Rattling when starting up engine

[driver10]

Please help i have 2009 plate 58 petrol 1.33.

We are in spring/summer in uk.

When starting my car in the morning or evening after work, i hear a rattling sound when the car starts.

If i turn off and on again rattle doesnt happen. Also during the day when i use my car. Engine seems to rattle when i start car after long rest (morning or after work).

After an hours cooling period after a motorway drive. I checked the engine oil the dipstick shiws engine oil is juay below half way between min and max. I have 0w20 ultra syntbetic engine oil.

What is causing this rattling when starting up engine. Should i add more engine oil?

Please do helo. Its my first car and do not know much about cars.

[Catlover]

Whether it stops the rattling but I would make sure the oil level is at max, checking the level to be done after car has been stood for some time (to allow oil to settle in sump) and with car on level ground.  I would take dip stick out and wipe it, put back in, allow time for oil to settle, then check the oil level on dip stick.

[furtula]

Had similar issue, oil was around 40% between min/max ( on my 1.6l it's 1.2l betwen min/max).  In my case sound was heard only when idle, around 650 rpm or so, and when it was idling for some time, so there was low oil pressure, and the sound was like it was valve covers or lifters.

After topping up, the sound was gone.

 

Would you say the sound is mechanical, like clacking sound, and on regular intervals? Does it dissapear if you rev the engine a bit, or does it get louder/more repetitive?

[JayG]

If it's only for a second or so as the car starts, it could even be the started motor?

[driver10]

Only when starting the car up in the morni gs or after 8 hour shift at work .

Had similar issue, oil was around 40% between min/max ( on my 1.6l it's 1.2l betwen min/max).  In my case sound was heard only when idle, around 650 rpm or so, and when it was idling for some time, so there was low oil pressure, and the sound was like it was valve covers or lifters.
After topping up, the sound was gone.
 
Would you say the sound is mechanical, like clacking sound, and on regular intervals? Does it dissapear if you rev the engine a bit, or does it get louder/more repetitive?

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

[driver10]

Only when starting the car up in the morni gs or after 8 hour shift at work .


Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

It diasppears after starting the car on just for a second it appears. Doesnt happen again after i turn off the engine and on again


Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

[driver10]

Uts doesn't occur every time i start the engine.

If it's only for a second or so as the car starts, it could even be the started motor?

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

[JayG]

1 minute ago, driver10 said:

Uts doesn't occur every time i start the engine.
 

 

My old Celica used to do that too, sometime at random when I started the car (typically if it had sat for a bit) sometimes I would get this funny rattle for a split second or so as the car starts.
For me it was the starter motor and didn't do it all the time either. 

[driver10]

I just topped up my oil in the morning. When i started the car it started off fine. But that could be cause my brother topped it up for me and may have started the car. I finish work in like 2 hours. Lets see how it starts.

My old Celica used to do that too, sometime at random when I started the car (typically if it had sat for a bit) sometimes I would get this funny rattle for a split second or so as the car starts.
For me it was the starter motor and didn't do it all the time either. 

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

[driver10]

I just topped up my oil in the morning. When i started the car it started off fine. But that could be cause my brother topped it up for me and may have started the car. I finish work in like 2 hours. Lets see how it starts.


Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

Still i hear the rattle sound.

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

[JayG]

Is there any way you can try to get a video of the noise at all?

[driver10]

Is there any way you can try to get a video of the noise at all?

I got one

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

[driver10]

Here is one. Today in london the wewther was nicehttp://cloud.tapatalk.com/s/5aff0c6e18e6c/VID_20180518_131555.mp4

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

[Gerg]

I had almost identical symptoms to those in your description, but on a Nissan Almera 1.4 petrol.

The engine is similar only in very general terms.  But in that car the sound was there at 20,000 miles, when bought, and was only slightly worse at 155,000 miles, when sold.  It never caused any further problems.

I decided that it was cam chain rattle that was occuring when the cam chain tensioner was moving from its 'rest' position to its operating position, so just a couple of seconds max. on a cold start.

The tensioner is operated by oil pressure, so any delay in the oil pressure coming up will aggravate this. So this *could* be low oil level (so not yours), or a poor quality oil filter (a one way valve is fitted in many filters to prevent oil from draining back into the engine sump when turned off, but I am told some cheap filters don't have this).

My car only used genuine filters, so the above didn't apply to me, but I did notice the problem was made much less obvious if I used a slightly thicker grade of oil.

That car didn't use hydraulic tappets, so I could rule those out as a source of noise.

I don't know if a loose cam chain at startup is a potential problem on your engine, it depends on how it was designed.

On VW/Audi 1.8/2.0 engines, for instance, it can cause the chain to jump a sprocket tooth on startup (very bad), but on the Almera, nothing.

HTH

 

[driver10]

Im going to top up some more oil. Oil levels are 3/4 on dipstick. I did use a cheap oil filter aswell un my last service. So will keep u posted.

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

[driver10]

Im going to top up some more oil. Oil levels are 3/4 on dipstick. I did use a cheap oil filter aswell un my last service. So will keep u posted.

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

Today car started up fine. Even though i never topped up any oil.

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

[Catlover]

3 hours ago, driver10 said:

Im going to top up some more oil. Oil levels are 3/4 on dipstick. I did use a cheap oil filter aswell un my last service. So will keep u posted.

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk
 

How cheap is cheap???   Just had a service at Toyota main dealer and the cost of the oil filter is shown as £8.99 inc vat.  I assume that Toyota supplied filter would be "an approved one" and for less then £9.  Whats a "cheap" one - maybe £7, or £6....is it worth it for a couple quid not to get an "approved" one?  Your choice of course.

[driver10]

How cheap is cheap???   Just had a service at Toyota main dealer and the cost of the oil filter is shown as £8.99 inc vat.  I assume that Toyota supplied filter would be "an approved one" and for less then £9.  Whats a "cheap" one - maybe £7, or £6....is it worth it for a couple quid not to get an "approved" one?  Your choice of course.

It was an after market oil filter

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

[driver10]

Hi i used thicker oil 5w30 with new oil filter blue print but noise still persists on hot days. I bought a genuine oil filter but haven't put it in yet. I cant see anything special about the genuine oil filter. Any ideas how will the new genuine oil filter help.

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

[Gerg]

Rather than a good chance of fixing the problem, fitting the genuine filter allows you to rule out an easy to replace, cheap part that *could* cause the problem you have. Other brands of oil filters on your car are almost certainly fine, but the genuine part is definitely fine; so it's just to remove one of the unknowns.

The possibility of accidently buying a counterfeit item is also reduced to nothing. 

The Toyota filter *may* have a greater area of pleated filter paper and a better functioning non-return valve, but I've never taken one apart. Both of these could reduce the time it takes for the chain tensioner to work, but the chain tensioner may be working normally, and you simply have a worn chain which requires the tensioner to move out further to take out the slack. Not a cheap repair to replace the cam chain.

Generally, a worn chain comes about through high mileage or poor oil change history. Sometimes it is down to poor quality cam chains (e.g. european-built, small Nissan petrols around 2002, and VW 1.4 Tsi before 2015), I am not aware of a Toyota problem, others might be.

[qettyz]

I hope that i am wrong, but it can be also head gasget leaking issue. When car sits long enought there is time to coolant drop to top of the piston.

That causes rattle then when started. Maybe worth to check out?

How much miles on the car?

[driver10]

68000. Shall i check for leaks. Headgasket looks okay. Theres no white stains on the inside of engine oil cap.

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

[furtula]

Most productive thing would be to show us a video or a sound clip of the actual rattling when starting.

 

[driver10]

Im still driving the car its at 75000 miles

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

[Catlover]

Is it still rattling? Any worse?