as it gob smacks most folk, but is probably the very best word of mouth advertising Mr Toy could ever spend money on

[PeteB]

1 hour ago, barrycoll said:

Once upon a time, when it was a DIY job, I used to change engine oil/filter every 6 months, as It just seemed a sympatico thing to do...pend money on

Those were they days: my early car ownership in the 1970s involved a couple of British Leyland cars followed by a couple of Fiats I still try to forget!

The BL cars required a service every 3 months or 3,000 miles, and the 6 monthly ones normally required an oil change, with new plugs at 12 months.  And by 6,000 miles, boy did the carburettor and tappets need adjusting - badly!  Plus the brakes and handbrake always seemed to need adjusting too.

The Fiats were just 6 monthly/6,000, but they seldom went that long without an unscheduled trip to the dealer!

[kithmo]

The mineral oils of the 70s, GTX, Duckhams etc. were a totally different breed to the likes of today's synthetic oils and 6 monthly changes were definitely required if you wanted your engine to last 60k miles or more. Black sludge, scuffed mains and big end bearings and worn cam lobes were common place on older engines where the oil had been left in for long periods. The 70s overhead cam Ford engine required the cam oil feed tube cleaning out or replacing at every service if you wanted your camshaft to last until the next service. IIRC they cost £3.50 at the time (about 2-3 times the price of a new oil filter) but could save you £hundreds in repairs if not cleaned out properly, I used to buy a new one every time.

[forge]

Thanks answer on here.

I done a full service with MOT at Halfords in jan 2018, was planning on going again if ofcourse i dont do 10k miles before that!

[FROSTYBALLS]

17 hours ago, PeteB said:

Those were they days: my early car ownership in the 1970s involved a couple of British Leyland cars followed by a couple of Fiats I still try to forget!

The BL cars required a service every 3 months or 3,000 miles, and the 6 monthly ones normally required an oil change, with new plugs at 12 months.  And by 6,000 miles, boy did the carburettor and tappets need adjusting - badly!  Plus the brakes and handbrake always seemed to need adjusting too.

The Fiats were just 6 monthly/6,000, but they seldom went that long without an unscheduled trip to the dealer!

Honda service intervals were 6 months/6,000 miles up to the mid 90's. Our October 1994 Concerto 1.5I had  these short service intervals.

[Gerg]

On 5/8/2018 at 7:51 PM, kithmo said:

I know this sounds counter intuitive to what many people think, but what you should have done is change the oil less frequently at the early part of it's life to let the engine bed in properly, I'd guess the bores got glazed.  I'm a firm believer in oil changes, but these modern oils are far superior to the oils of days gone by in terms of detergent and suspension of solids, you be hard pushed to find any sludge in any modern engine these days unless the oil had never been changed. Leave them in and let them do their job. 

Except that for the first 70,000 miles the car didn't burn any oil, so I don't think that fits a bore glazing description.

I have never even considered using an engine flush before, but now I have used one once on this car the oil usage has improved substantially.  It's too early to give proper numbers, but it's using half as much, maybe less.  It's a bigger improvement than I'd ever expected.

So I'm still looking at the problem as poor oil control ring operation, due to the ring being gummed-up and/or the drain holes in the piston being partially blocked.  The engine flush seems to have begun to address that.

The reason for mentioning it at all was that here is a fairly modern engine, from Toyota (!), that has been noted by many as having ring-gumming problems. And that these may(?) have been prevented by a more effective oil detergent package, so in that respect the specified oil may not have been up to the job in this application. 

And that part of the 'fix' was to increase the oil capacity, suggesting Toyota has decided that the oil was getting too hot or was being overstressed some other way.  

In the US, quite heavy oil usage in the 3rd gen Prius seems almost routine beyond 150,000 miles, but earlier Prius didn't do this.  Despite modern engine design and the latest oils, something is wearing out.

[QuantumFireball]

21 hours ago, barrycoll said:

Once upon a time, when it was a DIY job...

It can still be a DIY job. I found it pretty easy to change the oil and filters in my Prius. The trickiest part was the oil filter which requires a specific tool (and is slightly awkward as it's underneath the engine), but it's easy to find on eBay.

[barrycoll]

It might not be difficult dear Quantum Fireball, but it wont achieve a Mr Toy tick in your service book.....

 

....se my IQ comments for the future importance of that