Noise on cold start

[frankie406]

Hi folks been on before regarding this problem. The 2010 auris 1.33 vvti still makes a wild sound on start up only when cold. Sounds like the chain to me. Looked online for location of the timing chain tensioner but cant find 1 for this engine.the others have the timing tensioner on the side of engine and 2 bolts looks easy to do but cant find it on this car... any ideas or pics would be great thanks!

[Mooly]

Is it anything like this... current Yaris thread, same engine:

 

 

[frankie406]

Yes..starts like an old tractor... any remedy?

[frankie406]

14 minutes ago, Mooly said:

Is it anything like this... current Yaris thread, same engine:

 

 

I dont think its the tappets as you said in the other post, when the bonnet is open and plastic cover removed it sounds at the top left hand side of the engine and sounds like a chain slipping. Need to know is the tensioner for the chain inside the timing cover unlike the others ive watched online?

[Mooly]

I would have thought a slipping chain would be destructive, a bit like like a cam belt jumping a few teeth. I suppose a noisy chain/tensioner is a possibility if you can locate the sound to that area, although I've no idea how big a job it is on this engine.  

 

 

[frankie406]

Yeah thinking the tensioner but ive no idea if its inside the case or can it be got at elsewhere. As i say in other toyota videos 2 bolts and it comes out.

[furtula]

This only started with warmer weather, and on first start of the day? If the car sits 5-6 hours and you start it later the same day, is the sound present?

Tensioner should be spring loaded so if it was at fault, it would be there constantly

You can find some schematics on the engine https://toyota-club.net/files/faq/13-01-01_faq_nr-engine_eng.htm

[frankie406]

Started a while back when i stupidly used non Toyota parts and oil..long story,but yes 1st thing when it sits for a while. 

[furtula]

So you used non OEM oil filter when changing the oil, and it all started?

Had this discussion multiple times, supposedly if you use non OEM oil filter, the oil does not drain down to the bottom of the pan so quickly, so the top still stays lubricated.

With the warmer weather and non OEM filter, the oil escapes the top of the engine and is not so well lubricated on starts, which is what is causing your sound.

Now it's a bit weird, but people here who used non OEM and OEM claim it to be so, i personally had no experience and i got 3rd party filters fitted.

I have the same, but the sound is not really that rough, and goes away after a second or two once the oil gets circulated.

[yossarian247]

Does the 1.33 engine use a disposable metal cannister oil filter or the replaceable paper element type? I think the early Auris had the metal type, then they switched to paper elements later which my 2009 1.6 has.

I have certainly known cheap brands of metal cannister oil filters to have faulty non-return valves which cause rattling on start up. However this should not be an issue on the paper element type as the non-return valve is not part of the filter you replace during a service.

[frankie406]

20 minutes ago, furtula said:

So you used non OEM oil filter when changing the oil, and it all started?

Had this discussion multiple times, supposedly if you use non OEM oil filter, the oil does not drain down to the bottom of the pan so quickly, so the top still stays lubricated.

With the warmer weather and non OEM filter, the oil escapes the top of the engine and is not so well lubricated on starts, which is what is causing your sound.

Now it's a bit weird, but people here who used non OEM and OEM claim it to be so, i personally had no experience and i got 3rd party filters fitted.

I have the same, but the sound is not really that rough, and goes away after a second or two once the oil gets circulated.

Yes i normally use genuine parts and oil only..i would service the car and put in a cheap filter and oil for a day or 2 then replace with genuine oil and filter ive always done this with all my cars. But this time i was away with work and forgot to do it and this happened. Coincidence?

[frankie406]

12 minutes ago, yossarian247 said:

Does the 1.33 engine use a disposable metal cannister oil filter or the replaceable paper element type? I think the early Auris had the metal type, then they switched to paper elements later which my 2009 1.6 has.

I have certainly known cheap brands of metal cannister oil filters to have faulty non-return valves which cause rattling on start up. However this should not be an issue on the paper element type as the non-return valve is not part of the filter you replace during a service.

Yes its  a paper element. Its just strange its happened with the cheap oil and filter change.

[yossarian247]

7 minutes ago, frankie406 said:

Yes its  a paper element. Its just strange its happened with the cheap oil and filter change.

I don't think it can be related to your choice of filter then.  This type of filter uses a spring loaded mechanism inside the plastic housing which I think is what acts as the non-return valve. This is permanently fixed inside the housing so isn't replaced each time the filter is changed. The paper element which is changed during a service is purely a filter on these so it shouldn't have an appreciable effect on oil draining back to the sump, or start up noise.

For what it's worth, my Auris has been run on nothing but non-OEM oil and filters since it was around a year old and doesn't appear to have suffered because of it.

[frankie406]

4 minutes ago, yossarian247 said:

I don't think it can be related to your choice of filter then.  This type of filter uses a spring loaded mechanism inside the plastic housing which I think is what acts as the non-return valve. This is permanently fixed inside the housing so isn't replaced each time the filter is changed. The paper element which is changed during a service is purely a filter on these so it shouldn't have an appreciable effect on oil draining back to the sump, or start up noise.

For what it's worth, my Auris has been run on nothing but non-OEM oil and filters since it was around a year old and doesn't appear to have suffered because of it.

Thanks.... but it does seem strange that this has happened as soon as i left this oil and filter in,but again i cant say its that. Have you any idea where the timing tensioner is on this engine,is it inside the timing casing or can it be changed externally like other Toyota engines ive seen.

[furtula]

You can go to http://japan-parts.eu  and enter your VIN, then find the tensioner part number, it should show you where in the engine it's located.

[AisinW]

Cold start rattling is usually from Vvti sprockets worn out. It may be only 1-2  second rattle and still runs for another 100 or 300 k miles.  Annoying but harmless. If it eventually needs replacement,you will get check engine lights from vvti system. 

[DaddyBaddy]

What spec / viscosity of oil are you using?