Wandering

[Colourd]

Hello All, newbie here, seeking help

I have a 2006 Corolla 2.0 116 C.C.

I have had this car for over three years, it has less than 80k on it atm

Since I have had this car the steering has never felt quite right or precise. Anyway, try to get to point my car wanders at times, and seems to be getting very gradually becoming more noticeable and more annoying. It sometimes feels if the connection from the column to the rack somewhere is too vague, no noticeable play or noises as such. I like this car, so decided I want to keep it and get it right, but, its costing me dear already. What surprises me is, I have tried to find stories of similar problems and I seem to be pretty much alone with this

OK, I can tell you all, what its not, as this has all been done  - in no particular order

Shocks all round

Top mounts front

Tyres all new

Steering alignment and geometry check etc - Toyota

Bottom arms

Bottom joints

Link arms

So, it pretty much only leaves the rack and or possibly one of the shafts. Also finding the correct part numbers for any of the steering shafts is near impossible any help with this please, part numbers, prices etc. Is there anyone who does a decent recommended re-con rack ? as Toyota is crazy money

Thanks

[oldcodger]

Hi,

Not a problem I have experienced with any car, though often heard about such problems, like some Fords used to have.

When you say wander, is it more on Motorways or just general town driving, wandering to any partic direction ?  Very sensitive to the road camber ?

"2006 Corolla 2.0 116 C.C.  "     that seems to be a 2 ltr diesel but not sure what 116 is  ?

The questions I would ask , have you done or checked.

Have you done all the works yourself or by a garage ?

Before any of your above  works, did you have a full garage check like an MOT, where all the steering and suspension are normally well  tested ?

You say bottom joints, was that the wishbone ball joint ?

What about the track rod end joints ?

Also you can get play in the inner track rod joint,  typically feels like track rod end joint wear, but if they are sound its likely the inners, but again both those should show up by a simple wheel play test.

As you have replaced so much the rack could be the cause, though again it depends on what or who tested them for play ?

Other areas that could possibly cause the problem,  badly worn anti roll bar bushes,  some strange brake drag ,  the power steering motor failing and causing some pull ( though no idea how that motor works)   or the back end out of alignment  / worn trailing arm bushes  ( assume Toyota did a 4 wheel alignment, not just the front ?)

Seems there are Rack refurbishers on the web, but no experience of them.

 

 

 

[Colourd]

On 6/30/2018 at 5:36 PM, oldcodger said:

Hi,

Not a problem I have experienced with any car, though often heard about such problems, like some Fords used to have.

When you say wander, is it more on Motorways or just general town driving, wandering to any partic direction ?  Very sensitive to the road camber ?

"2006 Corolla 2.0 116 C.C.  "     that seems to be a 2 ltr diesel but not sure what 116 is  ?

The questions I would ask , have you done or checked.

Have you done all the works yourself or by a garage ?

Before any of your above  works, did you have a full garage check like an MOT, where all the steering and suspension are normally well  tested ?

You say bottom joints, was that the wishbone ball joint ?

What about the track rod end joints ?

Also you can get play in the inner track rod joint,  typically feels like track rod end joint wear, but if they are sound its likely the inners, but again both those should show up by a simple wheel play test.

As you have replaced so much the rack could be the cause, though again it depends on what or who tested them for play ?

Other areas that could possibly cause the problem,  badly worn anti roll bar bushes,  some strange brake drag ,  the power steering motor failing and causing some pull ( though no idea how that motor works)   or the back end out of alignment  / worn trailing arm bushes  ( assume Toyota did a 4 wheel alignment, not just the front ?)

Seems there are Rack refurbishers on the web, but no experience of them.

 

 

 

Thanks you for your reply sir

Very interesting and helpful, thank you - i would've been back sooner but I haven't received notification of your reply, which I thought I had set up on my user CP ??

I did most of the replacements, my mechanic did a few other things and Toyota did the 4 wheel alignment and new all new lyres very recently

Some parts i mentioned were changed a year or so ago but the car has hardly been anywhere, maybe 1500 miles or so

Anyway, lately after trying to find anyone with similar experiences, I think I may have possibly diagnosed this - chassis flex

I thunk I need a Strut brace - front upper, maybe lower too, but as mine is a Diesel, not a simple solution - need to find one that fits, without too much fuss

Help lol

[Colourd]

Very sensitive to the road camber  ?

Yes and if its a more worn road, uneven road, it can feel like the two fronts are doing different things

"2006 Corolla 2.0 116 C.C.  "     that seems to be a 2 ltr diesel but not sure what 116 is  ?

Yes, there are so many abbreviations used for these cars. its a 2006 Corolla 2.0 D4D Diesel 116 bhp 5 dr

C.C - Colour Collection

Yes wishbones and wishbone ball joints

The only front end things still untouched I can think of are NS wheel bearing - still seems good and anti-roll bar bushes,

I have got rear discs to renew as one seems warped, which is weird but they weren't fitted by me

I hope the steering motor isn't failing, everything Toyota is so expensive

Back end seems ok so far

I think its at least partly due to chassis flex, strut brace needed, another can f worms 😞

Help

[Colourd]

OK, back to  the previous situation

After being out n another drive, I now think its not so much chassis flex, but, a so far undiagnosed problem somewhere between the steering wheel and the rack

Feels crap and I have to say, its spoiling a good car  😣😭 after all my attempts to get it right, its really getting me down now

What really surprises me is, I cant seem to find anyone's reports of a similar issue

[DeTomato]

Check the movement on the inner steering arm towards the wheels on both sides. Get a bar or lever in there and see if there is excess movement. If you're hearing a clonking at all when driving over speed bumps then this will also indicate it is one of these arms loose or worn.

[Colourd]

Thanks

i think you mean the track rods, ones new the other is good

I wish there was obvious play somewhere / anywhere, then I could put it right, but, not found such so far

Suggestions welcome you never know

My car is making a weird creaking type noise sometimes, lately, I hope its not the steering motor ? it does it stationary and sometimes on the move

I am hoping its the intense heat / weather causing that noise, unless anyone knows otherwise ?

[oldcodger]

Hi,

Since you have had the car, 3 years,   and it has always given some concern over the steering I would question if its been in an accident and the chassis damaged ?

Anything known about its real history ?

Assuming your mileage is reasonable, have you found your tyres showing signs of uneven wear, suggesting somethings out of alignment.

That said if Toyota did a full 4 wheel alignment I would have expected them to have found such signs ...?

Also assume all your works were done before you had the alignment checked as many of the jobs you have done can affect alignment.

When doing suspension, steering and brakes always best to do things in axle pairs.

[Colourd]

12 hours ago, oldcodger said:

Hi,

Since you have had the car, 3 years,   and it has always given some concern over the steering I would question if its been in an accident and the chassis damaged ?

Anything known about its real history ?

Assuming your mileage is reasonable, have you found your tyres showing signs of uneven wear, suggesting somethings out of alignment.

That said if Toyota did a full 4 wheel alignment I would have expected them to have found such signs ...?

Also assume all your works were done before you had the alignment checked as many of the jobs you have done can affect alignment.

When doing suspension, steering and brakes always best to do things in axle pairs.

Hello

I have also had that thought, it was HPI''d, and i have yet to find any evidence of damage or over spray etc

Mileage is reasonable, cant say Ive noticed odd tyre wear in its time with me

Yes, Toyota did it and have not found anything obvious and they do try to in the hope that might be able to sell something lol

Yes, all works done before alignment

Agreed, all axle paired, wouldn't do just one side

Ok, my latest thought is possible rack movement - mounting bushes ? steering shaft u/j (no actual free play felt ) and or rack to shaft play - worn bush ?

[oldcodger]

Hi,

Ah, you said above you only replaced one track rod end, false economy not to replace both.

Do you know if Toyota did a 2 or 4 wheel  alignment ? and if you asked them to check all the suspension and steering joints ?

Any of the joints you have just mentioned could cause wandering, but a movement test by a good mechanic should readily feel any play.

Think I would first find a different garage and ask them to do a full check on all the joints etc, should not cost that much, just like a partial mot, but if they are told of your problem they should be able to really find any small play.

If that was ok, think I would look out for a specialist alignment center, not the typical high street ones, and get a second 4 wheel alignment done to be sure everythings  ok,  as with all such tests its down to the operator on the day and if their equipment is set up and used correctly.

Just continuing to  put parts on as you have been doing does not seem the best route.

 

[Colourd]

Hello

Ahh no i as the track rod, not the rod end. One side was done there yes

Quote = Think I would first find a different garage and ask them to do a full check on all the joints etc, should not cost that much, just like a partial mot, but if they are told of your problem they should be able to really find any small play.

Not that easy around here, i wish it was

Quote -

If that was ok, think I would look out for a specialist alignment center, not the typical high street ones, and get a second 4 wheel alignment done to be sure everythings  ok,  as with all such tests its down to the operator on the day and if their equipment is set up and used correctly.

Just continuing to  put parts on as you have been doing does not seem the best route

Agreed, have thought similar, trouble there is the good place I knew has changed hands, since last used, so unkown

Even weirder thing today - I did  a trip today about 50 miles and it pretty much behaved itself, and felt good, it deffo  has mood swings, this thing

 

[DeTomato]

I was thinking about the Control Arm joint; couldn't remember what it was called the other day. It's unlikely to be the track rods, unless they pushed new rubbers into already worn metal. But best way to see is to jack the car up on each side completely stable on an axle stand, get a bar as leverage and see what is moving excessively.

[Colourd]

8 hours ago, DeTomato said:

I was thinking about the Control Arm joint; couldn't remember what it was called the other day. It's unlikely to be the track rods, unless they pushed new rubbers into already worn metal. But best way to see is to jack the car up on each side completely stable on an axle stand, get a bar as leverage and see what is moving excessively.

Umm, you lost me on that

Control arm joint ? which one is that ? do you mean the lower arm joint ?

"unless they pushed new rubbers into already worn metal ??"need that explaining further

[Lorc88]

Have you made sure your steering wheel is straight along with the wheels? I once had a Seat Inca and had a similar problem, when the steering wheel was in position for straight ahead the wheels were slightly turned right, like yourself I changed all bushes, anti roll bars tyres brakes d whole lot only for it to be that the steering wheel wasn't aligned correctly with the wheels

[Colourd]

Far as i know the steering wheel has never been off

Well, what can I say, Toyota did the alignment - recently, weird thing is, it does seems to vary

Not driven for a few days so, will check all tyre pressures tomorrow and test drive

[oldcodger]

2 hours ago, Colourd said:

Far as i know the steering wheel has never been off

Well, what can I say, Toyota did the alignment - recently, weird thing is, it does seems to vary

Not driven for a few days so, will check all tyre pressures tomorrow and test drive

Any garage doing an alignment / tracking should start off by centering the steering wheel.

So Lorc88s valid point should not come into play as you have had a proper alignment , unless you have lost alignment because you have changed or undone any suspension or steering part since  ?

What he really means is that when you are driving straight ahead, are the steering wheel  spokes  and its  center   even / horizontal in front of you.  

Typically a bad knock  to the wheels/steering can result in  the steering wheel  being off center.

[Colourd]

They should so , what happened there / i dont know

Steering alignment was done last nothing touched or knocked etc since

[Bea204]

Hi Colourd, Have you found a solution to this thread as i am the exact same issues uneven roads, lower speeds, not on high speeds or speed bumps had someone look at mine today and it looks like it is the steering rack or the steering rack joints not easy to get to or cheap apparently , so came here looking for help. my car is the same model and year d4d sr 2.0 

[Colourd]

After I replaced all shocks and rear springs, all new tyres, then steering alignment, it is much improved

So far so good

Sorry for ate reply not been here for a while and do not get any / cant see how to get emails about replies etc

[Bea204]

Did yours knock when you rocked steering it’s driving me nuts and feels so unsafe 

[oldcodger]

1 hour ago, Bea204 said:

Did yours knock when you rocked steering it’s driving me nuts and feels so unsafe 

Who was it that tested your steering, an experienced mechanic ?

Has you car been though a MOT since you noticed the wandering /knocking sounds ? - any advisories ?

If you have such noises and wandering etc you really need a proper examination of all your steering and suspension.

On the steering side if its the track rod ends thats a relatively simple /cheap job to have done,  otherwise most other faults are likely within the steering rack, expensive new,  though there are companies who sell refurbished ones, again a good garage should help/ advise you there.

As said, before worrying about the  What Ifs, get it properly checked out, most garages will do that for a small fee (or even free ) while you wait.

Excessive knocking / play in the steering will probably cause a mot failure, so best to sort it before then.

[Bea204]

I’ve had4 mechanics go over everything and what they found has been replaced,  the last one said everything is mint but could possivly be steering  rack, it’s harder being a woman taking them to the garage as you get fobbed off and conned.  But when driving if you go down country roads it’s like it’s shimmying all over road 

[oldcodger]

17 minutes ago, Bea204 said:

I’ve had4 mechanics go over everything and what they found has been replaced,  the last one said everything is mint but could possivly be steering  rack, it’s harder being a woman taking them to the garage as you get fobbed off and conned.  But when driving if you go down country roads it’s like it’s shimmying all over road 

Well theres your problem only 4 mechanics !

Though seriously I know what you mean as I'm now part of the invisible old brigade and also seem to have that "here comes another sucker" type of face.

I'm fortuate that I can still do most of my own repairs, but a good tip when it comes to avoid being ripped off at MOT time is to use your local councils MOT center, where they can only test the car, they cannot do any repairs or recommend any garage, just a good unbiased test. you have to pay the standard mot test price of £54 but you usually save that many times over by avoiding parts not really needed.

It would be interesting to know what parts they have replaced to date; my concern is that a good mechanic should be able to detect any serious play in the steering rack.

On my old Avensis, the mot tester showed me some play in the racks inner tie rod joint, yet the car drove and steered fine without any noises, so find it hard to believe they cannot locate a problem when you can hear such a knock.

 

[Colourd]

On 11/24/2018 at 3:45 PM, Bea204 said:

I’ve had4 mechanics go over everything and what they found has been replaced,  the last one said everything is mint but could possivly be steering  rack, it’s harder being a woman taking them to the garage as you get fobbed off and conned.  But when driving if you go down country roads it’s like it’s shimmying all over road 

Nightmare I'm sure

Could possibly be the track rods, if you don't know, that's what the track rod ends attach to

I guess your track rods ends have been done, as they can give a rattle noise, but, over rough ground usually

If it is the rack, that will be very expensive, genuine rack alone is at least £1000 + fitting and other parts

So Barbara, it may be time to trade it in

[Bea204]

It was mot 4 days before I bought it I’ve only had it 3 months, track rod ends all good springs good top mounts good just bit lost