2004 yaris rough idle

[Trooscotsman]

Hi been having trouble with my 1.3 yaris 2004 with a misfire when idle.....pretty changed al sensors but nothing seems to be solving the problem....then i heard that the vvti engine has some sort of cam filter that clogs up...just wondered if anyone could point me in the right direction as to where this filter is

[Madasafish]

On 6/26/2019 at 5:07 PM, Trooscotsman said:

Hi been having trouble with my 1.3 yaris 2004 with a misfire when idle.....pretty changed al sensors but nothing seems to be solving the problem....then i heard that the vvti engine has some sort of cam filter that clogs up...just wondered if anyone could point me in the right direction as to where this filter is

Check the plugs first..

[Avalon]

Take a step back... When was the fuel filter last changed? What do the plugs look like? When was the oil last changed and what grade was used?

[Terry RD400]

I have the same problem and it is driving me nuts. My 2005 Yaris 1.3 misfires on number 3 cyclinder. I service it twice yearly as I do a lot of miles (oil, oil filter, plugs and air filter). I plugged my Launch Creader VIII in and it showed the code of P0303 - Cylinder 3 misfire. I checked the plugs perfect condition still misfiring. Doubted myself and changed the plugs, same code and misfire.  Next I swapped coil packs around, same code, same misfire. I then plugged an oil good spark plug in the end of the coil pack again the cylinder head and got a good strong continuous spark. I then checked for continuity with the Battery tested on the 4 wires that go into the coil pack and all where good. Any help would be amazing as I feel taking it to a garage will just create a large bill and no answer.

[RUToyota]

A rough idle can be one of the symptoms of a MAF issue..?

[Terry RD400]

4 hours ago, RUToyota said:

A rough idle can be one of the symptoms of a MAF issue..?

Sorry, what is a MAF?

[Terry RD400]

1 minute ago, Terry RD400 said:

 

 

[stantheman1]

MAF = Mass Air Flow (sensor)

If you have correctly ruled out spark plugs and coil packs then the likely culprit could be a clogged injector or a poor electrical connection. It could also be poor compression on cylinder 3.

What does the freeze frame data show? What are the fuel trims like and what mileage has the car covered?

[Terry RD400]

14 hours ago, stantheman1 said:

MAF = Mass Air Flow (sensor)

If you have correctly ruled out spark plugs and coil packs then the likely culprit could be a clogged injector or a poor electrical connection. It could also be poor compression on cylinder 3.

What does the freeze frame data show? What are the fuel trims like and what mileage has the car covered?

Hi StanTheMan1 - Thank you for taking the time to trouble shoot this one its appreciated. Thank you to the other guys for your help too.

I am normally quite a calm person when it comes to solving problems, but this is boiling my brain. Of course I know what a Mass Air Flow Sensor is. This would effect all cylinders not just one (no. 3). Done compression test yesterday morning 1=215, 2=230, 3=230, 4=215. The day before I am ashamed to say this even though I checked all wiring back to the ECU with a basic continuity check which was good. I cut perfectly good connections, stripped them back and moved them further (6 inches down the loom) with no change in effect. What we have noticed is every morning the car starts fine and runs fine for about 10 minutes then the problem kicks in so this would possibly suggest something getting hot but I am not convinced.

I do not know how to get the freeze frame data on my scanner, sorry, its new to me. I have not ruled out the injectors as I am still thrashing about in the water trying to solve the problem. The reason for this why does it run happily for 10 minutes from cold, would not a blocked injector be blocked all the time or play up all the time (just guessing by the way). I don't have the equipment to test it either, the scanner shows no other fault except the MISFIRE ON CYLINDER 3 error. My friend has a SnapOn scanner and he said that all fuel graphs looked good. How hard is it to test and injector so I can properly rule it out. Mileage 113,000, don't hold that against it, its a good car and well driven.

My brother is saying it might be the ECU but its not hot and its nice and dry in the footwell. Keep those thoughts coming please.

[Terry RD400]

22 hours ago, RUToyota said:

A rough idle can be one of the symptoms of a MAF issue..?

Thanks RUToyota, but no rough idle. Runs like a dream and then 10 minutes into a drive drops 3 cylinder with a permanent misfire. Leave it 2 hours to cool down, then its all good again for 10 minutes and so on.

[bathtub tom]

I've experienced similar on a Mazda. Turned out to be a coil pack breaking down when it got warm. I see you've changed yours, but it could still be something electrical around that area. It may not be engine heat causing the breakdown, but also consider heat from electrical current.

[Terry RD400]

1 hour ago, bathtub tom said:

I've experienced similar on a Mazda. Turned out to be a coil pack breaking down when it got warm. I see you've changed yours, but it could still be something electrical around that area. It may not be engine heat causing the breakdown, but also consider heat from electrical current.

Thanks Bob, I'm still lost at sea. Just been out to the car trying to get information from my scanner, but to be honest, I don't know how to use half the functions. You are right about the coil packs warming up, but just threw up the same message 15 minutes ago saying Cylinder 3 Misfire, although with an old spark plug in the end of the coil pack against the head it is sparking really well. I am away for until Tuesday in a few hours (another car, helping a friend move) and will look at the injectors next as I do not know how to find the fault with the coil pack wiring as it all looks good. Short of running new wires back to the ECU directly I am lost and I hate being beat.

[stantheman1]

I am also a little confused now, you said that when you checked the spark plugs that they were in perfect condition so not wet or any fouling found, so I'm thinking fuel delivery or the lack of it but then you go on to say that after it was checked with the SnapOn and the fuel graphs looked good. So to recap, you have spark, you have fuel and you must have air at the correct ratio also, hmm!

Does the fault happen at idle or when under load?

Have your mechanic friend check out the crank sensor, firstly check that its connections are good then if he has a 'scope' and the technical knowledge, to check the waveform whilst in operation. He should be looking for missing pulses around the time when the code is set, if this is the case then I would strongly suspect the sensor as all the other culprits appear to be errant. 

EDIT:

Get your man with the SnapOn tool to see if there are any other codes set (as not all scan tools will show all codes) and get them to show you the freeze frame data and take a picture of it also record the live data showing as much info as possible and report back please.

Where's Bob (Flash22) this is just 'right up his street'!

[Terry RD400]

On 4/28/2022 at 9:06 AM, bathtub tom said:

I've experienced similar on a Mazda. Turned out to be a coil pack breaking down when it got warm. I see you've changed yours, but it could still be something electrical around that area. It may not be engine heat causing the breakdown, but also consider heat from electrical current.

Sorry for not getting back to you sooner, been helping my friend move a few counties away. I totally agree with you in regards to it might be heat from an electrical current. But I do not know how to test wires if they are breaking down when hot. 

[Terry RD400]

On 4/28/2022 at 7:23 PM, stantheman1 said:

I am also a little confused now, you said that when you checked the spark plugs that they were in perfect condition so not wet or any fouling found, so I'm thinking fuel delivery or the lack of it but then you go on to say that after it was checked with the SnapOn and the fuel graphs looked good. So to recap, you have spark, you have fuel and you must have air at the correct ratio also, hmm!

Does the fault happen at idle or when under load?

Have your mechanic friend check out the crank sensor, firstly check that its connections are good then if he has a 'scope' and the technical knowledge, to check the waveform whilst in operation. He should be looking for missing pulses around the time when the code is set, if this is the case then I would strongly suspect the sensor as all the other culprits appear to be errant. 

EDIT:

Get your man with the SnapOn tool to see if there are any other codes set (as not all scan tools will show all codes) and get them to show you the freeze frame data and take a picture of it also record the live data showing as much info as possible and report back please.

Where's Bob (Flash22) this is just 'right up his street'!

Sorry for not getting back to you sooner, been helping my friend (mechanic guy with SnapOn diagnostics kit) has moved a few counties away, so that is the end really of his help.

Recapping so I don't cloudy the water even more from scratch. Started misfiring nearly two weeks ago.
1. Checked plugs all looked in good condition.
2. Run diagnostics using Launch Creader VIII. The one and only fault from then to now is a misfire on 3.
3. Thinking plugs good, change coil pack - Result same misfire.
4. After getting same fault code with new coil pack, I thought although the plug looked good change them.
5. Changed all plugs - Result same misfire.
6. My friend steps in with his SnapOn Diagnostics, he showed me graphs which I did not understand but everything was good fuel, air, etc - Result same misfire.
7. Checked continuity from all wires of coil pack back to ECU and all where ok, but this was without the engine running.

Because I am on my own now I have only you guys input to help me through this. This morning I am about to swap the injectors around and do my best to clean up check the crank case sensor. Do you know if my Launch OBD reader has the ability to check the wave form as you suggest? I also think I have worked out how to record some live data. I will record 5 minutes worth and try and upload it. Thanks again in advance for your advice and help. In case I did not say when I start the car it takes between 7-8 minutes before it drops a cylinder, I can almost get to town with it running happy.

[Terry RD400]

2 minutes ago, Terry RD400 said:

Sorry for not getting back to you sooner, been helping my friend (mechanic guy with SnapOn diagnostics kit) has moved a few counties away, so that is the end really of his help.

Recapping so I don't cloudy the water even more from scratch. Started misfiring nearly two weeks ago.
1. Checked plugs all looked in good condition.
2. Run diagnostics using Launch Creader VIII. The one and only fault from then to now is a misfire on 3.
3. Thinking plugs good, change coil pack - Result same misfire.
4. After getting same fault code with new coil pack, I thought although the plug looked good change them.
5. Changed all plugs - Result same misfire.
6. My friend steps in with his SnapOn Diagnostics, he showed me graphs which I did not understand but everything was good fuel, air, etc - Result same misfire.
7. Checked continuity from all wires of coil pack back to ECU and all where ok, but this was without the engine running.

Because I am on my own now I have only you guys input to help me through this. This morning I am about to swap the injectors around and do my best to clean up check the crank case sensor. Do you know if my Launch OBD reader has the ability to check the wave form as you suggest? I also think I have worked out how to record some live data. I will record 5 minutes worth and try and upload it. Thanks again in advance for your advice and help. In case I did not say when I start the car it takes between 7-8 minutes before it drops a cylinder, I can almost get to town with it running happy.

Just watched a video on the location of the crankcase sensor and realised my mechanic friend removed it and showed it to me saying it was in good condition. There was no build up on it whatsoever (no black, whole unit inside looked like new) and the terminals visually looked good.

[bathtub tom]

I had a crank position sensor go faulty and it threw up the relevant code. The cam position sensor is the same part number, so I swapped them over. The fault code then showed a faulty cam position sensor. So I doubt if it's a cam or crank sensor causing a code on only one cylinder. This may not point you in the right direction, but may help to avoid going down blind alleys.

[Terry RD400]

5 hours ago, bathtub tom said:

I had a crank position sensor go faulty and it threw up the relevant code. The cam position sensor is the same part number, so I swapped them over. The fault code then showed a faulty cam position sensor. So I doubt if it's a cam or crank sensor causing a code on only one cylinder. This may not point you in the right direction, but may help to avoid going down blind alleys.

Thank you.

[Terry RD400]

6 hours ago, Terry RD400 said:

Sorry for not getting back to you sooner, been helping my friend (mechanic guy with SnapOn diagnostics kit) has moved a few counties away, so that is the end really of his help.

Recapping so I don't cloudy the water even more from scratch. Started misfiring nearly two weeks ago.
1. Checked plugs all looked in good condition.
2. Run diagnostics using Launch Creader VIII. The one and only fault from then to now is a misfire on 3.
3. Thinking plugs good, change coil pack - Result same misfire.
4. After getting same fault code with new coil pack, I thought although the plug looked good change them.
5. Changed all plugs - Result same misfire.
6. My friend steps in with his SnapOn Diagnostics, he showed me graphs which I did not understand but everything was good fuel, air, etc - Result same misfire.
7. Checked continuity from all wires of coil pack back to ECU and all where ok, but this was without the engine running.

Because I am on my own now I have only you guys input to help me through this. This morning I am about to swap the injectors around and do my best to clean up check the crank case sensor. Do you know if my Launch OBD reader has the ability to check the wave form as you suggest? I also think I have worked out how to record some live data. I will record 5 minutes worth and try and upload it. Thanks again in advance for your advice and help. In case I did not say when I start the car it takes between 7-8 minutes before it drops a cylinder, I can almost get to town with it running happy.

Any tips on how to reseal disturbed injectors?

[stantheman1]

Whenever you remove the injectors you always have to replace the 'o' rings.

You can purchase them from the dealers for approx. £3 each.

[corradovr6]

i may have missed this, but did you swop the coilpacks around at all?  Eg swop coilpack 3 with 1 and take it for a drive and see if you still get the fault on 3 or on 1.  If its still 3 then the fault is not the coilpack its further upstream. 

Also when you checked continuity of the harness did you shake the individual wires per loom of the harness? 

Are the connections to the ecu all clean and making good contact? Can you make up a connector and pulse each injector with direct power and see if its opening properly?  Just wondering if the injector on 3 is clogged?

I salute your patience at sticking with it, hopefully a solution is not far away

 

[Terry RD400]

20 hours ago, stantheman1 said:

Whenever you remove the injectors you always have to replace the 'o' rings.

You can purchase them from the dealers for approx. £3 each.

Hi Stan, o-rings replaced b

 

16 hours ago, corradovr6 said:

i may have missed this, but did you swop the coilpacks around at all?  Eg swop coilpack 3 with 1 and take it for a drive and see if you still get the fault on 3 or on 1.  If its still 3 then the fault is not the coilpack its further upstream. 

Also when you checked continuity of the harness did you shake the individual wires per loom of the harness? 

Are the connections to the ecu all clean and making good contact? Can you make up a connector and pulse each injector with direct power and see if its opening properly?  Just wondering if the injector on 3 is clogged?

I salute your patience at sticking with it, hopefully a solution is not far away

 

Hi, thank you for your help. Have tried swapping coil packs and no change, put new spark plugs in even though they where all good. Done a continuity check back to the ECU which was good, but did not shake the loom at the same time, forgot to be honest and if I had remembered I did not have another hand to do this, lol. In the footwell and under the bonnet impossible for me. I am a little peeved at myself as I have forgotten which injector was number 3 and not 100% certain if I have put it back after replacing top and bottom o-rings on all four. The car is back together as of 5 minutes ago. I am going out with my camera to try and video some live data (I have no idea what I am doing in this area). I have a Launch Creader VIII and no manual for it. So if you know how to check the ECU please let me know. Just to bring you up to speed I normally get between 7-8 minutes before the misfire comes back. So I will be timing it.

[Terry RD400]

Just now, Terry RD400 said:

Hi Stan, o-rings replaced b

 

Hi, thank you for your help. Have tried swapping coil packs and no change, put new spark plugs in even though they where all good. Done a continuity check back to the ECU which was good, but did not shake the loom at the same time, forgot to be honest and if I had remembered I did not have another hand to do this, lol. In the footwell and under the bonnet impossible for me. I am a little peeved at myself as I have forgotten which injector was number 3 and not 100% certain if I have put it back after replacing top and bottom o-rings on all four. The car is back together as of 5 minutes ago. I am going out with my camera to try and video some live data (I have no idea what I am doing in this area). I have a Launch Creader VIII and no manual for it. So if you know how to check the ECU please let me know. Just to bring you up to speed I normally get between 7-8 minutes before the misfire comes back. So I will be timing it.

both top and bottom. Car running as normal, not certain if I put injector 3 back into the same port as I muddled up what injector came from were after fitting o-rings. About to start the car with the timer and take some live data, but I don't know what I am looking at. I am starting to think it might be the ECU!

[Terry RD400]

On 5/5/2022 at 2:56 PM, Terry RD400 said:

both top and bottom. Car running as normal, not certain if I put injector 3 back into the same port as I muddled up what injector came from were after fitting o-rings. About to start the car with the timer and take some live data, but I don't know what I am looking at. I am starting to think it might be the ECU!

Got an error message of P0100 - MAF. Just ordered a can of cleaner. I'm not convinced this is the problem though, but I would love to be wrong. I would expect this problem to effect all cylinders not just one.

[corradovr6]

How is it running at present?  Hopefully it has been solved but if not, any chance of swopping the injectors over to replicate the issue? 

With P0100, if you delete, run the car and rescan does it come back?  Might be worth spraying the connector with contact cleaner first as well as giving the MAF a good blast.  Leave to dry properly and then reinstall.