What's it worth?

[peppadog]

Hi all.

My daughter has owned a 2006 2ltr petrol auto for three or four years. She has just upgraded to a new Yaris hybrid. She would have part ex'd the Rev but they would only give her £2500 and then scrap it!! The car is fine and drives well, looks good, has been serviced and maintained and is mot'd until Jan 19. 108k miles though.

Any idea what we should get for it? (its mine now technically as a. I bought it for her originally and b. I have paid the deposit on the Yaris. So it would be great to get some of my money back.

[IanML]

2 hours ago, peppadog said:

JHi all.

My daughter has owned a 2006 2ltr petrol auto for three or four years. She has just upgraded to a new Yaris hybrid. She would have part ex'd the Rev but they would only give her £2500 and then scrap it!! The car is fine and drives well, looks good, has been serviced and maintained and is mot'd until Jan 19. 108k miles though.

Any idea what we should get for it? (its mine now technically as a. I bought it for her originally and b. I have paid the deposit on the Yaris. So it would be great to get some of my money back.

I Paid £3500 for mine about 18 months ago.  A year older than yours, but only 95k at the time, and Jersey tends to be a bit more expensive than the mainland.    If it's as good as you say, they were not telling the truth about scrapping it.  They would have passed it to a downmarket trader.  My guess for yours is about 3 to 3.5k.

[152bobby]

Look for the same spec, year, model, mileage and condition on Auto trader (Private and Trade), this will help you come up with a pretty spot on selling and trade in price.

[FROSTYBALLS]

If it was traded in under Toyota's scrappage scheme - https://www.toyota.co.uk/toyota-scrappage-scheme - then legally it would have had to be scrapped.

[peppadog]

Correct Frosty, and I don't think perfectly good cars should be scraped.

I did look at used prices - they are all over the place. It's a well specced xt4 but has a couple of issues I need to be sure are sorted, then it will hopefully go. 

Thanks all.

[daveh_rav4]

I can see from the Toyota scrappage scheme details that they are keen to state that a high percentage of the scrapped car is re-cycled (and all the energy involved to do that).  I just can't get my head round the fact that cars as good quality as a Toyota is being recommended to be scrapped after eight years and 100,000 miles (barely run-in).  Me thinks that it is the desire to sell a new car that is the driving force here!  We really cannot go on with this buy, use twice and throw away mind-set.

Years ago many things were made to last a generation and were only eventually replaced because they were worn out!  For instance… there are still Qualcast lawn mowers built in the 1930's that are still in service today... try getting a modern mainly plastic built Flymo to last more than five years; obsolescence is built into products these days!  I have an all metal leaf/ram blower made in the fourties, and apart from a couple of sets of brushes is still as good as the day it left the factory! The Green Parties and Governments should be addressing this instead of being hood-winked by commercial companies just out to make a fast buck! 

We have the technology and materials now to make things last a lot longer... we should be thinking of saving the planets resources and not the next high pressure sales trick!

CLUNK!!!! Opp’s, sorry… that was me falling off my soap box!

[FROSTYBALLS]

The Toyota scheme is no different to those recently offered by other manufacturers including Alfa Romeo, Audi, BMW, Fiat, Ford, Hyundai, Jeep, Kia, Mazda, Merecedes Benz, Mitsubishi, Nissan, Renault, Seat, Skoda, Vauxhall, Volkswagen, etc.

The aim of such schemes, similar to the government sponsored scheme of 2006, is to get older, more polluting vehicles off the road.

[daveh_rav4]

I don't see that as an answer... all car manufactuers are painted with the same brush, they would all like us to scrap our cars every five years and buy a new one. Sure, the new one should have some emission improvements but the cost to the envoiroment to build a new car (apart from the cost to the buyer) equals the pollution on average of a vehicles with twenty year life-span or more.

The carbon footprint of a new car:
6 tonnes CO2e: Citroen C1, basic spec
17 tonnes CO2e: Ford Mondeo, medium spec
35 tonnes CO2e: Land Rover Discovery, top of the range

The carbon footprint of making a car is immensely complex. Ores have to be dug out of the ground and the metals extracted. These have to be turned into parts. Other components have to be brought together: rubber tyres, plastic dashboards, paint, and so on. All of this involves transporting things around the world. The whole lot then has to be assembled, and every stage in the process requires energy. The companies that make cars have offices and other infrastructure with their own carbon footprints, which we need to somehow allocate proportionately to the cars that are made.

In other words, even more than with most items, the manufacture of a car causes ripples that extend throughout the economy. To give just one simple example among millions, the assembly plant uses phones and they in turn had to be manufactured, along with the phone lines that transmit the calls. The ripples go on and on for ever. Attempts to capture all these stages by adding them up individually are doomed from the outset to result in an underestimate, because the task is just too big.

The best we can do is use so-called input-output analysis to break up the known total emissions of the world or a country into different industries and sectors, in the process taking account of how each industry consumes the goods and services of all the others. If we do this, and then divide by the total emissions of the auto industry by the total amount of money spent on new cars, we reach a footprint of 720kg CO2e per £1000 spent.

This is only a guideline figure, of course, as some cars may be more efficiently produced than others of the same price. But it's a reasonable ballpark estimate, and it suggests that cars have much bigger footprints than is traditionally believed. Producing a medium-sized new car costing £24,000 may generate more than 17 tonnes of CO2e – almost as much as three years' worth of gas and electricity in the typical UK home.

Interestingly, the input-outpout analysis suggests that the gas and electricity used by the auto industry itself, including all the component manufacturers as well as the assembly plant, accounts for less than 12% of the total. The rest is spread across everything from metal extraction (33%), rubber manufacture (3%) and the manufacture of tools and machines (5%) through to business travel and stationary for car company employees.

The upshot is that – despite common claims to contrary – the embodied emissions of a car typically rival the exhaust pipe emissions over its entire lifetime. Indeed, for each mile driven, the emissions from the manufacture of a top-of-the-range Land Rover Discovery that ends up being scrapped after 100,000 miles may be as much as four times higher than the tailpipe emissions of a Citroen C1.

With this in mind, unless you do very high mileage or have a real gas-guzzler, it generally makes sense to keep your old car for as long as it is reliable – and to look after it carefully to extend its life as long as possible. If you make a car last to 200,000 miles rather than 100,000, then the emissions for each mile the car does in its lifetime may drop by as much as 50%, as a result of getting more distance out of the initial manufacturing emissions.

When you do eventually replace your car, it obviouslty makes sense to do so with a light, simple and fuel-efficient model: that way you'll be limiting both the manufacturing and the exhaust-pipe emissions. But before you buy, look into car clubs, especially if you live in a city centre: you may save lots of money as well as reducing the number of cars that need to be produced.

Of course, the exact benefits of new versus old cars, diesel versus hybrids, car clubs versus owning, and so on, are different for each person. To find out the greenest choice for you, check out the new interactive greener car guide at Startuk.org.

In other words... it is better to make a car and keep it on the road as long as possible... it's less polluting that way!

You cannot take as advice on pollution from a car manufactuer who has a vested interest in selling you a new car; they are driven by profit not by overall pollution statistics.

DaveH-UK

[FROSTYBALLS]

Well, it is an answer, it was the reason for the government sponsored scheme in 2006, and has nothing to do with a car manufacturer's advice on pollution.

[daveh_rav4]

And governments aren’t hand in glove with vehicle manufactures? LOL It’s called capitalism... and when the planet is a desolate dust bowl; we may wake up, but it will be too late by then!  Anyhow, this is probably the wrong place for this kind of discussion; but then again... maybe not!

I am doing my bit... I run a twenty year old Rav 4,  I only do 4,000Km a year; to equal the carbon footprint with a new car I could drive it for another fifty - sixty years LOL

[FROSTYBALLS]

Think whatever you want.

[peppadog]

You may well be right daveh, but you should save all that energy - you will need it one day. Most ordered things in life are created for a biased reason. We are all but passengers on this bus of life. Best we worry less where its taking us and just enjoy the view.

I suppose reality is, if our Rav was worth less than the £2.5k scrap value, it would have gone.

[IanML]

Of course Daveh is right.  I have been saying the same for years.  I must admit I felt a bit guilty buying my Rav4 (2005) - too young 

[FROSTYBALLS]

Then again in the real world the majority of people, government departments and companies change their vehicles when they wish to - whether this is due to age, mileage, different needs or because they wish to change. Otherwise we'd all still be driving around in Austin 7 Chummys, Model T's, Toyota AA's and similar.

So back to the subject of 'What its worth?' 

[peppadog]

It will go on Gumtree or whatever next week once a new, spare, key Shell arrives and is cut. £3500 seems about right.

Thank you all for your input.

[daveh_rav4]

Pleased to hear that the car is being saved peppadog... hopefully, someone will get many more years of life and fun out of it :)

Frosty: I love old cars, running around in a Model 'T' or an Austin 7 would not phase me... in fact, when I was a mechanic back in the day, I was tasked with looking after two Ford Pilot V8's for an enthusiast customer. One of the most fun cars I ever got to drive (and I had to do a lot of testing :)), although a 7 ltr Ford Galaxy probably came close LOL   I do of course appreciate that cars like this would not be appropriate for a company rep covering thirty thousands or so miles a year! Keeping cars for general use for a hundred years or so might be stretching things just a tad too far!

Just as a sub-script... perhaps vehicle manufactures could be encouraged to work out low(er) emission up-grades to existing vehicles as new technology becomes available.  You don't necessarily have to scrap the whole car if an emission upgrade could save from building a new one!  Making it financially attractive to the manufacturers is the problem… although tax incentives have been known to work!

Right.. "Back in my box!"

[peppadog]

Yeah, maybe even electric conversions in a few years. Who knows.

Anyway. After checking with the Toyota dealer, who confirmed they cannot supply a new key or Shell for our 2006 Rav4 !. I bought one off eBay for just £2.97, took it the local key cutter who did it for £9.99. so less than £13 and it sort of works. Well the transponder fits and works perfectly, but I haven't figured out how to get the immobiliser chip out of the old key. It seems to be covered by a glue or similar.

Any ideas (maybe I need a new thread for this?)

[IanML]

Try a paint remover applied by a fine brush to slowly dissolve the glue - go easy in case it attacks the plastic of the chip.