Driving experiense, Corolla HSD vs Auris HSD

[nielshm]

Has anyone sold their Auris HSD and got the new Corolla instead? 3 years ago I didnt like the Auris HSD, to many revs, to little Battery assistance. 

Now I have tried the Corolla 1.8, only for a short drive, but I find that things has improved a lot. I didnt get a chance to try it out on the motorway, but normal city driving and country roads up to 60 mph, seems very easy to handle. Now, this was only a short drive, so maybe some one will share their own experienses? 

[Sidrat]

Just swapped my Auris TS 1.8 for a Corolla TS 1.8, really like the Corolla and differences between the transmission.  In the Auris it would do a maximum of about 45 mph on electric, in the Corolla at the weekend I had 60mph on just electric.  MPG is also better in the Corolla.

[bewA]

On 6/19/2019 at 7:05 AM, Sidrat said:

Just swapped my Auris TS 1.8 for a Corolla TS 1.8, really like the Corolla and differences between the transmission.  In the Auris it would do a maximum of about 45 mph on electric, in the Corolla at the weekend I had 60mph on just electric.  MPG is also better in the Corolla.

I thought only the 2ltr Hybrid Corolla could do up to 70mph in EV mode?

[Sidrat]

12 minutes ago, bewA said:

I thought only the 2ltr Hybrid Corolla could do up to 70mph in EV mode?

Don't know about the 2.0, I have the 1.8, will be filling up within a few days and will have what the actual MPG is!

[bewA]

4 minutes ago, Sidrat said:

Don't know about the 2.0, I have the 1.8, will be filling up within a few days and will have what the actual MPG is!

ohh i've just realised you meant to say MPG and not MPH! 🙂  that's where i got confused and almost more excited for my delivery! 🙂

[Sidrat]

26 minutes ago, bewA said:

ohh i've just realised you meant to say MPG and not MPH! 🙂  that's where i got confused and almost more excited for my delivery! 🙂

No I was on the A1 on a flat section doing 70 MPH, the traffic slowed to 60 MPH and it switched to electric only mode and we maintained that speed on electric for about a mile until the speed increased then the engine cut in again.  As I said in my Auris I had only had a maximum of about 45 MPH in a similar situation.

[AndrueC]

3 hours ago, bewA said:

I thought only the 2ltr Hybrid Corolla could do up to 70mph in EV mode?

I've had my 1.8 switch the ICE off at 74 mph going down Rhuallt Hill on the A55.  It also comes on now and again for half a minute at 60 mph (my more typical motorway cruising speed) and is easy to persuade into electric mode at 50mph.

I've had it report 70 mpg after a 180 mile drive to North Wales (almost entirely 60 mph). After a bit of local running up there it had dropped to 64 mpg but when I filled up it turned out to actually be 56 mpg. I've driven over 3,000 miles on it so far and have never known it do better than 58 mpg when properly measured pump to pump and worked out with a calculator. On my commute it's display isn't too far off but there was something very odd about the figure it gave for my first long drive.

[bewA]

15 minutes ago, AndrueC said:

I've had my 1.8 switch the ICE off at 74 mph going down Rhuallt Hill on the A55.  It also comes on now and again for half a minute at 60 mph (my more typical motorway cruising speed) and is easy to persuade into electric mode at 50mph.

I've had it report 70 mpg after a 180 mile drive to North Wales (almost entirely 60 mph). After a bit of local running up there it had dropped to 64 mpg but when I filled up it turned out to actually be 56 mpg. I've driven over 3,000 miles on it so far and have never known it do better than 58 mpg when properly measured pump to pump and worked out with a calculator. On my commute it's display isn't too far off but there was something very odd about the figure it gave for my first long drive.

Ok that's very cool.

So what speed does the ev switch over to petrol going from 0 if you are accelerating gently?

Because I can't see anywhere in the manual that says and I'm still waiting on a confirmed date for my delivery, it's taking forever and it's only been a week since I ordered!!

 

Also sorry OP for hijacking! 😲

[AndrueC]

27 minutes ago, bewA said:

So what speed does the ev switch over to petrol going from 0 if you are accelerating gently?

I've managed to get to 40 mph from a standstill but I had to be very gentle with the accelerator. There's no way you could do it with traffic behind, you'd get lynched. But it's not the best way to use the Battery. It's actually better to accelerate briskly using just the ICE then use the electric motor to maintain speed.

All of the energy in the Battery came from burning fuel one way or another and there are losses in the recovery/storage/and retrieval of that energy. As a result electric power is not 'free motoring'. The electric part is best seen as an assist, not a primary power source.

And, as ever, the most efficient way to run an ICE is at more-or-less wide open throttle. In the case of a hybrid you don't want the Battery helping so I find that between 2,000 and 3,000 rpm is ideal.

[nielshm]

But do you feel the accelerationen less 'revvy' than with the Auris. Is it easier to get up to 50/60 mph, or overtaking a car on the motorway, without revs running wild? 

Motorway driving was one of the main reasons why I didnt choose a Auris HSD. But if Battery power has improved, maybe revs are better controlled? 

[Chattacks]

51 minutes ago, nielshm said:

But do you feel the accelerationen less 'revvy' than with the Auris. Is it easier to get up to 50/60 mph, or overtaking a car on the motorway, without revs running wild? 

Motorway driving was one of the main reasons why I didnt choose a Auris HSD. But if battery power has improved, maybe revs are better controlled? 

I cant speak from Auris vs Corolla but I had a F30 BMW 320D auto before this and when driving the Corolla on the motorway I dont get any rev jumps or loud revving. In fact after owning this car I feel every journalist who complains about the CVT being bad or poor is either being paid to say that, doesnt do their own reviews or is a complete idiot.

 

Coming from a BWM the Corolla (mines on 16 inch wheels) is a very nice place to be whether its city or motorway driving. Nice and refined. If there was any complaint it would be that the side windows were thicker/acoustic. I can hear more of other cars and traffic than my own engine or tyres!

[AndrueC]

I've never understood the concern about high RPMs. My previous cars have all been Honda Jazz' with CVT boxes and some people used to object to high RPMs then as well (and may be why that car has a reputation for being slow if drivers are scared of it).

Car manufacturers mark the point on the rev counter where damage will occur and modern engines won't let you push the engine into it anyway. If you've paid for a car on the basis of its power then rev it! The beauty of a CVT in particular is that if you signal that you want power it will ensure that the engine is always running at the best RPMs for that task. Just as when you're being sensible it ensures that the engine is running at the most efficient RPMs.

With modern sound-proofing the engines never sound raucous and I've never yet heard a CVT that 'whines'. And as for the 'elastic band' feeling that's what you want to hear and feel. Every time you feel a pause in acceleration and hear a drop in RPMs as a traditional gearbox changes down that's a bad thing. What you want to hear from an ICE and a good gear box as you accelerate is initially high RPMs with a gradual rise to max RPMs. That shows that the ICE is delivering all available power continuously without hesitation.

[TonyHSD]

1.8 eCVT it’s actually a power split device like Prius 4 and 3 , nothing like a standard cvt transmission on other make and models. The 2.0 hybrid it’s more interesting that has actual first gear and a belt driven cvt pulleys, so only here we can call of transmission the rest of Toyota hybrids has only a drive trains : ice + em coupled together through power split device (planetary gear) . 

[AndrueC]

On 6/21/2019 at 6:42 PM, TonyHSD said:

1.8 eCVT it’s actually a power split device like Prius 4 and 3 , nothing like a standard cvt transmission on other make and models. The 2.0 hybrid it’s more interesting that has actual first gear and a belt driven cvt pulleys, so only here we can call of transmission the rest of Toyota hybrids has only a drive trains : ice + em coupled together through power split device (planetary gear) . 

Yes, I was aware of the nature of Toyota's HSD:

http://eahart.com/prius/psd/

I wasn't aware that the 2.0 had a more traditional CVT rather than the planetary gears. Have Toyota ever explained why? Belt CVTs have historically had issues with higher power (mostly solved now with segmented steel belts that are pushed rather than pulled). It seems odd that they'd move from gears to a belt system on the higher powered drive train.

 

[Heidfirst]

On 6/21/2019 at 6:42 PM, TonyHSD said:

1.8 eCVT it’s actually a power split device like Prius 4 and 3 , nothing like a standard cvt transmission on other make and models. The 2.0 hybrid it’s more interesting that has actual first gear and a belt driven cvt pulleys, so only here we can call of transmission the rest of Toyota hybrids has only a drive trains : ice + em coupled together through power split device (planetary gear) . 

Are you sure that the hybrid gets that (the 2.0 ICE only Corolla automatic does in the USA but that isn't offered for sale in the UK at least)? This video doesn't appear to show that.

My car is in for a service this week so hopefully I can get a good look at both the new Corolla & RAV4 whilst I wait  for it being done. If I remember I'll ask about the 2.0 hybrid's transmission.

[TonyHSD]

Well if that video is correct than I may misunderstood the info I had from before or the info was incorrect, I think I got it from an auto journalist and they are famous for spreading wrong info about cars. Haven’t been to Toyota dealer myself to ask someone there either. There is no a lot of information at present about the 2.0 hybrid but hopefully it does not have traditional cvt but the reliable power split device. I am kinda happy to talk about those two options here, because I think this question is the most relevant when choosing a new Corolla. 

Thank you for the video and I hope more members will get involved with any info anyone has. 

Cheers 

[Devon Aygo]

4 hours ago, TonyHSD said:

Well if that video is correct than I may misunderstood the info I had from before or the info was incorrect, I think I got it from an auto journalist and they are famous for spreading wrong info about cars. Haven’t been to Toyota dealer myself to ask someone there either. There is no a lot of information at present about the 2.0 hybrid but hopefully it does not have traditional cvt but the reliable power split device. I am kinda happy to talk about those two options here, because I think this question is the most relevant when choosing a new Corolla. 

Thank you for the video and I hope more members will get involved with any info anyone has. 

Cheers 

The 2.0 Hybrid uses an e-cvt as used in other hybrid models:

A P711 hybrid vehicle transaxle is used.

Containing the motor (MG2) for driving the vehicle and generator (MG1) for generating electrical power, this transaxle uses a continuously variable transmission mechanism with a compound gear unit that achieves smooth and quiet operation.

This hybrid vehicle transaxle assembly consists primarily of a generator (MG1), motor (MG2), power split planetary gear unit, counter gear, final gear, differential gear unit and oil pump.

By utilizing a pluriaxial configuration for the generator (MG1) and the motor (MG2), the overall length of the transaxle has been shortened. A compound gear that consists of the ring gear of the power split planetary gear, counter drive gear and parking lock gear is utilized to drastically reduce size and weight. By using high accuracy machining for the gear tooth surfaces, low-loss bearings and an oil sling type lubrication mechanism, driving losses have been reduced resulting in improved fuel economy and reduced noise.

This transaxle has a 4-shaft configuration. The power split planetary gear unit, an oil pump and generator (MG1) are provided on the main shaft. The MG2 reduction gear and motor (MG2) are provided on the 2nd shaft. The counter driven gear and the final drive gear are provided on the 3rd shaft. The final driven gear and the differential gear unit are provided on the 4th shaft.

A differential pre-torque mechanism is used. Straightline stability and acceleration performance during periods of low load and low differential rotation when the vehicle is being driven normally are ensured.

Lubrication for each gear is performed via the trochoid oil pump of the main shaft and final driven gear slinging up ATF. Through the use of a lubrication structure (oil sling type lubrication method) in which the gears sling up ATF, reduction of oil pump drive loss and enhanced transmission efficiency of the powertrain system have been achieved. Also, a water-cooled type oil cooler which optimizes the flow of ATF is used to achieve high cooling performance, resulting in a high efficiency and high output powertrain.

The conventional 2.0 ( not UK market ) can be fitted with the new CVT you previously mentioned with the 1st take off gear.

[TonyHSD]

Well that was what I needed to know, obviously make sense to be but because of the auto reviewers that knows nothing made me believe that what I mentioned earlier. Great news for all 2.0 hybrids owners, so at the end we have both same or very similar drive trains in 1.8 and 2.0 as the major difference between comes from the larger ic engine. Apologies for the wrong info I shared with you and thanks for the clarification 👍

[illumin]

I'm wondering if the corolla hybrid has a constant beep when it's put into reverse as the auris hybrid does or is it just one beep?

[HSDish]

1 hour ago, illumin said:

I'm wondering if the corolla hybrid has a constant beep when it's put into reverse as the auris hybrid does or is it just one beep?

Your Toyota dealer/garage can delete that constant beep to just one. They have fixed/done that on my (former/previous car) Auris TS HSD 2014 and on my Prius+ 2016/17 and Ill ask them to fix it on my Prius PHEV 2015 

[illumin]

1 minute ago, HSDish said:

Your Toyota dealer/garage can delete that constant beep to just one. They have fixed/done that on my (former)Auris TS HSD 2014 and on my Prius+ 2016/17 and Ill as them to fix it on my Prius PHEV 2015 

Yeah I got mine switched to one beep and was wondering if it's the same in the newer model. Cheers!

[AndrueC]

The only time my Corolla beeps is when the proximity alarm goes off.

Which it does a lot when driving into my garage 🙂